- Roki Sasaki still debating who to sign with - rumors were he was to decide on the 16th but he hasn't yet. Saw online Glasnow saying Sasaki really liked Toronto (and really liked LA). Lord knows what is going to happen.
- Alex Bregman - lots of sites still keep putting him with the Jays but it doesn't look likely - he wants crazy years and dollars, Jays learned an expensive lesson with Springer on doing that (hopefully)
- Anthony Santander - the guy seems to be limited but doesn't want to sign here. Few rumors of others chasing him, but firm reports on the Jays offering a contract and his immediately after that saying he'll take a short term deal. Sigh.
- Pete Alonso - latest is the Jays putting him at 1B with Vlad at 3B. Mets appear out of the running after offering him a few options that he didn't like.
- Jack Flaherty - seems he isn't getting much traction this winter. Not sure why, his fastball velocity has been nearly identical the past 3 years, but his HR/fly ball has gotten worse, GB% got a bit worse last year but within reasonable range, his K/9 was over 10 (highest since 2020), BB/9 2.11 (lowest ever). Unless there is an injury I don't see why he is still on the market. Should Sasaki stay out west he'd be a good one for the Jays to chase down imo.
- Jurickson Profar - looks like a very good fit in LF if Santander won't come, but for 7 seasons he has alternated good/bad years making 2025 scheduled for another bad one - weird luck or something else?
- 2025 ZiPS Projections are out (as others have mentioned previously) with the Jays showing as 2+ WAR (ML regular) at all but DH and RF. No idea how LF gets to 2.0 with Loperfido-Schneider-Lukes sharing it, but that is what they have. Rotation has 4 at 2+ (Gausman-Berrios-Bassitt-Francis) with Rodriguez at 1.6 and Bloss 0.6 sharing the 5 hole. Again, not bad. The pen a collective 3.2 which is far better than last years negative WAR result (ugh). This team could easily surprise and is FAR better than anything the AL Central has (out of 9 regulars the ChiSox have 1 at 2 WAR (0 starters at 2, pen in the negatives), Cleveland 4, Detroit 3, Minnesota 5, KC unknown (not done yet) vs the Jays with 8. Of course, we are stuck in the AL East with Baltimore 7, Boston 8, New York Yankees 6. No report for the Rays yet.
- IFA time but the Jays won't sign anyone of note until Sasaki makes up his mind. Jays linked to a few really good ones - Crisopher Polanco (SS 45 FV, top 10 talent), Juan Sanchez (SS 40 FV), probably others too (saw some on other sites)
- Vladimir Guerrero Jr. - might be playing 3B (if Alonso signs), might be at 1B/DH otherwise. Might be signing a long term deal, might be traded to the Mets for 3+ prospects. The rumors are nutty here. All we can say for certain is the Jays offered him $340 mil and he rejected it. He will be a free agent post 2025 if he doesn't sign an extension - he gave a deadline of Spring Training day one (February 17th I think).
That really hasn't come to pass 2/3 of the way through the offseason.
Horwitz was flipped to Cleveland in a surprising salary dump trade for Gimenez that no one saw coming. But Horwitz was actually an in-house overage prospect who came up late in the spring, tore the cover off the ball for 4-6 weeks, then went stone cold like a lot of the rest of vets and new faces.
I haven't seen that much lamenting over Horwitz' loss. Likely because of so much preoccupation over the uncertainty over Vlad. And the fact that Horwitz was a league average type without a position given the hope to sign Guerrero into perpetuity.
But what of the Joey Loperfidos, the Will Wagners, the Nathan Lukes (though another internal guy), the bevy of mid-to-low Top 30 prospects that the Jays acquired.
Why haven't we seen more roster churning on the margins for a team that for all intents and purposes is all-in for Vlad and Bo's walk year?
Are the Jays playing both sides, trying to sneak into the playoffs while also hording marginal assets to retool in 2026 when both stars may be gone? Is the team too close to their budget ceiling that they can't exchange youth for pricier contracts? Are they keeping their powder dry with lots of budget room allocated for the few straggler FAs out there and Vlad's potential extension?
Is the league so unimpressed with the pool of prospects they acquired last year by purging all the walk-year veterans that the FO has been unable to convert anything but Horwitz into a 2025 MLB asset?
I wouldn’t rule out them going the trade route for pitching and using a couple of those guys acquired at the deadline last summer in a package if the Sasaki thing doesn’t work out. Addison Barger wasn’t part of that, but showed some promise in the bigs last year, he could also be used. I keep coming back to Steven Matz, whom the Jays are familiar with as a possible stopgap. He’s a free agent after next year and needs to prove himself to get another contract in the bigs last year. Ross Atkins has dealt with St Louis a lot in his tenure. It’s an injury risk but the upside is a good mid rotation starter with no commitment and wouldn’t cost much in trade.
The trade potential is more along the line of trading 2 guys for 1 to fill a position of need.
Good young starters are at a premium, so out of reach.
Horwitz would have been the DH and the thought was to upgrade there with whoever is available on the market.
For now, that's Santander.
Bregman says he's not interested in a short contract. I think the best offer he has is from Detroit but it's not as good as what he was offered by Houston. So he pouts.
Santander is willing to take a short contract with higher AAV but who wants to lose a draft pick to sign him for a single year at 25M or more?
Chapman signed for a short contract that paid him 18M in 24 and he turned that into 6 more years at 25M but he did that with a 7WAR season.
Santander's best year is 3WAR.
It seems to be like the Encarnation situation. The Jays have the best offer out and don't want to bid against themselves. So we wait.
I think it was always the Dodgers, just like with Ohtani.
But hey, at least the media is getting lots of clicks!
He's actually one of the very few position players available this offseason who i'd be happy to pay for.
Agreed. Higher ceiling and higher floor and fits the team well. Steamer has Bregman at 4.1 WAR for next season and Alonso and Santander at 2.4 WAR. It's a significant difference.
But — you never know.
Emily Dickinson: “‘Hope’ is the thing with feathers.” Blue Jays feathers, we hope.
Hearing the Blue Jays are working to acquire additional international bonus pool room as they await Roki Sasaki’s decision. Doesn’t mean a decision has been made. To be expected from all finalists for the right-hander, so they’re ready for all possibilities.
— Shi Davidi (@ShiDavidi) January 17, 2025
So it wasn't cheap to get that pool money.
$2 mil puts the Jays IFA money at $8,261,600, plus anything else they can get. Dodgers max out at $8,223,920 if they get everything they possible can. Jays can potentially get to $10,018,560. So the Jays now can bid more than the Dodgers can even without any more trades. Another trade though and the Jays can shatter the Dodgers limit. So if cash is any factor the Jays now have the advantage.
That’s a lot of money to eat up on a bad player if it’s a Hail Mary attempt.On the other hand, if the Dodgers get Sasaki, there will be a bunch of IFAs looking for a new home.
It is in increments of 250k. i.e. 250, 500, 750, etc.
It has to be in increments of 250K so 250/500/750, etc...can't be 373K or anything. This move tells me Jays think they have a shot and it's worth it to go all in for it. Straw's contract is terrible (not in a major way, just useless player for $13M) you get Sasaki, it doesn't matter at all.
A little relief I guess but contract still terrible. Go get Sasaki!
needless to say, this would be a very bad move if they don't land Roki.Cleveland is covering $3.75 million of the remaining $15.5 million owed to Myles Straw, source tells me & @ShiDavidi.
— Ben Nicholson-Smith (@bnicholsonsmith) January 17, 2025
Also worth noting: Straw's money counts towards the Blue Jays' CBT calculations regardless of whether he's on their 40-man.
For what it's worth, I've also seen that Cristopher Polanco was informed that the Jays won't be signing him and he's met with other teams. However the source is not necessarily credible. More just curious smoke than anything.
One thing the Blue Jays can do that the Dodgers can't is offer Sasaki a higher signing bonus https://t.co/N4NGunnt5g
— Brandon Wile (@Brandon_N_Wile) January 17, 2025
I'm also wondering if I've described something as indescribable, haven't I already described it? These are just some of the things I ponder on a Friday afternoon winding down a wintery work-week.
1) Does anyone know what this FO is doing? This is fair because they told us nothing.
2) No Vlad extension and no FA signings except Yimi and Hoffman. True and a fair enough complaint.
3) The trades & FA signings surprised everyone. I was not surprised by the Yimi signing. To analyze/evaluate the activities. The pen has been improved and so has the team D. But more O is definitely needed.
I am no longer concerned that these done deals have broken through the Luxury tax level. There does seem to be a plan.
The plan could be V good if R Sasaki signs with us because our pitching should be vastly improved and Bassitt can be traded without hurting the rotation. I think M Straw has good D value and hopefully has not put us above the luxury tax. The extra Int'l money helps sign Sasaki. If he does not sign then we can sign our own Int'l prospects and add LAD prospects.
