Kikuchi having 2 IP, 5 K's, 1 H - so K'd all but 2 batters. Very nice.
Zach Thompson - 4 batters faced so far, walked two, hit given up to 3rd partially due to Capra being in LF (he isn't an outfielder), then a grand slam. Ugh. Guess he wasn't ready for spring yet - hopefully he does well in Buffalo.
Ah spring. Lukes had a sac fly to drive in an Otto Lopez triple so both of them helping their cause for the 26th man slot.
Oh yeah, and Vlad cranking one a mile too of course. Always fun watching the Jays doing batting practice vs a team that claims to be major league (2 years in a row 100+ losses and was on an even worse pace in 2020 after losing 93 in 2019).
https://twitter.com/R_Thompson15/status/1628585201973460992
A huge benefit I've mentioned a few times over the years...announcing should be way better (as a listener) with 20-30% less time to fill/kill every pitch. Old announcers have struggled to find something to talk about, because quite frankly between pitches there isn't usually anything interesting to talk about.
Broadcast producers can hopefully stop flipping through camera angles so much too. It has often seemed they have been bored in recent years too. I mean, I know I get sick of seeing dugout shots and fan shots and 15 second commercials between pitches. Shots of guys chewing gum or spitting seeds...please no. Baseball had lost its pace and rhythm, and I am curious if I will watch more games live if it gets some back.
I heard that today would be a bullpen day against NYY. I hope one of Juenger, Pearson or Zulueta gets to pitch. Also who will catch.
Barger follows up with a 2b. Kid is indeed a tank. 20 extra pounds of muscle in the off-season.
I wish that Juenger (yanger? Really? ) had fielded that topper. But Danner looked pretty good. Didn't look like a C to me.
It will be interesting to see what happens with Chapman between now and his potential free agency after the season. He's a cut below Machado in terms of performance, but he's still a very good third baseman (4.1 fWAR in each of the last two years, and that may be underselling his performance if the defensive metrics were skewed by all the shifting). And he's a year younger than Machado. The Jays might be OK without him in 2024 and beyond, but I think they would be wise to try to extend him for another five years or so.
Who is going to play third base in 2024 and 2025 if he departs? It sounds as if Barger may be more of a utility player (or left fielder). And it's unclear whether Orelvis will be an average MLB player, let alone the starting third baseman on a first division ballclub.
Parker, a 23 year old prospect adding 20 pounds of muscle in the off-season is indeed news, and could easily explain his helium in the rankings. His power has been a talking point on both broadcasts, both crews
I figure most teams will be thinking like I am. 3 year max or a net of $75 mil over how ever many years he wants. If he performs at his current level you'd probably be ahead in year 1 and maybe 2, but year 3 and beyond would be a loser for the team most likely (ages 31/32/33).
Of course, he could be an exception ala Mike Schmidt (won an MVP at 31 and 36), George Brett (2nd in MVP at 32), or he could be more like Wade Boggs (115 OPS+ post 30, 151 30 and before, still a 3+ WAR player until he was 39 just not MVP level). But those 3 were consistent MVP contenders year in year out, Chapman isn't. Donaldson from 31-33 was 11.0 WAR, 34-now 6.1 (3 years). Still a good player but not a 'wow' one. Also note all of these guys were FAR better with the bat than Chapman is. So, what to expect? I'd expect a slow decline so if the Jays people figure he can hold on for 5 years then you can consider a 5 year $100-125 million deal but it is risky, especially with 2 kids almost ready in Barger and Martinez. Basically I'd risk his walking this winter and be solid on the price tag. I'd hate to see him go, but I see a long term investment in a 3B whose #1 asset is defense as he goes into his 30's as a poor choice unless you can get a great deal.
Interesting hire; I like it. If the org needs to scapegoat Ross Atkins for some reason, now they have an in-house replacement.
A couple of early spring notes. It's nice to see the Jays have a lot of bullpen guys who throw hard. Most won't start with the team but it feels like jays are in a much better position this year when relievers get hurt (which they will). I know spring doesn't matter much but starting to wonder if Barger can make the team outright. He might be Jays' best 2Bman right now. Also, trying to figure out what exactly Biggio's role on the team is. He's a decent player but he's probably the team's 3rd or 4th best 2Bman and 3rd best 1Bman. Where are his PAs coming from?
The Yankees have a handful of rookie position players in their mix.
Not the time to pay more for less.
They will have a bunch of decisions at other positions soon enough.
Regarding long term deals to Jays players, I will wait and see. The player should take as much as he can.
Here is an excerpt:
I’ve got this huge book on art that I’ve wanted to read since I bought it, and I’ve promised myself: “Before you die, you’re going to read this book.” And, uh, I’m trying not to read it so I don’t die.
Why? They are not close to the third tier, when draft picks start to be impacted. So its just money.
They have Ryu, the ghost of Randall Grichuk, Merrifield, Belt, Chapman, KK and Bass coming off the books. And the tax floor is $4 million higher next year.
Its possible that Berrios and Kikuchi stabilize the rotation for next year, with Ricky T waiting in the wings. So Ryu can walk - or maybe he will resign at a lower salary. Bass should be replaceable internally. A DH type like Belt should be easy to come by (or maybe Horowitz takes another step forward), and defense first OF like KK are not that hard to find either. Really the main question is Chapman. Maybe Barger is ready for next year and can play the position. He certainly has the arm and SS tend to be able to play 3B.
Overall, they seem to be set up reasonably well to stay under the first tax threshold if they want next year. Anyway, as long as they stay away from the third tier, there is not a huge impact.
On a second note (not a complaint but an observation) my Batter's Box page has been displaying much older headers under the Hot Topics banner which has inadvertently led me down the cobblestones of Memory Lane; ... revisiting old posts of the last 20 plus years and reminding me of the 'friendentidies' that I could always count on to discuss all things Jays & Baseball. ... A small respite of the positive and the ever hoped & longed for from the banalities of the day-to-day. Not only 'where have you gone Joe DiMaggio' but where have Named for Hank, robertdudek, Dave Till, the Southpaw, out in leftfield, Thomas and the many, many other posters of over the years gone ?
