Batter's Box Interactive Magazine - Andy Burns, Clint Robinson lead New Hampshire

Andy Burns, Clint Robinson lead New Hampshire

New Hampshire scored 16 runs with great performances from their hitting and pitching. Buffalo won both games in a double header versus Syracuse, and Vancouver lost a 19 inning marathon.

Buffalo 6 – Syracuse 2 – Game 1 (7 Innings)

The Bisons scored 6 runs on 9 hits, and 4 walks in game one of the double-header. Kevin Pillar hit his 4th home run of the season along with a double, and Any LaRoche had 3 hits, with a run scored.

Dave Bush threw 7 innings giving up 5 hits, 2 earned runs, with 1 walk, and 8 strikeouts.

Buffalo 4 – Syracuse 1 – Game 2 (7 Innings)

In game two of the double header Chien-Ming Wang pitched a complete game 7 inning, 3 hit outing, only giving up one earned run.

Sean Ochinko had his first home run of the season for Buffalo, and Ryan Goins had 2 hits, of which one was a double.

New Hampshire 16 – Binghampton 5

New Hampshire had 13 hits, and 9 walks this afternoon which amounted to 16 runs by the end of the game. Andy Burns had 2 home runs and Clint Robinson was 4-4 with a HR. Jon Talley, and Brad Glenn each had a home run as well in the offensive explosion. Brett Lawrie was 1-3 with 2 walks, in his second rehab game with NH.

Marcus Stroman had another fantastic start, today he pitched 7 innings, giving up 4 hits, and 2 earned runs, with no walks and 8 strikeouts.

Dunedin 5 – Daytona 2

Kyle Drabek pitched the first two innings of the game, giving up a hit, with no walks and 4 strikeouts. Sergio Santos pitched a clean 3rd inning.

KC Hobson hit his team leading 12th home run of the season, and Shane Optiz had 2 hits contributing to Dunedin’s 5 runs today.

Lansing 1 – Bowling Green 7

Lansing only managed 4 hits today and a run today, two came from Emilio Guerrero who had 2 doubles.

Ben White started for Lansing, he gave up 4 earned runs over 4.2 innings. Justin Jackson pitched next, and gave up 3 runs, on 3 hits, and 3 walks.

Vancouver 4 – Hillsboro 5 (19 Innings)

Vancouver lost a 19 inning game tonight, in a game which the offensive couldn’t manage to put much together. The offense only managed to have 7 hits, and 8 walks, through a 19 inning game which amounted to 4 runs. Ian Parmley was 4-7, with 2 doubles, and a stolen base.

Jeremy Gabryszwski started, going 6 innings, giving up 4 unearned runs, with no walks and 2 strikeouts.

Johnson City 7 – Bluefield 0

Shane Dawson was given the start tonight, followed by Chase DeJong. Shadow Dawson went 4 innings, giving up 6 hits, 3 earned runs, with no walks and 7 strikeouts. Chase DeJong pitched 4.2 innings giving up 8 hits, and 4 earned runs, with no walks and 5 strikeouts.

Mitch Nay had and Melvin Garcia each had 2 hits, in day which Bluefield only managed 6 hits.

Three Stars

3-Marcus Stroman

2-Clint Robinson

1-Andy Burns

Posted by tercet on Sunday, July 07 2013 @ 10:29 PM EDT.

Andy Burns, Clint Robinson lead New Hampshire | 52 comments | Create New Account

The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.

uglyone - Sunday, July 07 2013 @ 11:35 PM EDT (#275958) #

sweet relief seeing Burns finally do something at AA. I was starting to panic.

And Stroman is starting to look real good. Not only is his season line great:

49.2ip, 10.5k/9, 2.2bb/9, 1.11whip, 3.26era

but he's pretty much been freakishly awesome in 9 of 10 starts, with one horrific start (1.0ip, 8r) mixed in. His line in his other 9 starts:

48.2ip, 10.4k/9, 2.0bb/9, 0.97whip, 2.03era

Richard S.S. - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 12:08 AM EDT (#275959) #

Of Toronto's top 10 picks in the Draft, only #1 Phillip Bickford has yet to sign. They have spent $ 1,703,280 on the signings and have $ 1,773,520 in Draft savings. Allowing for the over-budget (4.999%) additional spending, Toronto has $ 1,947,325.23 to spend on picks 11-40.