In real baseball, he's a 4 WAR player who has always been surrounded by great left bats and he's a pull hitter in a ballpark with a box in left field that pull hitters can hit into.
When the Jays signed Springer he was a 6 WAR player about to turn 31.
That's the same age Bregman will be and the last time he was worth 5 WAR was in 2019.
The Jays already got 3.4 War out of clement and he's not blocking a prospect from hitting his way to third base.
Santander in LF is a 3 WAR improvement from last year. Bregman at 3B is less than 1 WAR and several years of negative value.
Spend that money on true upgrades, not "replace a player who was good with one who was better in the past, but is now older and will cost 3x as much and will only bring marginal upgrades".
I wonder if Springer is strongly advocating for Bregman?
In real baseball, he's a 4 WAR player who has always been surrounded by great left bats and he's a pull hitter in a ballpark with a box in left field that pull hitters can hit into."
He has a career 137 WRC+ at home and 132 on the road. He isn't a product of his home park. I don't think Bregman will be a superstar for years or anything but he's a much better player than Alonso or Santander.
Whereas we have a number of OF options that could potentially give us above average hitting. Heck, Clement could probably play a decent enough OF.
Steamer has Clement as 1.5 WAR and Bregman at 4 WAR. That is an upgrade of 2.5 WAR which is massive. I like Clement, Seems like a great guy but I think he is a 90-95 WRC+ with good to very good defense kind of guy. That's not a guy I want starting at 3B for a team competing. Great as a utility guy (although Jimenez certainly has more upside) but easy place for Jays to upgrade.
The previous FOs were not spending at all. This FO is going over the luxury tax.
Thanks to Boras, free agents can wait forever if they don't get what they want.
That wouldn't change with a different FO.
Vlad has always had demands in excess of his valuation.
The biggest contracts for a 1B are Freddie Freeman 6/162M and Matt Olson's 8/168M.
Christian Walker signed 3/60M with Houston. Alonso is still unsigned.
They offered Vlad over 300M but he wants close to 500M.
The Yankees missed on Soto but spread the money on improving several positions.
That's the option if the Mets want to overpay Vlad.
* Bregman 122
* Santander 119
Jays with Bregman
* 1B Guerrero 151
* 3B Bregman 122
* SS Bichette 115
* C Kirk 113
* RF Springer 106
* 2B Giminez 105
* CF Varsho 101
* DH Wagner 114 / Roden 108 / Schneider 105 / Lukes 105 / Barger 104 / Loperfido 90
* LF Roden 108 / Schneider 105 / Lukes 105 / Barger 104 / Loperfido 90
* IF Clement 97 / Jimenez 99 / Stefanic 108
Jays with Santander
* 1B Guerrero 151
* LF/DH Santander 118
* SS Bichette 115
* C Kirk 113
* RF Springer 106
* 2B Giminez 105
* CF Varsho 101
* 3B Clement 97
* DH/LF Wagner 114 / Roden 108 / Schneider 105 / Lukes 105 / Barger 104 / Loperfido 90
* IF Jimenez 99 / Stefanic 108 / Kasevich 83
So likely not as good a lineup offensively with Santander, and probably worse defensively as well.
for example, Zips had him at 95ops+ last year.
he finished at 95ops+.
Alonso projected at 125 wRC+ (Steamer), or 126 OPS+ (ZiPS). So that could work - would be a bit scary on defense but this team has more than enough 'wow' on defense to sacrifice 3B defense. Plus Clement is a near GG 3B (finalist last year) so he easily covers when needed (Berrios starting for example, or vs a RH hitting team that tends to pull a lot of ground balls).
2025 will be interesting. Sasaki or not.
Bregman just had a 118 OPS+ and Santander a 134.
Bregman is older, why would he decline less?
It seems the projection relies too much on data from before 2020.
Bregman is not going to play like he's 25.
But offensively, Clement's performance was no surprise, and it was projected.
I'm also "fine" with Clement at 3B, but it's still true that we're likely locking ourselves into a below average bat playing fulltime.
Bregman's career 135wrc+ is better than Santander's career year 129 last year. Last year is the first year in their careers when Santander has ever been the better hitter.
Definitely the people that used to work for Shapiro have intel on him and are able to force him to clean up their messes. It has nothing to do with a large market team taking advantage of a smaller market team to try to improve themselves.
2020 117 135 (OPS+)
2021 113 94
2022 133 120
2023 124 121
2024 118 134
Santander had a much better 2020.
Santander is a natural low ball hitter who eventually figured out how to hit the high fastball.
So his early numbers aren't as good.
Bregman is showing a lot of decline over his early career.
In the end, Santander is a switch hitter who plays a position of need and requires a shorter contract than Bregman.
Bregman has a good chance of ending in Boston with Devers moving to first.
I have no idea what the hell Myles Straw is good for now.
Just keep trying to creatively make the team better.
For MLB and the LAD, yes. Definitely not for the TBJ. Glad they are conducting themselves like an elite franchise when it comes to free agents.
Is it petty of me to hope Sasaki needs TJ surgery sometime this year? The Dodgers seem to have guys go down like flies all the time (3 TJ's and 2 major shoulder surgery guys right now).
This FO has gotta be feeling terrible with their rotten luck while Friedman must feel like the center of the universe.
I don't hope for injuries to the LAD but I do hope MLB or someone else discovers lots of illegal deals and money under the table and strips the Dodgers of picks and $$$.
Hopefully they can use the extra pool money to boost their IFA talent acquisition this off-season. It’s a consolation prize, but it could still have significant value to the organization.
But I will say that Sasaki was a much, much more worthwhile effort than Soto which cost the team so much leverage and was never going to succeed.
I also think it was disgraceful for Wolfe to let the Jays get to the point of a Straw trade without making intentions clearer sooner. Either you want the Dodgers or you don’t. This was a joke. And he should have known better.
Petty is not the word I'd use.
It.
And they may need a center fielder anyway while Varsho is rehabbing. Straw can fill that role and maybe there is a slight chance he can become a modestly valuable player again.
The FO has had awful luck lately. Ohtani, Soto, Sasaki, Burnes…can’t get valuable FAs to sign with them…can’t get Japanese players to sign with them…and also the relatively crappy 2025 Rule 4 draft pick they ended up with after a poor 2024 season.
Let’s hope for a Blue Jays-Dodgers 2025 World Series for some payback.
Snell
Glasnow
Ohtani
Yamamoto
Kershaw
Sasaki
That said, I have zero faith that MLB would do anything to what has become their flagship franchise. This is an organization that in its recent past, has covered up physical and sexual assaults by minor leaguers in its system, has been investigated by the US DOJ on RICO violations (human trafficking) and there has been nary a peep from MLB.
So, now what? Lots of IFA signing I'm assuming. Do the Jays do the Vlad at 3B, Alonso at 1B thing? Seems very out of character but it'd be fun. What about LF? Loperfido/Lukes/Schneider/Clase/Straw fighting it out (Straw & Lukes in CF to start 2025 until Varsho back). Straw (76) and Schneider (105) are RH, Loperfido (96) & Lukes (103) LH, Clase (85) switch. Lots of mix/match possible there (ZiPS OPS+ projection in brackets). Clase & Straw are speedsters (30+ SB ability), Lukes reasonably fast, Loperfido & Schneider average I think. Might the Jays go for Jack Flaherty or sign another top reliever? Next signing puts them into the luxury tax area (just 1 mil or so of space).
It was either malpractice or - and I would have sympathy for this - they were unprofessionally played.
I'm guessing an Alonso, Bregman or Santander deal is about to happen. Hoping Soto and Sasaki have been holding up the Jays...
If you feel this strongly against this team then why are you only posting these types of comments after they miss out on a free agent? If you don't see them able to develop young talent and see no chance for success otherwise then you're basically going to have to wait 2 years at least to see them try to redevelop young players. No sense lambasting the FO in this Roku reaction thread since it shouldn't have any effect anyways. I guess i'm wondering if you're actually just a bit down that they missed on another FA.
yep, the not-so-hidden-but-almost-always-ignored cost of premising a rebuild on sucking for years and then nickel and diming all the products of that rebuild to boot.
The last time I recall the Jays ending up with some leftover IFA signing bucks very late in the cycle with everyone else already spoken for, they ended up getting creative by going to some non-traditional markets to sign Sem Robberse. And sign Yosver Zueleta out of Cuba.
Why anyone would criticize the Dodgers or the agent escapes me.
@hgomez27
The #BlueJays had been scouting Roki Sasaki for about 3 years, built relationships within his camp and over the last 24hrs were confident that they would land him.
A Santander rumor from Toronto media has already surfaced, and the Jays are typically tight lipped, so damage control might be happening.