Gerry ... aka by me as 'the go to guy with the inside track with all the answers' ... would it be possible, as the guys with the drum in the 500 level used to do, arrange a get together, a face to face over a beer one night in one of the new levels of the SkyerrRogersDomeCentre where we could finally toast our over twenty years of comradery.
We are probably in sufficient numbers to pool some monies to possibly even rent one of those new private boxes ... even better, an official Batter's Box night where we could honour the hard work and dedication of those that keep this site going and to those that have stedfastly supported the Jays through the proverbial thick and thin over these many seasons.
Boone didn't even make yesterday's game.
There is a focus now on guys who will be leaving for the WBC and prospects who are trying to show what they have.
Richards, Espinal, Pop, Lopez
I'm begging you please don't take my catcher.
I am on the Addison Barger bandwagon. I watched the game on saturday and I was very impressed. That kid is built! Kind of reminds me of Ken Caminiti
This would be a good year for the Jays to take advantage of the talent on hand and win a WS.
Do not allow him to provide captions for those photographs.
I can not stress this enough.
And surely he answers - as I would - this is an awesome way to spend my time, a truly magnificent way to make a living.
I guess Lukes would be the next guy on the list, but tbh, I feel like, barring a superior player becoming available for free, he will win the final spot on the roster. I'm sure pulling for him!
I always read Tammy Rainey at BJN, This is a fun read if you like thinking of the 17th man on the bullpen depth chart, as I do.
https://bluejaysnation.com/news/bullpen-bonanza-sifting-through-the-relief-corps
did she miss anyone?
With 2 days rest Pearson may pitch today. Pearson and Kikuchi need to develop confidence. Their stuff is good.
https://torontosun.com/sports/baseball/toronto-blue-jays/no-jacket-required-blue-jays-pack-away-home-run-jacket-as-part-of-gritty-new-attitude
If that's the plan, I imagine that reduces Lukes' opportunities for playing time.
Meanwhile, Otto Lopez is getting a lot of at bats, including time in CF & SS. That looks like he might have the inside track for a roster spot right now.
Belt will get his ABs. He is a good and experienced LHH to play 1B/DH/PH. In key situations he most likely will be PR for. Lukes and Lopez can do that. Neither needs AAA development any more. So either can sit on the bench. I don't see either becoming a PH option because we have enough good hitters. Would Schneider PH for Jansen/Espinal/Merrifield/Biggio? IMO probably not.
I don't think anyone earns an Opening day promotion based on ST. But I could be wrong especially in the pen. This looks like a set roster to me other than the 26th spot.
Yesterday Manoah and Pearson threw a lot of pitches. Pearson had a positive outing. All the other pitchers threw 15 or less pitches for their 1 inning of work. So control was good. Romano, Pop and Danner threw under 10 pitches which is impressive. But the quality of the hitters faced was nothing great.
I still think Lukes beats Lopez To start the season. It feels like the Org might have promise Lukes a shot out of the gate, TBH, just based on their history with him as a prospect and the renewed focus on CF calibre D in the OF.
Sorta feels unfair to keep a guy that age, never called up thus far, as AAAA depth
@bnicholsonsmith
Vlad Guerrero Jr. considered day to day per manager John Schneider, who expressed optimism that Guerrero Jr. will be fine. Jays will evaluate Vlad Jr. tomorrow. No MRI planned. Slated to leave for DR & WBC Sunday.
Sun Mar 5: 1pm PHI @TOR
Tue Mar 7: 1pm TOR @PIT, 11pm CUB @NED (in Taiwan, 1st WBC game)
Wed Mar 8: 1pm MIN @TOR, 3pm Canada's WBC Team @ Cubs (SN1), (other WBC games 6am, 10pm, 11pm)
Thu Mar 9: 1pm ATL @TOR, (WBC games 5am, 6am, 10pm, 11:30pm)
Fri Mar 10: 1pm TOR @BOS, (WBC games 5am, 6am, 10pm, 11pm)
Sat Mar 11: 1pm BAL @TOR, 7pm DOM @VEN (1st Dominican Republic WBC game, in Miami), (7 other WBC games, all day)
Sun Mar 12: 3pm GBR @CAN (1st Canada WBC game, in Phoenix), 10pm MEX @USA, etc.
Mon Mar 13: 1pm BOS @TOR, 10pm CAN @USA (SN1), etc.
“Nate Pearson, RHP, Blue Jays: 100.8 mph, 101.0 mph K's
“Pearson missed all of the 2022 season, but the 26-year-old flamethrower has returned with the same triple-digit fastball that once made him a top prospect. Pearson has recorded strikeouts this spring at 100.8 mph (Josh Donaldson) and 101.0 mph (Canaan Smith-Njigba), which bodes well for him in his new relief role.
“Ricky Tiedemann, LHP, Blue Jays: 99.4 mph K
“Pearson isn't the only Blue Jays pitcher overpowering hitters this Spring Training. The 20-year-old Tiedemann, MLB's second-ranked left-handed pitching prospect, is doing it, too. Tiedemann blew away Javier Báez with a 99.4 mph fastball in his spring debut, and also got Matt Vierling with a nasty 85.9 mph changeup … which might actually be his best pitch. It's a nasty combo -- there was a 13.5 mph velocity differential between the two strikeout pitches, but their movement looked the same, as both got 16 inches of arm-side run.”
The Jays coaching and FO personnel are not talking that much about these guys. More generalities talk mainly which is the way I like it.