Plus the country is also in a state thanks to generally poor governance at the federal level (sorry to be a bit political).
Boy, if that is the case Sasaki is in for a surprise come January 20 ...
I would imagine now some of this international money will be used to soften the blow of signing one or two QO FAs (Santander and maybe someone else).
The Jays may have a 1 or 2 deals lined up that they didn't want to make until they knew what their international pool was going to be after the Sasaki decision.
Announcing Santander now will definitely be a little bit of damage control.
I think we decided that that word combination for the front office is not to be used here. We try and keep it respectful.
I am not sure the Jays will need $2M in international money so it could be a waste.
As just one example, compare the divergence in GDP per capita across the two countries. The Economist (30 Sept 2024): “Why is Canada’s economy falling behind America’s? The country was slightly richer than Montana in 2019. Now it is just poorer than Alabama.”
I think people, including professional baseball players, can pick up the general vibe of economic dynamism in the US and creeping mediocrity or stagnation in Canada. You can feel it and perceive it in myriad ways.
I’m a proud Canadian but I think it’s important to be honest about what is happening in our country.

Canada in recent years has artificially propped up its GDP stats by increasing its immigration quotas (to mask poor GDP per capita numbers).
I don't believe that LA Dodgers are good for baseball. How many other teams can afford to have 1 billion in deferred money to be paid out in the future? Their financial clout and their advantageous geographical location ( Shorter plane ride home for Japanese players, easier for family to come visit ) now make them a powerhouse.
They do have a well run baseball organization, and some say " you can't fault them for using their advantages". Well, no, you can't fault them but you can fault MLB for not having stronger checks and balances to stop the ultra rich teams from stockpiling the best players. Unless MLB installs a hard cap on salaries, or something similar, there won't be parity in baseball. While there are Cinderella teams every few years in the playoffs, otherwise it will be the same rich teams every year in the postseason, and that will make for less interest in baseball which is already a dying sport.
I would assume Sasaki made his decision yesterday or early today. Did the Jays call his agent to say we are about to make this deal? I would love to know.
I cant imagine the Rogers bean counters are happy with this.
Funny enough I now totally expect them to pivot onto Alonso or Santander just to save face. Otherwise…. Hoo boy.
It is really impressive that they were the finalists in the Ohtani and Sasaki sweepstakes, beating out the Yankees/Mets/Cubs/rest of the other MLB clubs. This result shows us that the Jays have really good strategic planning and sales skills.
Where the Jays fall short on is the scouting and player development areas. The short coming is very evident when you look at the Boston Red Sox, who rebuilt their farm system with a couple of good drafts. Hopefully with the new scouting director Marc Trumata and the new minor league coaches and coordinators coming in for 2025, the Jays will be able to reverse the trend.
Once the Jays rebuild their farm system, they should be successful in the recruitment of the next Japanese sensation that comes along.
That said, after this unsuccessful winter off season, I really wish the Jays will start looking at a rebuild at this stage. The team has too many holes and you cannot rely on free agents to plug all the holes.
UO, in the spirit of relying on advanced stats as opposed to superficial ones (as we try to do on this site in the baseball context), I’m hoping you’ll do some research on GDP per capita and the growing wealth gap between Canada and the US. It’s a big deal and well worth understanding properly. I won’t post a bunch of links but this can be easily Googled.
I can’t say what impact, if any, this is having in MLB but it wouldn’t surprise me if it’s a factor in some decisions being made by players and organizations.
I’m certainly not using this as an excuse for the Blue Jays front office.
Here endeth the economics portion of my contribution to this discussion.
1. Ash front office
2. Ricciardi front office
3. Atkins Shapiro front office
4. Anthopoulos front office
5. Gillick front office
The Jays have one of the largest revenue bases in MLB - a captured 40 million viewer potential that no other team can touch, a massive local market that isn't split with other ML teams (or even NFL teams - sorry Bills, and no the Argos don't count). The Raptors really suck right now, and the Leafs...well...they are the Leafs (packed stadium/tv viewers even if they suck). Doubt the PWHL or WNBA will impact the Jays much if at all. So the Jays really have the variable sporting market to themselves (locked in is the Leafs which no one can touch). If the Jays want to have the highest payroll in MLB they could afford it. Rogers likes profits though (obviously) thus they won't go higher than what can be justified by added revenue potential. What is that level? We don't know. But if the team is sub 500 we know the crowds drop and viewership crashes. If the team is on a 90+ win pace the TV ratings go through the roof and the park is packed. Unlike the Leafs the Jays have a massive incentive to win.
Anthony Santander does look like an ideal piece to add - play in LF and DH, Santander-Varsho-Springer could be a decent outfield if Springer has any kind of bounceback. Loperfido-Lukes-Straw-Schneider are the guys fighting for backup slots (all have options left). Not to mention Clase, Roden, Berroa, and others.
Gillick - people were calling for his head after 1987/early 1988 with the whole 'move Bell to DH after winning an MVP' crap to make room for his favorite prospect at the time (Sil Campusano). Not to mention his 'stand Pat' nickname in '88 when he refused to do any trades with a team that was damn close with obvious holes (no trades from Sept 22, 1987 to March 9, 1989, hard to imagine now but it did happen). Plus the pure stupidity of putting Jimy Williams in charge then undermining Cito Gaston in '89 by openly talking about wanting Lou Pinella to be the manager (it was front page news for awhile, but the Yankees refused to let the Jays talk to him).
AA - after 2013 he didn't look so golden. He traded a ton to build a pre-season favorite that came in dead last. Before the big mid-season deals in 2015 (after he knew he was on his way out), his best season was his first at 85-77 (11 out), 4th place. Or 3rd place (83-79, 13 out) in 2014 depending how one looks at it before those critical deals.
90 win seasons: Gillick - 5, Atkins - 2, AA - 1, everyone else 0.
Playoffs: Gillick - 4, Atkins - 3, AA - 1, everyone else 0.
I will say AA was entertaining with his impossible to guess deals and moves - he was called a ninja for a reason and it was a blast.
SS Cristopher Polanco DR #11 (BA) /22 (MLB)
SS Juan Sanchez DR #46 (BA)
SS Elenaiker Coronado VEN #60 (BA)
SS Kennew Blanco VEN #79 (BA)
----------------------
RHP Raduan Perez VEN
RHP Guilyerver Rodriguez VEN
RHP Alexander Valiente CUB
C Diego Arce MEX
C Josh? Gori VEN
OF Elian Reyes DR
RHP Miguel Pantoja, RHP MEX 94-95
https://www.threads.net/@rh7__prospectos/post/DA--y1lOYBw
RHP Alexander Valiente 93-96, potential 100 MPH, Curve, Slider, Splitter
https://cubanbaseballdigest.com/2025/01/07/another-cuban-pitcher-signs-with-the-bluejays/
Yeicer Crespo, C VEN R/R Nov/28/2007
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ut8zOH7Nru4
Old Names
Angel Vasquez, RHP PAN
Julio Ozoria, LHP DR
Freilyn Eusebio, RHP
Ayverson Contreras RHP VEN
Atkins’s teams made the postseason via the more relaxed WC system that was recently implemented. That is not as impressive as winning the division or earning a harder-to-obtain WC spot. And, of course, his teams did not win a single postseason game.
Advantage: Gillick and AA.
I acknowledge that Atkins and Shapiro did manage to assemble good teams in 2021-2023, although they didn’t do enough to strike while the iron was hot and put them over the top.
In an ideal world.
Same here. On the surface, the Straw trade looks awful, exchanging something like 13 million in multiyear payroll room in exchange for 2 million in unsigned IFA pool bucks.
If you went back in the Box' archives to the JPR/Bud Selig era and the Jays adhering strictly to the MLB's draft slotting bonus recommendations before the draft & CBA were overhauled, you'd come across many Bauxites advocating that the Jays should maximize their player development chances in ways that only cost resources from Rogers pocket.
In a lot of ways, this trade has the potential to do the same. The Jays may have added 2 million dollars worth of international prospects to their system with the only cost being that is overall cost Rogers itself something like 12-17 million from their coffers to purchase the extra prospects.
Of course, it's not 2005 anymore, so there are many new rules and bean counter calculations.
The extra prospects may cost more than just Rogers money if pushing over CBT thresholds from the extra dead payroll dollars lowers future IFA pools as penalties.