I don't know what the plan for the prospects is for opening day assignments. Minors probably. In 2 weeks march 18 I expect pitchers like Danner to throw maybe 40 pitches. That should be 2+ innings. Jeunger maybe 65/70 pitches so 5 innings. But where? We will see.
Fun to look at spring stats - for catchers we have 4 NRI's plus Jansen so far, 7 NRI 2B/3B/SS vs 8 roster guys, 10 NRI vs 4 roster in OF, 3 roster vs 5 NRI at 1B/DH, RH starter 4 roster 1 NRI, LH starter 2 roster (Kikuchi & Mayza) 0 NRI, 25 RH relievers (12 NRI, 13 roster), 5 LH relievers (all NRI).
For comparisons...
- 40 man roster: 5.02 ERA 10.3 H/9 5.6 BB/9 11.1 K/9 0.3 HR/9
- NRI: 5.16 ERA 9.7 H/9 4.9 BB/9 10.6 K/9 0.9 HR/9
- 40 man hitters: 272/357/426 - 783 OPS 4 SB 4 CS
- NRI hitters: 252/354/431 - 785 OPS 1 SB 0 CS
10+ PA: 284/361/442 - 803 OPS - a bit better for the guys getting more chances to play. These are Barger, Biggio, Espinal, Chapman, Eden, Varsho, Lopez, Guerrero Jr., Horwitz. Cam Eden is the only NRI to get 10+ PA so far (2 for 10, both singles, so not taking advantage of it). Guys facing the worst opponents (sub 5 quality - basically low A pitchers they are facing) are Orelvis Martinez, Kiermaier, Lukes. So take any of their stats with a MASSIVE grain of salt. Given Lukes has faced weak opponents and done poor (508 OPS) I think he is not the favorite for 26th man, Lopez has faced 7.7 quality (just shy of AAA) and hit 333/400/556 so he has to be seen as in the lead for that slot given his opportunity vs better quality opponents and doing more vs them.
It'll be interesting to see how this changes in a few weeks as the 'real' ML players get serious and the kids/NRI's vanish.
"If Pearson earns a slot then Richards has to be gone imo (1 2/3 IP so far, 6 H 4 R 3 ER 1 BB 3 SO - he is who he is, can K anyone but also wild and unreliable imo)."
Me agrees regarding Richards. However, me thinks - at this point in the state of the evolution of the universe, and the current evolutionary level of Pearson that he too shares a bit too much uncertainty to be an accountable arm at the major league level. Make him the closer at AAA or AA and let him prove me wrong.
Mind you, proving me wrong is not a big accomplishment. She Who Must Be Obeyed manages to do it several times a day without working up a sweat...sigh.
Lopez will feature prominently in Team Canada.
They seem to have several options for the 6th, 7th, 8th starter and to cover injuries in the pen as well.
Ryu and Chad Green are coming back mid-year.
IF anyone is making a strong statement in the pen it isn't Pearson but Julian Fernandez who in 3 IP has allowed 1 hit, 0 walks, and 6 strikeouts. He has 6 ML games with the Rockies in 2021 (6 2/3 IP 10.80 ERA) and is a RHP. He K's a lot and walks a lot (10 K/9 and 5 BB/9 in AAA last year), still he might be a good one to keep an eye on - guys at 27 sometimes pick up a new pitch or figure something out on the mound and can give you 2 or 3 good years before going pumpkin again. It'd be nice if he could do that for the Jays.
In the end it is still very, very early in spring and LOTS will change. I just find it fun to look for extremes. Most K's in spring is 9 so far (Max Fried for Atlanta), most walks 7 for Kade Strowd of Baltimore. Cimber has hit the most batters at 3 (ouch), Joey Krehbiel must have a sore neck after giving up 4 HR (Baltimore). Drew Strotman has given up 13 ER in just 2/3 of an inning for SF for an amazing 175.50 ERA. No one has won more than 2 or lost more than 2 so far.
For hitters, 5 guys have 3 HR, Christian Encarnacion-Strand (not related to Edwin afaik) of Cincinnati has 8 RBI (1 ahead of Capra and others), Juan Brito of Cleveland has 7 walks, Zac Veen of Colorado loves the big bases with 7 SB vs 1 CS (with 6 H and 1 BB not easy to have 8 attempts - I hope he makes it as I'd love a super-aggressive baserunner being around again). There are 2 500 hitters, with Henry Ramos of Cincinnati at 583 to lead the way (yes, batting average not Slg%), he also lead in OBP at 600. Jordan Walker (StL) is #1 in Slg% at 1167 (9 for 18 with 3 HR and 3 2B will do that).
Like I said, it is early. Fun stuff to look at but I doubt Zac Veen will have 30 SB in spring, or anyone will hit 500 over the month. But it is fun to see for at least a brief period.
Tom Henke is definitely the most worthy among historical Blue Jays, with perhaps Jimmy Key next on the list.
Buck Martinez & Jerry Howarth also deserve the honour.
I was wondering how the names will be displayed in the new outfield / stadium configuration . . .
* * *
Earlier today, I saw some dude with the Blue Jays logo tattooed on his neck!
Here is who is there.
- Players: George Bell, Joe Carter, Carlos Delgado, Tony Fernandez, Roy Halladay, Dave Stieb.
- Executives/Mangers: Paul Beeston, Cito Gaston, Pat Gillick
- Radio/TV: Tom Cheek
years).
- For the early years no representation (1977-1982) but for good reason, those teams sucked (dead last every year, 100+ losses or on pace for it 4 of those. Stieb is the only player one could say was here for that (79-82) and he was great but he belongs in the next category.
- For 1983-1990, first great era - Bell, Stieb, Fernandez
- For 1991-1993, 2nd great era - Carter (Fernandez was a key to both of these eras)
- For 1994-2012, lost era - Halladay, Delgado
- For 2013-2018, 3rd great period - Bautista shortly
- For 2019-now, 4th great period - we are many years away from this one being done.