- C: Bal 3.9, Jays 3.5, NYY 3.1, Rays 2.2, Bos 1.5
- 1B: Jays 3.8, Rays 2.6, Bos 2.3, Bal 1.6, NYY 0.6
- 2B: Jays 3.9, Bal 3.4, Rays 3.1, NYY 2.4, Bos 2.2
- 3B: Bos 3.9, Bal 3.6, NYY 2.9, Rays 2.3, Jays 2.0
- SS: Bal 6.1, Jays 3.3, NYY 3.3, Bos 2.6, Rays 2.3
- LF: Bos 3.5, Bal 3.4, NYY 2.0, Jays 2.0, Rays 1.5
- CF: Bal 3.1, Jays 2.9, Bos 2.8, NYY 2.8, Rays 1.7
- RF: NYY 7.9, Bos 3.0, Bal 2.6, Rays 2.4, Jays 1.6
- DH: Bos 2.0, Bal 1.6, Rays 1.6, NYY 1.3, Jays 0.9
- SP: Rays 3.5-3.1-2.7-2.3-1.8-1.8 (15.2), NYY 3.7-3.6-2.5-2.0-1.9-1.1 (14.8), Bos 4.6-3.2-2.3-2.2-1.0-0.9 (14.2), Jays 3.8-2.8-2.7-2.3-1.6-0.6 (13.8), Bal 2.9-2.7-2.2-1.2-0.9-0.5-0.5 (10.9)
- RP: NYY 4.3, Bal 3.9, Bos 3.8, Rays 3.4, Jays 3.2
- Net: NYY 45.4, Bal 44.1, Bos 41.8, Rays 41.7, Jays 40.9
The team needs at least two bats. I really don’t know which ones would be the best to add from among Bregman, Santander, Alonso, Profar. Each seems to carry a fair bit of risk.
I think I would be OK with replacing the front office and starting a rebuild — if there were truly great candidates available to take over. On the other hand, I get that there is a strong incentive to try one more time to win in 2025 under the existing FO. It may not be a great idea, but it’s not an outrageous one.
Also: let’s say the next Sasaki, Ichiro or Ohtani is 19 or 20 years old and just getting untracked in Japan. Are Shapiro and Atkins going to initiate (yet again) another painstaking courtship of the player, in the hopes of winning a bidding war for him three or four years from now? I’m exhausted just thinking about it.
If getting Straw doesn't stop them from any other moves, then it literally doesn't matter. He's a bad player the Jays owe $11M to over 2 years. It shouldn't matter. If trading for Straw stops them from signing someone good, then yes, it's a disaster but I doubt it.
Straw is very much more expensive and likely less effective than Steward Berroa. As I said before, the best thing the extra international money will do is allow them to sign QO players (but they'll also lose very important draft picks/draft capital).
As to the free agents, I feel Santander doesn't want to come here - it seems no one else is chasing him (based on the lack of rumors) and the Jays hopefully will not move from their current bid. Alonso is harder to read. Profar has a lot of warts but could fit in nicely at a lower cost. Bregman? He is demanding way too much, I'd go to 3 years at a high dollar per year maybe, depending what is expected from him. At this point the Jays front office should play hardball. If they can't get who they want at the price they want, so be it. There are only so many teams with cash and Bregman/Santander/Alonso all pushed it too far this year imo. Odds are if the Jays wait one of them will give in, maybe 2. All depends on the rest of the league, will someone else give in to their demands at this late stage? Doubtful. We'll see.
March 27, 2019 - Traded Kendrys Morales and cash to the Oakland Athletics. Received Jesus Lopez (minors) and international bonus slot money.
https://www.sportsnet.ca/mlb/longform/how-an-off-the-radar-flyer-became-one-of-the-blue-jays-top-pitching-prospects/
In the spring of 2019, an unexpected windfall of international bonus pool money sent Andrew Tinnish globetrotting. Two separate trades returned $1.5 million in spending room to the capped out Toronto Blue Jays, but the money came with a key caveat: it had to be spent by June 15, the very end of the 2018 signing period, after the top eligible players were long gone. That meant Tinnish, the club’s vice president of international scouting and baseball operations, and his staff needed to find players who had either slipped through the cracks or raised their stock after being initially passed over. A rough target list, a series of transcontinental flights and a huge spike in Tinnish’s air miles balance followed. “It was really a matter of, ‘Okay, we have two months to do our work on these guys, get to know them, get to know their make up and see them play,” says Tinnish. “So let’s get to work.”
Some of that work was relatively straightforward. A pair of Cuban pitchers held a workout in the Dominican Republic attended by nearly every big-league team, whether they had money to spend or not. The Blue Jays focused on Yosver Zulueta, the now 24-year-old flamethrower lighting up the radar gun at the organization’s advanced-A affiliate in Vancouver. He touched 98 m.p.h. and signed for $1 million.
More complicated was what to do with the remaining money. A trip to Taiwan to scout a few players delivered a less conclusive look, as they were out of season and tougher to gauge. Then there was the Netherlands, where teenagers Jiorgeny Casimiri, a hard-throwing righty, and Max Kops, a toolsy outfielder, were working out with the Dutch under-18 program. The Blue Jays signed Casimiri for $225,000, while Kops opted for an American college. But before the deadline hit, they also added another pitcher. This was a player they had tracked in the past but who very easily could have been overlooked because he didn’t pop the radar gun. Instead, Tinnish placed a $125,000 bet on the advanced pitching mechanics and maturity of Sem Robberse, who has since emerged as one the club’s top pitching prospects.
So the last time the Jays had some extra and late expiring 1.5 mil IFA pool money after trading away Dwight Smith Jr and Kendrys Morales in camp, they ended up with Zulueta, Robberse and Casimiri (a now 22 y/o reliever signed in his teens that left the system in '23). So it gives a rough idea of what could potentially be expected from an unaccounted for 2 million IFA pool. Robberse was half of the price to rent Jordan Hicks for the '23 pennant run. Zulueta is peculiar. He rose to be a Top 5 prospect in a bad Toronto system, seems to have been mismanaged in being lost on waivers and has at least made the MLB. Casimiri is gone and was in the BAL system last year. But he was signed young and had 5 years in the system to be evaluated and progress.
The Blue Jays have signed many good players out of Latin America over the years. By contrast, they’ve never signed an important player out of Japan. Is it worth the enormous investment of time and money to chase those players, if the players are so unwilling to come to Canada? Or maybe a different front office would have more success in this regard? If the Blue Jays had been a high-flying organization, fresh off post-season success and flush with prospects and major-league talent, would Sasaki or Ohtani have signed here?
The way I see it, they inherited a good ML team with 1 solid prospect (Vlad) and had to deal with the aging roster and no ML ready prospects. By 2020 they had a playoff team, added pre-2020 with a Cy Young finalist, then pre 2021 added 2 all-stars (Springer and Semien) and missed the playoffs by 1 game. 2022 added Gausman (lost Cy winner Ray) & added Chapman too, made the playoffs and should've won game 2 but the pen fell apart, Springer ran into Bo (hard) and for god knows what reason they had Tapia in LF that game. 2023 they added Bassitt & Varsho, made the playoffs and did some stupid moves, but failing to score was the biggest issue. 2024 was a flop. I see the team getting 2025 as a 2nd chance, but if the Jays flop again expect front office changes before October is done (maybe even mid-season).
The question isn't how do players/other teams see them but can they retool fast and get back to the playoffs or close enough to keep crowds coming. No crowds, no TV viewers, no jobs. Pretty simple equation. 1 bad year can fall under 'crap happens', 2 or more...not so good. However, safe to say Rogers doesn't want a full rebuild which anyone decent coming in would want to do (see 2016-2018 for an example). It'll be interesting to see how this year goes - I see the potential for a very good team here, I also see the potential for a bad team. If Bo & Vlad play like men wanting massive deals and the pitchers hold up then good things happen. If instead they all flop around and fail to reach their potential then ugly stuff will happen. Post 2025 free agents (cap hit in brackets): Vlad ($28.5 mil), Bassitt ($21 mil), Bo ($11.2), Green ($10.5), Swanson ($3 mil) = $74.5 mil - mid season deals means $37.1 could be removed mid year if the team is sucking, which should be more than enough to go sub tax level. Of course, if the team is sucking odds are some of these guys will be too which makes them much harder to trade without paying some of their salary.
Now there is no point in losing draft picks (2nd and maybe 3rd plus international pool money) to clog up a roster badly in need of a retool. I've said many times that this roster has too many holes to compete.
Lose Bo and Vladdy and then get stuck with the expensive decline years of Springer (still), Santander and maybe Bregman or Alonso? No thanks...
I’m probably reaching here to rationalize a bad move but there has to be some logic that we are missing. It’s probably as simple as liking Straw in the 4th OF role and planning to use the $2M on several players and hoping one clicks.
I have no issue going after Sasaki, and investment that it takes to make a serious run at him. You have to even if the probability is low. I am also speculating that they knew when the Padres knew they were out. The Padres simply went about their business and signed their guys. The Jays thought let’s pick up some higher value international kids that some teams will no longer be able to. Either because of Teams like the Pirates picking up the Dodger kids and therefore leaving there own on the table, or the Jays just signing more players they may have been keeping an eye on. Also, as mentioned, perhaps they won’t be in a position to sign many players next year if they intend to pickup on what’s left on the free agent market. All of that is fine.