So who would I add? Pre 83, no one (one could argue Alfredo Griffin, our first major award winner with a ROY). 83-90 there are many candidates (Henke, Moseby, Barfield, Key, McGriff, Whitt) with others worth talking about (Damaso Garcia for example). 91-93 you have Winfield (yeah just 1 year but he was vital well beyond stats), Borders (WS MVP), Molitor (other WS MVP), Ward (no way we win in 93 without), Olerud, Guzman, Devon White. Lost years you get Vernon Wells, Shannon Stewart, and others I'm not thinking of right now. 2013-18 you have Encarnacion, Donaldson, Martin, Pillar, Happ, Stroman as worth thinking about. Current era will obviously be Bo, Vlad, Springer, and others but we'll see what happens as time goes by.
The current setup is just 1 or 2 per era it seems. Stieb is an oddity as he played in 4 eras (he was here for 1991/2 and 1998) and if it wasn't for that injury in 1991 he might have had a longer career and made the HOF. Sigh. So Encarnacion to go with Bautista for the 2015/16 teams (maybe Donaldson in the future but no time soon). And the current team will be Bo & Vlad and maybe Manoah.
I'd love the Jays to add a real team HOF with photos/displays and an annual celebration where someone is inducted each year (limit of 1 per year). Start with a group induction for the level of excellence, then add new ones annually. Have it be you need to be retired 2+ years for the team HOF, 4+ for Level of Excellence, and in the HOF for number retirement (5+ since retiring). The team HOF could then hold fan favorite guys like Ernie Whitt while the Level requires you to be a real star (very exclusive like now) with retired numbers being super rare. Hmm... will they retire Fred McGriff's given he did spend a big part of his career here and should've been on the Level of Excellence a long time ago but his #19 is shared with Bautista who won't ever get into the HOF (sorry 344 HR and under 1000 RBI for a slugger will never get him in) and Paul Molitor who is there but mainly for his time in Milwaukee. I doubt it but it has to be considered.
So appealing that it's never, ever happened. After a couple of false starts (the Grays, the Eclipse) Louisville became the Colonels in 1884 and they stayed Colonels after becoming a minor league city, right up to 1972. They became the Redbirds when they were a Cardinals farm team, and they've been the Riverbats (or just Bats) since being affiliated with Cincinnati. But never Sluggers.
I suspect this may have something to do with the association of "Louisville Slugger" with the corporation that still manufactures the Louiville Slugger. It's still Hillerich & Bradsby, just as it was when they registered the name back in 1894. But they make them now for Wilson Sporting Goods, which is now a subsidiary of a Finnish multinational which is in turn a limited liability company of a Chinese retail conglomerate.
FWIW, Busch Stadium is now my "home" park and I have a full STL scouting report for anyone else here who's headed down for the opening series and looking for stuff to do between games.
And it rather belatedly occurs to me that the obvious reason this is the case is because Missouri, Wisconsin, and Washington all send senators and congresspeople to the other Washington.
But they make them now for Wilson Sporting Goods, which is now a subsidiary of a Finnish multinational which is in turn a limited liability company of a Chinese retail conglomerate.Which, of course, is entirely owned by the Sheinhardt Wig Corporation (corporate motto: "Not Poisoning Rivers Since 1997").
Jansen and Kirk both rate very highly.
Carlos Santana took Tiedemann deep for a two run shot.
Danner also gave up a home run.
Still obv something to watch but I’m more concerned about the amount Bassit and Manoah are down on their FB velocity. Also just as concerned that the new pitching rules on stops and how that affects Gausmans delivery. So that leaves Berrios and well I don’t know if he’s fixed anything so I hardly trust him either. Anyway to me Kikuchi right now is the only starter looking up in this rotation.
First-round announcers are listed at https://twitter.com/MLBNetworkPR/status/1628823330814828546 .
Buck Martinez (with Rich Waltz) is doing the first-round games from Phoenix (including Canada and U.S. games).
Loud (if small) crowd for the noon (local) game in Taichung today. Presumably will be bigger when the home team plays this evening.
That was brought to over 50% last year but too many of those were balls.
I expect he'll be close to 35% fastball when it is all said and done.
Now, to go back to major leagues starters needing to throw lots of fasballs, there are a few things to keep in mind. Knuckleballers survive without it. The fastball is important because it's the pitch that's easier to throw for a strike. But that doesn't seem to apply to Kikuchi. He does throw a cutter, which is basically a low velocity fastball.
The Yankees have been pushing their starters to throw fewer fastballs. It was awkward when they acquired Happ because he was throwing his fastball over 70 of the time.
I still find it odd that they're not even trying get him to work on the fastball command in spring games given it's his greatest weakness.
For what it's worth, statcast has not identified a cutter for Kikuchi all spring.
Any chance they might use Kikachi as a funky change of pace reliever like Climber? Can't never have too much funk.
And they were dancing and singing, and moving to the groving.
He also has a splitter.
I think it's still too early to study the pitch mix.
Experienced starters are expected to do their things. Whatever works for them.
The clock doesn't seem a problem for him which was one of the big questions.
Pitchers can now wear pitchcom and call their own game.
That's probably a huge plus for a guy who needs an interpret.
So with our 1st pick we got a potential star. Our 2nd pick was a polished University pitcher CJ Van Eyk who I believe got paid close to slot. IMO no discount. The other 3 picks IMO were lower ranked players to be signed at discounts so that A Martin could be signed for $7 Mil. So an excellent strategy financially. I don't count Shane Farell's 2020 draft as a proper evaluation of his performance. His 1st draft I believe.
I liked Asa Lacey and Max Meyer but both were gone before our pick. Robert Hassell III, taken #8 but ranked #16 was someone I liked but too low ranked for #5. The 5th pick was too high to take any of the players I liked like R Hassell III and Zack Veen. I had not even heard of Jordan Walker picked #21 but ranked #33.