What I do have an issue with is why on earth would they trade for Straw and that contract? or even wait that long to do it. Instead, they have plenty of guys that are depth they will never get to, that could have been traded for Int'l $$$ and accomplish the same thing without the cap hit. Similar to what they did with Johnathan Davis and others in the past. I’m sure that would have been more difficult, but they have had months to do that.
Its the lack of strategic moves or planning that is concerning. They have never dealt with the holes in the lineup properly since they took over from AA. From what they say to the press it seems they even have a limited awareness of these issues.
I have no idea how they field a good team this year, it seems like a big mess right now of half baked plans that are falling apart. Worse, no light at the end of the tunnel.
Sasaki was a lottery ticket. If you buy a lottery ticket and were close to winning but didn't does it really warrant complaints that it was stupid to buy as many lottery tickets as you did? Yes, i'd say so but i'll only pay attention to thr posters who held this opinion before the news turned out bad which is, one poster maybe?
Really hope we can get Bregman or Alonso instead.
The only question now is how long rogers will keep buying it.
Agreed. The Jays are one of the few teams willing to spend excessively for defense and Straw fits their history perfectly. I’d add $15M for IKF last year to the above list. They probably had ~$5M in mind to use for a backup CF, and either no one took their money or the players they targeted wanted more than that, so they went with Straw. I hate it as a fan, as the 2023 season actually frustrated me more than a lot of the team’s bad seasons and they actually made the playoffs that year, but this is the hill they want to die on. We just have to hope they add enough offense to compensate without destroying future payroll.
The only thing I worry about is Vlad's contract situation. If he's not resigned before the season, then he'd likely be traded and do we trust Atkins to make a good deal ? Vlad and Bo simply cannot walk at the end of the season for nothing, because with top free agents not wanting to come here and no immediate help from the farm, things are going to look very bleak here for the immediate future.
I imagine the front office will sign at least one power bat, for marketing purposes if nothing else.
The only thing I wouldn't trust is trying to thread the needle too much but this front office has been fine with trades and if it comes to that, I'd rather stick this unpopular move with past front office than give it to new guy.
So what are the Jays to do? Keep building up the farm - they failed recently thus dumped a few people and now are trying again - the extra $2 mil in IFA cash will help a lot if used wisely.
Short term? DH is a hole - a big one, but just projected to be 1.1 WAR less than the best in the division. RF a massive hole (1.6 vs Judge 7.9, but just 1.4 behind the next best) but not much can be done - Springer ain't being released or benched, but he might be traded if another team has an ugly contract they want to dump. Hmmm... wonder if the Diamondback might do a Montgomery (1 year $22.5 mil) for Springer deal. Unlikely, but worth a shot. 3B is another weakness, 1.9 behind Boston (top in the division). But if they signed Alonso and put Vlad at 3B that might fix 3B and DH - do a mix/match (as I said before) of Clement at 3B, either Vlad or Alonso at DH twice a week, Clement at SS, Bo at DH once a week, Springer at DH, a kid in RF once a week. Some kid (Wagner) or Kirk at DH the other days. Gets everyone some rest, keeps the bench active. Might be a good mix. LF will probably be a mix of Schneider with Loperfido (platoon or something). I suspect they'll try Orelvis in LF in spring as well as at 2B and 3B (that power would be nice to get in the lineup, if it wasn't PED induced).
One of Santander, Alonso, whoever will be signed I suspect - the question is who and when. I just hope the Jays don't panic and give a dumb deal. 3 years, maybe 4 is as far as I'd go with any of these guys. Flaherty is still there for pitching depth, as is Nick Pivetta with many 'meh' options like Andrew Heaney out there too if the Jays are determined to move Yariel Rodriguez to the pen. Also a TON of good relievers still waiting for a contract - full list at FanGraphs with 3 expected to get $10 mil+ (Scott, Jansen, and Robertson), 5 more in the 5+ mil range (Yates, Estévez, Sewald, Kimbrel, Kelly), and 6 more with cash estimates of $2+ mil each. David Robertson I'd love to see as a setup man here, and Ryan Yarbrough wouldn't be a bad idea to bring back to finish off the pen. Heck, Ryan Borucki is out there after a terrible season, but if he'd take a AAA deal and invite I'd do that - wouldn't guarantee him a roster slot though.
#7 Santander
#8 Alonso
#10 Flaherty
#11 Scott
#18 Estevez
#24 Scherzer
#25 Profar
I'd be fine with signing a bunch of 30 year olds to compete while trying to redevelop the farm. Also still trades to be made. I'll give this FO the chance to see what they do with plan A's extinguished (Burnes, Soto, Sasaki).
Obviously it would have been better to add Burnes as one of those free agents, but that ship has sailed.
Giving away international dollars and draft picks (which also subtracts from the draft budget) is only good if the Jays are getting high-end talent. Santander and Pivetta, for example, are not high-end talent.
If the Jays sign a couple QO FAs then they give up their 2nd and 3rd round picks (which they've had more success with than their 1st round picks) but just as importantly, they lose about $3M from their draft budget. In a year where their 1st round pick is worth $6-7M, they have a realistic chance to acquire some real talent with one of the top 10 draft budgets in the majors.
They also had some real success with their 2024 international class... I'm eager to see if some can continue their successes in North America this year.
Which teams do great at developing their farm systems consistently without the aid of high draft picks bunched from tank years? Now out of those teams you can count on one hand, how many of them are successful each year? Now how many of those teams spend big $$$$ on their payrolls. How many teams are left and do those teams have an advantage over others in attracting any type of player over the others?
You have Dodgers, Padres, Braves and probably the Mariners.
That's silly Nigel - it's clearly because they care about the GDP per capita of saskatchewan.
- 2024: Signed all but their last 2 picks (rounds 19+20)
- 2023: Missed rounds 14, 17 + 18
- 2022: Missed round 16, 18, 20 (note: Kasevich & Roden below slot signings as was Ryan Jennings, & T.J. Brock - all 4 are in our top 30 prospects) - had 3 2nd round picks (Kasevich, Toman, and Doughty)
- 2021: Missed 16 & 20, no 2nd round pick (lost due to free agency)
So the trick now is to develop guys so we don't have more Nate Pearson type issues (super stud, never did anything here) or flops (Barriera, Hoglund, Martin who was traded in the nick of time). I'm wondering if our GM needs to be more Tampa like - willing to deal guys who are doing well for prospects, he did a solid job of it last year. It is risky, but if free agents won't come then we need to do those types of risks.
That's why it's imperative to either extend Vladdy and live with the consequences of the massive overpay it will take to get pen to paper, or trade him before the start of the season and concede the next couple of years. Since the latter, due to business reasons, probably isn't feasible to ownership, then they'll have to suck it up and do the former. Imagine the Phillies having Nick Castellanos and Taijuan Walker on their roster without Bryce Harper and Trea Turner on it. Not saying Santander and whoever they overpay for the rotation will end up like that, but there is risk with all FAs in their 30's. You don't want to take risks like that if Vladdy isn't around beyond 2025.
this is why you should never be duped by a new FO coming in and saying "Our plan is to develop a good system with waves of prospects".
Because that's not actually a plan, that's just a basic job requirement that literally every single FO also "plans" to do.
yes a lot of dummies do think that, just like the same dummies think the same of....
....California.
If anyone is interested, Simon Lapointe did some research on the real wealth gap between Canadians and Americans in 2019, "Household Incomes in Canada and the United States: Who is Better Off?" Easy to Google an open source copy. The quick takeaway is that the overall PPP-adjusted GDP figures distort the fact that the bottom 60% in Canada is considerably better off than in the US. No one should be shocked by that.
I live in an expat household and we're professors at a red state uni. I'd do anything to get back to Canada ASAFP whereas the Mrs. would like to see things play out some before making any radical moves. I won't say anything about right or wrong, but having grown up under a communist regime her expectations of "peace, order, and good government" are considerably lower than mine.
However, in the end most players are like most average people - if offered a lot more money they go where the cash is. If someone offered you a chance to do your current job for 50% more pay you'd probably move across the country to do it. Some wouldn't as they are very happy living where they are (see Corbin Burnes), but others would be happy for the adventure (especially in their 20's or 30's) of going somewhere new for more cash. The Jays have that challenge as do most non-NY and non-LA teams. Some teams have cash issues (see Florida teams) others have cheap owners (see Minnesota, and many others - billionaires tend to be super-cheapskates, I've known a few millionaires and they often were the cheapest people I knew, willing to negotiate over small things just because they could save $10 doing so, then would go blow $1k on horse race betting for fun).