I would not give up on him just yet. He destroyed the AFL, and although his OBP is inflated by a lot HBP, he could do well as a speedy, OBP infielder.
Having said all that, he doesn't look all that different from an Otto Lopez
Btw, Martin this spring is 0-4 with a HBP and a Sac Fly and a stolen base against 6.7 quality players (between A+ and AA quality). Lopez vs 6.9 quality (a tiny bit better competition but not much) is hitting 467/529/667 0 SB vs 1 CS with 3 games at SS, 2 in CF, and 1 in RF. I expect him to break camp with the team. He was an IFA in 2016 (no bonus listed that I could find, suggesting he wasn't a premium sign).
What is the measure of Bauxite enthusiasm for this season?
I find myself increasingly optimistic watching these Spring games. I like the pitching in depth in Buffalo for the first time since Shapiro and Atkins promised to stack the Bisons. Intriguing arms in the pen, and plenty of length at least from the starters.
I'm increasingly positive that Lukes is gonna be the 26th guy. He looks good defensively to me, the big question mark, and given his age and history with Shapiro and Atkins, I think we owe him. I mean, it's now or never for the guy. keeping him as break glass in case of emergency depth in Buffalo wouldn't sit right with me.
Stacking Buffalo!! Casey Lawrence is a good example 35 years old who pitched almost 150 innings last year. He was very successful in Buffalo, helping them to a winning 2022. Keeping the fans in Buffalo happy will make for a long term commitment to the Jays. Very convenient. Regarding prospect development in Buffalo for 2022 I can only think of Groshans, Moreno and Max Castillo as top ranked prospects. Groshans developed in 2022 353 AAA ABs. Moreno was the clear #3 behind Jansen & Kirk in large part because they were good and Moreno missed all of ST basically, so opportunity did not knock. Castillo dominated AAA like Manoahish 5 games 27 IP 0.66 ERA. V good and V fast. We have more potential quantity of high ranked prospects starting in AAA and being promoted in 2023. For example Zulueta starts in AAA and maybe Tiedemann. 5 games and they are up? Robberse starts in AA IMO and then goes to AAA if he earns it. Then the Majors if he earns that.
Last year: Springer, Vlad, Espinal, Kirk, Manoah, Romano
2021: Bo, Merrifield, Gausman, Kikuchi, Bassitt
2019: Chapman, Berrios
2016: Belt (OK, it has been awhile for him, but MVP votes in 2020)
Checking obvious potentials: in 1992/3 Stottlemyre was part of the rotation and he never made an All-Star team, Hentgen made his first in 1993, same for Ward (their closer in '93), Guzman made his first in '92, Pat Borders (#1 catcher) never made an all-star team, Olerud's first was in '93, Manny Lee never did, nor did LF Candy Maldonado, Ed Sprague didn't until years later, I could go on, but clearly the 2 WS teams didn't have anywhere near the # of past all-stars that this years team does. 1985 was full of kids who would do it but hadn't yet (Bell, Barfield, Fernandez, Whitt wasn't a kid but would make that '85 ASG as Key did). Same in '87 with some kids who hadn't been all-stars yet but would soon (Gruber for example).
Scariest rotation was probably 1998's with Clemens coming off a Cy Young, Hentgen a year away from his, Guzman 2 years from winning the ERA title, a very young Chris Carpenter who hadn't done anything yet, an extremely young Roy Halladay who'd get his first 2 ML starts that year, plus Dave Stieb trying a very improbable comeback. They won the most games of the dead era (1994-2014) in the end but it was nowhere near enough.
I really, really, really like this teams chances. With health (always a big if) the potential is there for 2023 to be a very special year.
The infield will probably see some progress (not massive) with Mattingly helping Vlad and everyone who backs him up (Belt, Biggio). Bo should improve too as he knows that was going to be the Jays #1 attack if he went to arbitration. Chapman had a sub=par for him year at 3B last year with the massive shifting so losing that should help him. Espinal will have fewer innings but with rest might be more solid when in the field and able to give Bo more rest. Merrifield isn't bad at 2B nor is Biggio but neither are Espinal level. Lopez should be a decent backup but no idea on his defense (promising that he is playing some innings at SS in spring).
I suspect the new pitch com for pitchers (so they can call the game themselves) will help veteran staffs like the Jays have (Gausman, Bassitt, Berrios, Kikuchi, and eventually Ryu) and not hurt young vets like Manoah.
The net effect is a much more solid rotation which should go longer thus saving the pen and reducing innings for guys at the back end like Richards. This is a massive net gain for the Jays. Massive. The 3.87 ERA last year was just over the FIP of 3.85 the Jays had in 2022 but this year I expect the FIP to be visibly higher than the ERA. Surprisingly the team ERA in 1992 and 1993 was higher than the FIP those years despite Devon White in CF probably due to Carter on a corner and Winfield (a DH) in RF often in 92 and other not so good defensive players around. 1985, the 99 win year, had a FIP of 3.92 vs ERA of 3.31 with a young fast OF (Bell-Moseby-Barfield all fast with 20+ SB that year, Tony Fernandez who made lots of errors but had crazy range, etc.). That '85 team is a lot closer to this years than others imo - this is a very good thing. If we can get a few great years this could be a super-fun time.
I grew up watching Barfield and White. Honestly, an elite defensive play is as exciting as any. A team that can steal some more bases too? That can mix and match with legit depth everywhere? Varsho has struggled this Spring, but his ability to be an emergency catcher and a legit elite CF? Espy good all over in the IF?
The way I see it now, Merrifield backs up LF, Biggion RF, Varsho CF and Lukes is a legit 5th OF, the defensive replacement guy who can get on base, steal a bag. His ceiling is likely the platonic ideal of that guy, and with Lukes' skills, his floor is likely closer to Tapia than Zimmer.