So how do the Jays deal with it? Like I said, they have more cash than most teams in this boat. They also have a strong incentive to be a contender (about 1 1/2 million fans a year spread for a 75 win team and a 90 win team, plus massive spread on TV viewership). They need to invest heavily into scouting - IFA and draftable talent. I loved when AA did that for pro-scouting, skyrocketing that budget. You can probably get 10+ full time scouts for $1 mil and if they are good they'd easily pay back that investment with just 1 find (whoever found Kirk and Moreno certainly did that). I'd have to think clubs have a way to measure scouts quality, and coaches quality. I can think of a few ways of doing it (short and long term) so I'd figure with millions at stake teams would too. With the advanced computer measurement methods you should be getting a far better idea of a players potential peak far faster now (bat speed, running speed, reaction time, hand-eye coordination, etc.). These things the Jays need to invest heavily in as the payback could be a very large multiple of the cost.
In the meantime we see opportunity - SD appears ready to throw in the towel as the Dodgers move to super-team status, they have a few big contracts in Xander Bogaerts ($229.1 mil over 9 years left), Yu Darvish (4 years $67 mil), Fernando Tatis Jr ($313.1 over 10 years), Joe Musgrove ($60 over 3, TJ for 2025), and Manny Machado ($315.8 left over 9 years) are all deals they might want to get out of now. Tatis is the only one with any real value, the rest are underwater contracts. Jays bad ones are Springer (2 yrs $48.3 mil), and Myles Straw (2 years $11 mil). Wonder if there is a way to get Tatis Jr out of there? Take on Bogaerts and dump Springer & Straw on them maybe?

Straw doesn't need to be added until opening day or even later if he doesn't break camp with the team. This is one small benefit of the trade. He's 47 days shy of having 5 years of service; until he achieves that milestone, he can be outrighted off the 40-man roster but doesn't get to keep his salary if he elects free agency. It's possible that the Jays could shuttle him between Buffalo and Toronto a few times early in the year, taking advantage of the fact that no one will pick him up on waivers and that he won't elect free agency.
With 0 options Nance and Pop should be toast.
As someone who has lived in California (Bay Area, not right in SF) for 20 years after 25 in Canada (born in Europe) - the transition was really not that difficult. Stop saying "Eh", stretch "about" out to "abouuuut", and don't talk about "Canadian Tire" or Tims (was never a big fan before I left - only started drinking coffee a few years ago, so that wasn't an issue). Really doesn't feel all that different from when I worked in Toronto as a kid raised in K-W. Sure, there's ALWAYS traffic here (you never have the road to yourself), but outside rush-hour, it's not horrible, and there's a TON of stuff to do within a few hours drive.
I've definitely noticed that even here, sports-minded people tend to be more right-wing than not - especially at say, HPDE track day. Not everyone - my in-laws are very democrat/liberal and huge sports fans, but the younger they are, the more sports/car fans tend to be right-leaning, if not outright wearing MAGA hats. Mind you, the Central Valley (farmland) and basically most places outside the big cities are VERY right-leaning, etc. It's just that we have a LOT of people in big cities. I've heard it said CA has more republicans than Texas. Sadly, tech people have been moving rightward lately, which is surprising and a new thing, and hopefully won't last.
Are there certain areas I would not live in the US? Definitely - and the list of "wouldn't mind moving there" locations keeps shrinking year by year: CA, maybe CT/MA on the east coast, OR/WA/NV/AR/NM (in the reasonable parts, depends on if we're retiring or moving there for work, etc), MN if it comes down to it. I mean, in the end, we could "survive" in most of the rust belt states if we just keep our heads down and not talk politics. Not sure if we could survive "the south" - would have to draw on my fundamentalist past.
OTOH, also would have zero interest in living in, say Alberta at the moment and probably Sask/Manitoba. And unless financially set, the east coast is probably impossible (and the winters!) and not sure how welcome we would be in la belle province. So, Ontario / BC, although I hear BC is so expensive it's impossible to live there. So.. Ontario? Where my very-fundamentalist family lives and consistently cheers on Trump / Poilievre and watches Hannity/Carlson/Jim Bakker?
From what a friend has told me, if Poilievre gets elected, in his opinion, he will be worse for Canada than Trump will be for the US, so we're slow-rolling our "emergency getaway to Canada" until we have a better idea of what's what. Getting Canadian passports for the kids, but not moving just yet. The wife is a US citizen, so she would have to "visit" and overstay or something, if it comes down to it. Going to see if CA's "fight Trump" fund works out reasonably well, and hopefully, in 2 years the midterms swing one of the two houses back to sanity..
I agree with the GDP thing in terms of "it feels right" - lately, all I hear is how Canadians are broke and no one can afford housing on the Leafs group on reddit. And there are no doctors available, etc.
Again, no telling what the future brings, and it could easily turn even CA into the worst thing I've ever experienced (my parents were refugees in WW2, so hopefully not on their level). So far, I have to say, it's been above / better than where I would have expected to be had I stayed in Canada. My job pays for most of my healthcare, which is generally available and emergency room waits are not crazy, unlike the story of my family members recent 5+ hour wait in the middle of the night. OTOH, my parents in their 80s seem to get excellent care, so it seems hit or miss. After being laid off for a year (software engineer), found the best, highest-paying job of my life. Hoping for ~5 more years, and then retire before 60.. After that, who knows where we'll go.
Checking MLB's top prospect list I see the following still available...
- #11: Manny Cedeno a SS from San Pedro de Macorís (Jays have had a bit of luck there with SS in the past). Tied to the Yankees but not signed yet.
- #12 Ayden Johnson another SS, bat first (nice) from the Bahamas. Tied to the A's but not signed yet.
- #15 Diego Tornes an OF from Cuba, switch hitter with power from both sides and a strong arm. Tied to Atlanta but, yeah, not signed yet. FG has him higher, 4th highest non Japanese player at a 45+ value.
- #21 Jhoan De La Cruz SS from, you guessed it, San Pedro de Macorís. Tied to the Padres, but hasn't been signed.
Most of these kids signing have been training at their teams' facilities since they were 13, 14... training, eating, learning English, etc... it's like family by the time they sign.
It's more the pop-up guys that get signed... someone just discovered like Kirk was or a new Cuban defector, etc.
And Michael: thanks for compiling that data.
Many around baseball perceived the fix was in and he was only going to the Dodgers. The rumours were so bad that MLB stepped in to monitor the process
Sasaki was generally quiet during the team meetings except when the discussion turned to pitching philosophies and mechanics
On Wednesday the Padres told Sasaki's agent that they were willing to max out their pool and offer Sasaki $10M, presumably through trades.
As we know the Dodgers did trade for pool money after they knew they won.
The Jays traded for more pool space to try and head off the Dodgers at the last minute. The article called it a dubious strategy and one exec said his phone was blowing up with "WTF Jays?"
The Jays inclusion in the final decision puzzled rival execs as the Jays are not regarded within the industry as a team that excels at pitching development.
When the Dodgers had their final meeting with Sasaki they had Magic Johnson there (Sasaki is a basketball fan), Freddie Freeman, Mookie Betts, Will Smith and Ohtani.
Done deal.
On the sports fandom thing - I live in Cambridge, MA and a few blocks away is an LGBTQ sports bar, a socialist hotspot that always has baseball on in the summer.
I know I've been lucky but since coming to the US, I've had three long standing health issues taken care of an covered by insurance as well as six rounds of IVF with my wife.
I bike or walk to work and have some of the best colleagues and collaborators in the world available to meet for a chat.
I stayed in Canada for my undergrad and PhD because of a bias toward living in the States. Canadians lean too heavily on the national identity of being not-American.
And boy oh boy were the Boston Red Sox ever fun to hate watch during my first summer here during their dying season of 2011.
Getting back to my original comment about the overestimation of "playing for a whole country" I want to reframe it this way with a question.
If Vlad were to do an endorsement deal with a MA (oven just greater Boston area) pizza chain would be be paid more or less than from a deal from national Canadian Pizza chain. Silly example I know, but this is where Canada's sick economy (too reliant on resources extraction and housing) comes into play. The Jays, for a player with marketing potential, need to make up those dollars that are a pittance in Canada (not just because of the economy but also the dominance of hockey) versus even local deals in the US.
Vlad wanting a 10/$400 deal seems a reasonable place to start as he is a marketable play who'll be giving up a lot in an economy that has little offer him other than on-field salary.
Oh, and to be like Chris I also lived 4 great years in Cambridge MA before coming out here and enjoyed a number of Pedro games in fenway.
The Dodgers.
There are only a small number of teams that will actually spend big money to sign free agents - in part because the gap between a mid-level free agent and an internally-developed player (for those teams good at that) isn't that big... It's not worth spending money on the more expensive player... and also likely paying for their decline years.
The Jays are like the 16-year-old seated at the kids table at Christmas dinner. They so badly want to join the parents table but they haven't earned the right.
One of the reasons I think a rebuild is now the only option is that they are incredibly undesirable to the top free agents, they would have to way over pay mid-level free agents and even top amateur players are now likely going to rebuke the Jays pre-draft discussions. I've also read things that suggest agents dislike dealing with the Jays.
The front office's poor communication (which Shapiro highlighted as a weakness two winters ago) has not gotten better. In fact, it's probably worse now.
I also find it interesting that the Dodgers and Padres have all signed their international FAs now but there have been zero pictures/news on the Jays doing their signings. They've already made those kids wait long enough... or maybe they don't want to sign with the club anymore either.
L
Marc Hulet, how would you compare & contrast Myles Straw & Steward Berroa - I was hoping Berroa would get some playing time with Varsho's uncertain status.
I'd have personally given Berroa a shot - as it also shows other minor leaguers that the Jays give their players opportunities.
"The historic contract impacts taxes, both the Dodgers’ and Ohtani’s, and its annual value varies depending if you break it down over 10 years ($70 million), for luxury tax purposes ($46 million), for the players union calculations ($43.8 million), over the 20 years it will be paid ($35 million) or its 2024 payout ($2 million)."
"Ohtani’s contract calls for $2 million annual salaries and $68 million deferred each year without interest to be paid in $68 million instalments between 2034 and 2043."
According to online sources he is paid 2 million each year until 2034. The Dodgers are saving over 60 million/year by not having to pay out that cash each year.
If i'm missing something and the Dodgers are in fact paying the money each year then let me know. Contracts is not my thing but you should also be careful not to spread falsehoods if you're not 100% sure yourself.
It's only an issue for the Jays if they become the American Leagues Champ.
Things with the Yankees are more uncertain.
They really need to drop Stroman who wouldn't be the worse 5th starter in Toronto with the improved defense.
Just need to sign a LF/DH first.
Baltimore hasn't done a whole lot.
How good will Charlie Morton be at 41?
Boston needs to add a right bat.
Snell, Sasaki (for peanuts), Scott, Kim
So, two frontline starting pitchers, an elite closer, and a quality backup infielder.
Next off-season: Vladdy or Bo?
Anyway, $375M payroll for the Dodgers? Oakland had a $62M payroll (give or take) for 2024 - which means LA could field an ENTIRE 6-team DIVISION of Oakland As for the 2025 season from that payroll.. Guarantee themselves a division winner for once :-) I think the Onion needs to update their article: Yankees sign all of MLB
So the Dodgers were $107,397,814 over the luxury tax base before signing Scott, $72 mil/4 years ($21 mil deferred of course) so roughly adds $18 mil to their total - so $125.4 mil over the tax level. This means a tax of 50% on first $20 mil, 62% on 2nd $20 mil, 95% on 3rd $20 mil, 110% on the rest ($77 mil) = $10+$12.4+$19+$84.7 = $126.1 mil in tax to the other clubs => net payroll post tax of $487,098,031 (and they'll probably add to it as well) - the Jays highest end of season luxury tax payroll was $257,798,413 (+$5.6 mil in taxes = $263.4 mil net) in 2023, so the Dodgers are closing in on double the Jays highest payroll ever. Remember, anyone they sign now is costing them more than double the contract so adding Kershaw (should happen) would probably be a $10 mil contract costing them $21 mil post tax. That would put them over the $500 mil mark for net payroll costs post tax.
Phew, crazy stuff. Wonder if California can figure out a way to tax deferred salary? Safe to say MLB will push hard for a hard cap next time and at the very least should get another tier at 200% tax or something nuts like that. Players will insist on it going to a fund for all players to share equally I suspect or to their pension fund so guys with fewer years can get more benefits (that I'd be fully in favor of as those who don't get 10 years in the majors often spent years in the minors and have little to show for it). That'd be better than going to, say, the Tampa Bay owners pockets.
I think people will worry about others things in 2025.
OK, back to baseball. 2027 could be a lost year - the owners are lining it up to be imo, with the way the Dodgers are buying up everyone as are the Mets (the Yankees certainly not going cheap either), while the A's and Rays are becoming jokes in minor league parks for 2025/26 and maybe longer. Other teams also going cheap as always seeing no real hope so might as well live off revenue sharing.
Yeah, I think this is the way to frame it rather than "the FO dummies traded 11 million dollars away for nothing".
As I've posted here a few times, the FO traded for 1.5 million in bonus IFA cap room in the spring of 2019 in exchange for Kendrys Morales and Dwight Smith Jr.
They got creative and signed Cuban defector Yosver Zulueta, Sem Robberse and another 18 y/o Dutch prospect named Casmiri.
If the Straw trade is reframed as taking on 11 million in dead money in exchange for the 2025 equivalent of Zulueta, Robberse, Casmiri and possibly another prospect or two in value, it may still not be advisable but makes way more sense in baseball terms.
Roki Sasaki, RHP, Japan: Dodgers More »
Josuar De Jesus Gonzalez, SS, D.R.: Giants ($2,997,500) More »
Elian Peña, SS, D.R.: Mets ($5,000,000) More »
Cris Rodriguez, OF, D.R.: Tigers ($3,197,500) More »
Andrew Salas, SS/OF, USA/Ven.: Marlins ($3,700,000) More »
Yorger Bautista, OF, Ven.: Mariners ($2,100,000) More »
Kevin Alvarez, OF, Cuba: Astros ($2,000,000) More »
Dorian Soto, SS, D.R.: Red Sox ($1,400,000) More »
Maykel Coret, OF, D.R.: Rays ($1,600,000) More »
Juan Cabada, SS , D.R.: Cubs ($1,500,000) More »
Manny Cedeno, SS, D.R.
Ayden Johnson, SS, Bah.
Wilfri De La Cruz, SS/3B, D.R.: Cubs ($2,300,000) More »
Brayan Cortesia, SS, Ven.: Nationals ($1,920,000) More »
Diego Tornes, OF, Cuba: Braves ($2,497,500) More »
Darwing Ozuna, OF, D.R.: A's ($850,000)
Gabriel Davalillo, C, Ven.: Angels ($2,000,000) More »
Liberts Aponte, SS, Ven.: Reds ($1,900,000) More »
Kendry Martínez, SS, D.R.: Mariners ($2,500,000) More »
Raymer Medina, SS, D.R.: Rays ($1,100,000) More »
Would be curious if anyone (Hulet?) has any reference as to depth of quality of minor league prospects since that contraction. It is reasonable to assume that more prospects means more chance for lesser ones to develop & blossom. But also means more time and focus for better prospects. It would be interesting. Assuming not enough years of data to be much use.
I'm wondering if there was a cultural (or literal) translation issue with the Sasaki situation - where the team thought they were in a good place to get the extra IFA pool. But without any assurance, I also don't understand why you make the CLE trade. Feels like we've had lots of veteran players brought in "for contention" that blocked better & cheaper minor league options. But really only potentially marginal upgrades if it worked out. Feels like a FO weakness.
VW Fan, the majority of your tax dollars go towards a militarized police state (or sent international to fund Colonialism), while actual social services get mostly ignored.
Interesting that Bichette was among those that traveled to Toronto to pitch Sasaki. https://t.co/jCtKFfpHYn
— Brandon Wile (@Brandon_N_Wile) January 19, 2025
It didn't lead to a deal with Roki Sasaki, but Bo Bichette, Daulton Varsho & Chad Green still deserve lots of credit for making the trip to Toronto to welcome Sasaki and support the organization https://t.co/mpKoD6weqz
— Ben Nicholson-Smith (@bnicholsonsmith) January 19, 2025
The best orgs at signing international players include Seattle, Cleveland, LA Dodgers, Boston and Milwaukee. Of those clubs, only Seattle has just one club. The others all have two. It's more common now for teams to keep DSL players in that league for 2-3 years unless they're big money players and then they only stay for one.
BTW apparently Varsho, Green and *Bichette* were at the second Sasaki meeting.
Where was Vladdy?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UvaY3uAecU
https://www.mlb.com/orioles/team/dominican-academy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dominican_Summer_League_team_rosters
A couple of former Jay sitings... In the Milwaukee video at 11 seconds in is that who I think it is ... Also why is George Bell listed as as an Oriole batting instructor ?
Among the many things I didn't know was that the 1992 Dominican Blue Jays had a record of 68 wins & 2 losses according to Wikipedia ... Also some of the Google photos of the Jays complex are perhaps somewhat telling ...
First, was Sasaki ever seriously considering signing with Toronto, or were his visits to Toronto (and maybe San Diego) simply a performance to suggest to MLB that he was always open to signing with a non-LA team?