All of those configurations look good to me. Biggio lobbied Snider for more playing time at different positions and looked good on a catch in RF last time I saw him out there.
Espinal will likely be playing a lot, pinch-hitting, pinch-running, defensive replacements. He is the key to match-ups in the IF. I imagine Merrifield and Biggio both get some games, but Espy might run away with the job.
The reason I like the Buffalo starting depth is that the guys are accepting of their place on the depth chart. Hutch and Lawrence know they are back-end depth, the want to be in the organization, and while I still think these minor-league guys are underpaid and exploited, I think it's increasingly clear that our FO is making Buffalo an attractive choice for minor league FAs. Guys with a future in coaching, or a a track-record of AAAA success. Wynton Bernard has ties to the city and at age 32, chose to sign here.
And no more more fringe prospects stalled in the starting depth cue. Hatch and Kay might have lost a chance at a big-league income in the pen in they'd been shifted earlier.
bpoz, I think you are right about making the Bisons competitive - cultivating an exciting AAA team, one that is close geographically and shares a fan base, feels something like what the Raps have been doing with the 905, and the Leafs with the Marlies and Growlers. This can only help build the brand and the team philosophy. And I love going to see the Bisons.
What a story Bernard is, by the way. from Wiki, last season, 'after recording a base hit and a stolen base, he became the oldest player to do so in their major league debut since 1907'. I don't wish for injuries to the big league roster, but dude is 6th on the depth chart, and I expect he will get time in the bigs this year. I expect he expects this too.
Adding Mattingly and James Click are great moves. The players are certainly expressing the impact Mattingly has had on them so far this Spring. (One of the few advantages of being cancelled - I can watch the Spring games this year).
Click is in a pillow-contract situation and is likely better regarded in the industry than Atkins - and that's not a dis to Atkins, who continues to look like another Shapiro to me. Like, I could see him replacing a popular GM elsewhere, getting called Darth Vader and then gradually winning the fans around when smart, long-term planning begins to pay off.
And the wildcard of adding Green, (and to a lesser extent, Ryu), down the stretch all adds up to a sneaky-good offseason. I will never predict 100 wins, but it doesn't feel crazy this year. Probably the best potential since the championship teams.
Gotta love the spring. Skittles and beer, all day long.
Actually... no. Well, Garth Iorg and Dennis Lamp. A platoon infielder and a middle reliever. But no one else. Strange perhaps, but there you go. None of the key players had their best seasons, and some would have much better ones at other times.
The Jays could put themselves in a good position this season just by staying relatively healthy.
Never count out the Evil Empire, though.
NYY trading away relievers Chapman and A Miller in 2016 was odd because they gave up. That year TB was out as well. Boston did not make it to the WS. That was a good year for Jay's fans.
Brandon Belt makes his debut today.
I think we're looking at a great hitting and fielding season from the Jays. If one of the youngster pitchers emerges up to near their ceiling this year, and all other pitchers hold to near expected results, then I think we got a good shot at first place. I'm hopeful but not optimistic either of both those will happen. If neither or only one happens, I think we'll be in dogfight with Yanks/Tampa and one of Boston or Baltimore all year for those top three spots in the AL East.
AL EAST OVER/UNDER WINS
N.Y. Yankees 94.5
Toronto 90.5
Tampa Bay 89.5
Boston 78.5
Baltimore 76.5
AL CENTRAL OVER/UNDER WINS
Cleveland 86.5
Minnesota 84.5
Chicago White Sox 83.5
Detroit 68.5
Kansas City 68.5
AL WEST OVER/UNDER WINS
Houston 97.5
Seattle 86.5
Texas 81.5
L.A. Angels 81.5
Oakland 59.5
Funny, I look at that Boston roster and I can't help but see a last place team.
This is another example of a team locking up a young player at a reasonable cost and buying out some free agency year. The Blue Jays inability, or refusal, to do something similar is something continues to stand out. Even if Bo, and maybe Vlad, are difficult to lock up, I've never heard anything that suggests the Jays are trying to do this with Manoah or Kirk or, heck, even Varsho. (Of course, I'm not saying the numbers would be the same and there'd be different considerations as to what makes sense value-wise.)
Are you saying the Jays are in the minority of teams that refuse to/are unable to lock up young players to long term contracts?
Not really. The 1985 Jays weren't particularly lucky (26-21 in one-run games) and Dave Stieb was historically unlucky. But no one on the team was actually bad, and back in the Olden Times teams used to have players in the lineup who simply weren't very good. The Jays worst hitter was Damaso Garcia, and the other AL contenders had far, far worse hitters than Garcia - Bobby Meacham! Jackie Gutierrez! - in their every day lineups. The Jays also had the best pitching and defense in the league, even though the back end of the rotation and the front of the bullpen were both subject to revision along the way.
Interesting. How did that happen?
It wasn't a big spread in 1992 (3.80 FIP, 3.91 ERA) and was mostly the work of three pitchers - Key, Henke, Ward - who posted an ERA significantly lower than their FIP. Morris and Wells had ERAs higher than their FIP number. These were not enormous spreads as a rule, mostly in the range of half a run per nine innings. The largest by far was Henke, but he only worked 55.2 IP. Guzman and Stottlemyre were a wash.
1993 was similar in that the team ERA was slightly higher than the FIP (4.21 to 4.13). But the individual difference were wild. Stottlemyre's ERA was almost a run higher than his FIP (4.84 to 3.91) , Morris' ERA was 1.5 higher (6.19 to 4.51). Meanwhile Hentgen and Stottlemyre posted ERAs close to a run lower than the FIP figure, and Stewart was quite a bit below his as well.
Maybe the thing I like the best about this year’s team is how every single member of the batting order (and their back-ups) should be a tough out, so that much of the time, our pitchers should be able to pitch with a comfortable lead or with confidence that any deficit can be readily overcome.
Yea, it’s spring, but hope seems somehow more justified this year than for many a long year!