Second, was the primary goal of the Straw acquisition to impress Sasaki's camp and obtain pool money to sign him, in the absence of any indication from Sasaki that he was inclined to sign with Toronto? Or did the Blue Jays front office believe that it would be a good move whether Sasaki signed with them or not?
We may never know the answers. But it seems to me that these are important questions.
As to the situation now - the Jays need to start hunting hard for guys who were missed by other clubs or who haven't signed yet and try to get them to break any pre-deals they had to come here - the old 'money talks, bs walks' rule. They also need to get moving on signing their own pre-agreement guys. If I was in their shoes I'd have a team of scouts going all over key baseball areas subject to IFA rules and try to find talent that others missed, this is an opportunity - gotta use it. Meanwhile they need to decide if Santander is worth whatever he is asking for and either sign or say 'goodbye' to him and move on to the next guy on their list. I'd be talking with SD about what they are going to do about their ugly situation - nuclear division with the Dodgers, is it worth it to blow what they are on players? Would they consider trading some ML talent here and if so how to divide up the pay for overpaid guys. Their last 2 years saw the highest attendance ever for SD (3.2 and 3.3 million) so they might not want to move on, but last year their games were online only ($99 for the season) produced by MLB and will do the same this year - they only made $15 mil from it from what I've found which is pathetic (about what the Jays were making around 1990 iirc). The average is around $75 mil and the Jays should be far above that (given they have more viewers than any other team last time viewership numbers were available) but won't be as Rogers has a strong incentive to hide the value of the Jays TV rights from MLB (revenue sharing).
So if SD is down, say, $50 mil from what they should be for TV cash (probably a low estimate) then they might need to clear out a big deal or two. Manny Machado would be sweet to have at 3B (118 OPS+ last year, 125 lifetime, a 3-7 fWAR player each of the past 4 years). Only problem is his contract is crazy (owed $315.8 mil over the next 9 years - $35 mil per year). Obviously you'd need SD to pay a chunk of that, but dang would he be nice to have. Obviously the big gun there is Fernando Tatis Jr. (owed $313.1 mil over 10 years, $31.3 per year) - could the Jays take on both to allow maximum cash savings for SD? Would SD go for it? If their cash situation is getting ugly they might. That would add $66.3 mil per year to the payroll though - ouch. If they took Springer back ($48.2 mil total over 2 years) that'd help the short term cash crunch. Not sure what would be needed in a deal like that. It'd be a gusty one for both teams, but could help both a LOT. Push the Jays back into contention, push the Padres to save money (but piss off fans). Jays would have some dead cash on the payroll in a few years probably, but that is a Rogers problem and if they start developing players not as big of a deal. Plus the payroll could be emptied a lot after 2025 (Vlad, Bo, Bassitt, Green = $78.6 mil) depending how things go. I've been talking this one up for months but it just makes so much sense for both teams given their situations (SD in a nuclear war with LAD but without 10% of the firepower, and no TV revenue).
I'm sure Atkins and Shapiro will try anything out of desperation to save their jobs but signing Scherzer would be the epitome of a desperate move.
Troy Glaus and Corey Koskie were acquired by Toronto in trades.
Toronto is five moves away from being a legit contender.
Maybe Toronto has those moves lined up and, like their international signings, they're waiting for LA to finalize the Sasaki deal to finally move on (hoping the physical blows the deal) but I doubt it.
December 14, 2004: Signed as a Free Agent with the Toronto Blue Jays.
January 6, 2006: Traded by the Toronto Blue Jays to the Milwaukee Brewers for Brian Wolfe.
I think you confused Koskie's FA signing by JPR from Minnesota with his later salary dump trade to Milwaukee to clear room on the roster for Glaus and Shea Hillebrand.
Koskie in 2005 was probably JPR's 1st "big" FA signing after being hired years before to oversee austerity.
Hard to believe the Koskie signing was 20 years ago. And that Corey is only 51.
FA Post 2025: Vlad, Bo, Bassitt, Green - likely replacements are ???, Leo Jiménez (Nimmala in a few years), Manoah/Rodriguez (whowever isn't in the rotation at years end), ???.
FA Post 2026: Springer, Gausman, Varsho, Garcia, Kirk. Replacments - lord knows. No real catchers that are close/good, a few starting prospects kicking around, a few OF's too but we don't trust them to do LF this year, why CF & RF post 2026? Berrios could opt out post 2026 (just $48 mil over 2 left on his deal then)
Bottom line, the Jays will need to spend to replace a few key players or get really lucky in development and fast. Is locking in $75 mil for Vlad & Bo the best idea given all those needs that are coming? Maybe, but I'm not sure. If you feel confident that we can find 3 OF'ers from Clase, Loperfido, Berroa, Roden, etc. - I see Orelvis Martinez moving to the OF due to his defensive issues in the IF and high power potential, Wagner will be a super-utility guy I suspect. For starting we need 2-3 replacements quickly too - Yesavage, Tiedemann, Bloss, Macko, Rojas, Fernando Perez, Khal Stephen, etc. might give us 1 or 2 if we are lucky, odds are one or more will end up in the pen, and a few will end up forgotten by spring 2027. If the Jays are out of it come July hopefully those post 2025 free agents can bring in a few good prospects. Figuring out catching is the biggest issue imo - not one in the top 30 list and none look really interesting to me in the minors doing a quick eyeball check (age/OPS/level).
So far so good because today is Jan 20.
All projections have the Jays as superior to pretty much anyone in the AL Central, and in eyeshot here in the east. The big issue is DH/LF - solve one and the other should be OK.
- 3+ WAR (solid, star potential): Vlad, Giménez, Kirk
- 2+ WAR (solid regular): Bo, Varsho, Wagner, Schneider (surprised me), Gausman, Berrios
- 1.5+ WAR (meh, backup unless develop): Barger, Jimenez, McAdoo, Stefanic, Roden, Clement, Springer, Bassitt (1.9)
- 1+ WAR (ugh): Clase, Lukes, Loperfido, Francis, RodriguezManoah, Eric Lauer (? - a NRI), Hoffman (1.2 in the pen is damn nice)
- rest are sub 1 - who cares level. Orelvis listed at 0.3 over 447 PA (ugh)
Free agents via ZiPS: Santander 2.2, Jack Flaherty 2.0, Pete Alonso 3.0, Nick Pivetta 1.7, Max Scherzer 1.4. Others rumored for the Jays with significance haven't been done yet (Jurickson Profar, Ha-Seong Kim, Alex Bregman) and relievers are a crapshoot with projections. Kind of surprised to see Alonso so high. Scherzer is over 107 IP (seems reasonable given his age/health). Pivetta I'm not big on, and this gives me a bit of pause on Flaherty and Santander. All depends on what the Jays see as their potential and how they'd fit in with the club - could they help in ways beyond the projections due to L/R in batting order, or position.
I don't see Bichette aging well. Too depending on perfect timing.
He'll slow down and get injured more.
We're still waiting for some of their pitchers to stay healthy.
It will happen eventually.
Still more to do.
Human rights took a significant backwards step during the Dem's administration. While I agree it likely won't get better and could get worse in the next 4 years, pretending that transgender rights, abortion rights, and internal human rights didn't get considerably worse during the last 4 years is neoliberalism. In my opinion, of course.
I'd rather not make a multi-year committment and lose a draft pick on someone like Pivetta. If he isn't good, it's a one-year commitment. If he's good, he either helps them contend or can be flipped at the deadline.
The Jays aren't rebuilding, so if they are going to try to contend in 2025, Scherzer is the exact right type of signing that doesn't tie them down long-term.
I'd love to get Scherzer too, with the uncertainty around Manoah, Francis and Y-Rod and lack of MLB-ready depth. You could roll with six starters at times too, given the age of that rotation.
Guys, you should really read the Cass report to get a sense of the problems with the 'blanket affirmation for trans people' approach. There are major red flags all over the place, which makes sense given how this is so very different from historical understandings of trans ideation, (primarily male to female), and now, when the reverse is true. Even the Netherlands is walking back on their 'gold standard' model of affirmative care. They DID have success, but that was a different population of candidates, and their support/screening system was much more rigorous. I recognize that some pretty awful people are doing and saying awful things and share my point of view here, but I am non-partisan, simply team young people. Better data helps everyone.
You're right, that's exactly what I did.
I think mods should lock this down.
https://www.instagram.com/official_lady_bunny/p/Cz34WFHuTBK/
There was "Sell the team" chants.
They served sodas with a Dec 30 2024 expiry date.
McCutchen was signing autographs sitting at a table behind a "McCUTCEN" sign.
There was a video of the Pirate mascot falling on a toddler.
Fans asked questions like "Can we extend Skenes and Cruz now?"
and "Why is there not a pirate ship in the outfield?"