The answer is they choose not to or unable to do so. I don't see another option? I suspect the answer is that they are not able to do so, rather than they are outright choosing not to.
If they cannot do so, either the players are outright refusing to sign these deals wherein they sacrifice any years of free agency or the Jays and the players are valuing these deals very differently.
I can see indications that suggest Bo and Vlad may be quite difficult players to sign, but I find it a bit hard to believe that every young player on the team (i.e. Manoah, Kirk, etc...) would not sign one of these deals, which suggests that there is a disconnect in how they value an extension versus the player. And, while we don't know the nature of that disconnect, it's certainly not a point in this front office's favour that none of these players have signed.
The one deal that did sign that is somewhat comparable, even if it's not signing a player with 0-2 or 3 years of big league service, is Berrios'. And we're all crossing our fingers that 2022 was an exception, not the new norm.
Carroll also seems to fit that description. The contract will guarantee him a lot of money before he reaches his early-30s, despite a significant shoulder injury the season before last. Arizona may well end up with a bargain (no guarantees that it’ll work out, but the odds seem pretty good that it will).
Bichette and Vlad Jr. seem to be in a different category. They presumably want much more money than Carroll signed for (even if they may be no more valuable than him over the next 8-9 years). Manoah (because he’s a pitcher) and Kirk (because of his body type and diminished performance in the second half last year) seem riskier candidates for a long-term extension, despite being very good players.
Mix in that Bichette and Vlad both were rich when born and have Dad's who know MLB inside/out and you have 2 guys who have a massive incentive to hold off until free agency hits. Manoah and Kirk don't have that luxury but both are bigger risks than Bo & Vlad when you look at 10 year deals, plus right now the Jays literally hold all the leverage (pre-arb) so minimal need to do a long term deal in an effort to save a few bucks in 5 years.
Guerrero is the only guy I would like to keep for another decade.
The important thing is to keep developing players.
The Longoria, Acuna Jr., Franco, and Carroll extensions were negotiated when the player was around 20-22, at the very outset of their careers, as opposed to age 25-27 for the Romero and Rios extensions. And they were all #1 prospect-type, truly elite two-way position players. Those are the types of player you want to bet on if you’re going to go this route.
I have not been able to get as interested in ST this year. It is often mentioned and we see it often that few regulars are in the lineup some games. I am sure this is by design. So the regulars are preparing without much media coverage.
A "good" prospect like J Kasevich has only had about 100ABs. All in A- yet he may face a AAA veteran that learned a lot of tricks to use against an inexperienced prospect. So the inexperienced prospect would look quite lost in the AB.
Groshans was interviewed last year and said AA pitchers ALL throw V hard but many have little control and command. Then he got to AAA and faced a lot of pitchers that were not overpowering but had V good control. So quite the adjustment.
The next level is the Majors where both hitting and pitching is V hard.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yHTxtQAckAU
Encore!
And the Oscar Gamble goes to . . .
"Kier Minority Report" (2002)
"Love Is a Many-Splendor-Horwitz Thing" (1955)
"The Greatest Varsho on Earth" (1952)
"The Hound of the Bassittvilles" (1939)
"Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love Kikuchi" (1964)
"Ryu Only Live Twice" (1967)
"Zach Popeye" (1980)
"Billy Maddison Barger" (1995)
"Donnie Baseball Brasco" (1997)
"The Schneider House Rules" (1999)
"East of Dunedin" (1955)
The 95th Academy Awards! Live! Tonight on ABC.
Perhaps there's room for Guerrero: The Wrath of God (1972)?
More generally, part of the advantage, aside from cost savings (which I'm not sure why you dismiss), is signing the player out of free agency. A 6 year deal for Kirk would buy out two years of free agency. A 6 year deal would buy out Manoah's first free agency year.
Finally, an obvious advantage to such a deal is that, in buying them out early, you are getting more prime years of their career. For example, a 6 year deal with Kirk would take him through his age 29 season. He's scheduled to hit free agency after his age 27 season (if my math is right). I'd rather the Jays lock up the age 28 and 29 season at an early stage, rather than trying to sign him the offseason before he becomes a free agent and having to sign him to a 5 or 6 year deal through his early 30s to prevent him from reaching free agency.
I agree who the ideal candidate for extension is, but the Jays don't have a Corbin Carroll (the closest candidate was probably, ironically, Moreno). They do have two other candidates in Kirk and Manoah. They liked Varsho so much to trade a consensus top prospect for him. He's the son of a major leaguer, but he might be another. He's certainly athletic and in his prime.
Maybe they've already tried and the dollars don't work. But the absence is noticeable.
For a smaller market team long term deals with young players is critical because they cannot/won't sign long term deals once they reach free agency. The Rays are a perfect example of this. These long term deals for kids started in the 90's with Cleveland having insane success thanks to doing it for Albert Belle, Kenny Lofton, and others. Then it kind of died off after a few other teams tried and failed (Jays spectacularly so with free agent sized deals for Wells, Rios, and Delgado that all were poorly thought out but got bailed out by the Angels & White Sox for 2 of them). Now they are back in vogue but the challenge is when to sign them. IMO it is quickly or wait until free agency unless you feel it is the only way to keep them for even 1 or 2 years post team initial control. Right now signing Bo or Vlad doesn't make a lot of sense as they'd both want full free agency level pay ($30+ mil per year) for any post team control years, putting the Jays on the hook should anything bad happen. If the Jays feel prices are about to skyrocket (and the players don't think that) then it could make sense but Bo & Vlad are both very smart guys with families that are very knowledgeable about MLB finances.
Right now is a good time for Kirk & Manoah but both carry far more risk than Bo & Vlad. Catchers get hurt, pitchers REALLY get hurt a lot. By waiting the Jays might be able to get full value for 6-7 years out of them for minimal cost, then let someone else pay mega bucks for injury plagued years from them. I see the risk as too high in both cases right now for the Jays to risk losing a ton on them unless they accept a deal that could look crazy team friendly in a few years should they both stay healthy.
Long term deals are a big team risk. The player risks losing a few million to lock in potentially hundreds of millions. The team risks hundreds of millions to save a few million. Clearly risk/reward ratio is poor for teams in that pre-free agency. Once that hits then it is have the player and risk the hundreds of millions or don't have the player and no risk. If Bo or Vlad would stupidly agree to a deal taking them to age 30-32 then I'd say go for it, but both are NOT going to do that. They both want to become free agents in their 20's as that is the sweet spot to get a $200-$400 million deal. Ohtani will shatter the records this upcoming winter but he is a unicorn - a full time superstar pitcher and hitter - that has never been seen outside of 1 or 2 seasons of Babe Ruth so his deal will have minimal effect on the market as a whole I suspect.
FYI: If I ran a team no way I'd have signed that Carroll deal unless I was certain we had a superstar and I mean 100% sure, not 99%. That is putting $100+ million locked in which is in eyeshot of what he'd make anyways in arbitration over 6 years (first 3 ML minimum, then 3 arb at $10-$20-$30 if he is a star = $63 mil total - he doesn't have enough time last year to be a super-two) and a big FA deal ($40 in first year). In fact it is still not making sense even then. I really see that as not being super-well thought out. If he ends up not being a super-star level player then you lose money on this deal. Arizona might save $10-$20 mil in his 2nd free agency year (team option) IF he is a $40 mil player at that point. But that is a massive risk for potential savings 7 years from now. Now, if MLB changes how players are compensated (earlier free agency, or something like that) then it could make sense - that would mean stars would make more and 'meh' guys like Gurriel make less. Otherwise I really don't see the team's savings here.
BTW, the tie-breaker is earned runs divided by defensive outs.
On top of this they are trying to build a young core to keep players and stay credible with fans.
The cynical side of me figures they will just trade him once the contract starts to be expensive and then be able to leverage it for a better return.
The Jays are in a little different position. They dont have anyone that this will work well for, and can actually sign players as FA's.
The Jays had that briefly in potential with Vlad and Bo when they first came up but that was a very brief window and they expanded it by not calling them up until a month+ into their first seasons vs Arizona calling up Carroll late last year (thus guaranteeing 6 full seasons plus 100 PA max potential control).
Is there a special saint to pray to for baseball players health? When I find out who that is, I’ll be on my knees!
Is there a special saint to pray to for baseball players health? When I find out who that is, I’ll be on my knees!
https://twitter.com/BlueJays/status/1635395211257081856
On another note, I read that Tiedemann has shoulder soreness , Andrew Painter has a right UCL sprain - These phenoms that dazzle the radar guns at a very young age always worry me - I hope the Jays take it slow with Tiedemann and I think it would be a good thing if he doesn't see the show this year.
I understand their critique that they don't think Brown's swing will allow him to hit against better pitching but I like him more than this as well. I also think Pinto is potentially a better prospect than listed as well. Jays do have a lot of high ceiling/low floor guys as mentioned in article. I expect most to bust but hopefully a couple make big leaps this year. The system is fine for how much young major league talent the Jays have but hoping and expecting it looks a lot better in a few months.
About Orelvis he notes that "one scout has seen potential plus defence at the hot corner"
Teoscar has hit 385/467/692 so far for Seattle over 5 games, but is 0 for 3 with 2 walks and 2 K's in the WBC.
Basically, just look at the games involving the tied teams, and the tie-breakers are Winning Pct, Runs Allowed per 27 Outs, ERA, Batting Average, Draw Lots.
Bottom line? Canada needs to win vs Mexico. Mexico/USA/Columbia all need to win to have any shot - Columbia advances if they win and Canada wins, USA advances if they win or if they lose and Canada loses. Mexico advances only if they beat Canada. So Columbia and Canada both are cheering on Canada at 3 PM, the US vs Columbia game goes at 10 PM Wednesday with both needing a win to have any shot at advancing (Columbia needing Canada to win also).
Important baseball in March. Great fun. I'm sure the US network with the rights and MLB are both crapping their pants over the fact the USA could be eliminated in the opening round. I figure Mexico and USA will win (sadly) but I'd love Canada & Columbia to win just to mess everything up.
Others who have advanced - Cuba & Italy (all 5 teams in their pool tied 2-2 so tiebreakers needed to clean it up), Japan & Australia advanced too (no tie breakers), Venezuela has advanced with the Dominican Republic vs Puerto Rico at 7 PM tomorrow to decide who goes on (both 2-1).
China and Nicaragua are the only winless teams (both 0-4). Poor China was never in it - lost 8-1, 8-5, 12-2, 22-2. Ugh 50 against vs 10 for. At least Nicaragua was close some times (9-1, 3-1, 6-1, 4-1, net 22-4).
I think Nunez should have made the cut, in the era of the universal DH, all teams can use a good right handed 1B/DH/LF bat.
Highlights include Zac Plesac breaking his thumb while taking off his shirt, and Archie Bradley breaking his elbow trying to get to a brawl. Also a surprising number of pitchers hurting themselves punching stuff.
Team Japan's playoff game at ~7pm Thursday in Tokyo ended ~10:30pm (game time 3:24).
It seems just ~4 hours later their charter flight left ~2:30am Friday Tokyo time (1:30pm Thursday EDT).
It arrived ~13 hours later at ~3am EDT Friday in Miami.
They were at their Miami hotel ~4:30am EDT Friday.
I can't find any reports of them intending to play a spring training game this weekend.
Their next playoff game is Monday 7pm EDT vs Mexico.
(I assume Team Cuba did something similar shifted 24 hours earlier.)
Refs: https://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/en/news/20230318_05/ https://twitter.com/IshrionA/status/1635850856305246208