Still to be signed, 11-40:
11. Jacob Brentz (HS-LHP): interested in signing (3rd - 4th round monies);
17. Eric Lauer (HS-LHP): highly unlikely, Coach fetish???;
22. Sam Tewes (HS-RHP): highly unlikely (4th round monies);
26. Tanner Cable (J1-RHP): interested in signing;
30. Rowdy Tellez (HS-1B): wants 1st round monies (900K-1.2MM);
And then there's:
31. Brison Celek (JR-1B): injury disagreement, NOT SIGNING;
32. Josh Sawyer (HS-LHP): possibly not signing;
33. Edgar Cabral (HS-C): ???;
34. Dave Dunning (HS-RHP); possibly not signing;
35. Akoni Arriaga (HS-RHP): ???;
38. Jon Nunnally Jr (HS-OF): ???;
39. Zachary Levison (HS-SS); ???;
40. Antonio Ruiz (HS-1B).

John Northey - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 01:59 AM EDT (#275961) #

July 12th is the deadline for draft picks to sign. If the Jays can grab Rowdy Tellez then that savings will be very, very useful as he sounds like a potential end of first round pick who fell due to his high demands. He was ranked #59 by Baseball America. Brentz would also be a great signing as he is listed by CBS as being ranked #55.3 (composite ranking of multiple sources). Sam Tewes is interesting in his twitter as right after the draft he said "hate having to make mature decisions in life #DreamOnHold" - suggests he wants to sign but not cheap, I suspect the Jays will try to sneak him in but might be going big on either Brentz or Tellez and are waiting on them.

Should be interesting as the deadline approaches. Wonder if MLB will look at shifting the international signing period start date to a few days after the draft signing deadline is in the future - perhaps just simply making it so the draft deadline is June 30th instead of July 12th. I figure a lot of front offices would prefer that.

Richard S.S. - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 10:53 AM EDT (#275971) #

The move of the former August 15 Draft Signing Deadline to the Friday before the All Star Break (July 12th) was highly sought after, as now even late signings can experience 6-7 weeks of Professional Baseball, Minor League style.

As for the July 1st International Signing period start, it's more "if it's not broken" than any other need. I can't see it being moved before an International Draft is set up.

I consider Brentz and Tellez as priorities. Brent because he wanted to sign, and negotiations were ongoing early. Tellez because he can defend his position well and has huge power upside, something this team hasn't had for many years. Cable recently threw for Blue Jay scouts so there's big interest there.

If Tellez gets $1.0MM (100K slot + 900K over slot); Brentz gets $500K (mid- 3rd/4th monies); and Tewes gets $425K (mid-4th), there should be some monies left. That leaves $322K for further signings.

metafour - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 11:19 AM EDT (#275973) #

If Brentz was willing to sign for $500K, he wouldn't have lasted until the 11th round. Highly athletic LHPs who can sit low to mid 90's and touch 97 dont grown on trees.

I think you're looking at ~$1 million a piece for both Brentz and Tellez. Both are 2nd round talents. Neither are likely to sign for less than 2nd round money IMO.

92-93 - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 12:55 PM EDT (#275975) #

Is there any reason the Jays wouldn't give that $ to those prospects, metafour? It's not like they can bank this excess spending $ for next year.

Beyonder - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 01:20 PM EDT (#275976) #

I didn't agree that punting was a wise strategy last year, but at least I understood it. Draft a guy in the third round who is a first rounder (arguably) by talent but has high demands (Smoral), and then punt picks 4 through 10 to clear up enough slot room to sign him. I don't think you get value when when you do that sort of swap, but I understand the quality vs. quantity rationale.

What they did this year was very different. They started punting much earlier (in the second round with Hollon) prior to having drafted a premium talent -- indeed before they even had any sense of who would be left to them in the later rounds.

Even if you accept what metafour says (and I don't dispute it) re: Tellez and Brentz being second round talents, they aren't: a) second round talents that the Jays necessarily had their eye on, and b) talents they knew they could sign.

And even if the Jays manage to sign an extra two second round talents from their savings, is that really worth punting rounds 2 (at least a partial punt), 3, 4, and 6-10?

Also, while I want the team to do it's own talent assessments, on paper the Jays overdrafted BA's talent assessment (usually dramatically) in each of the first ten rounds.

The Jays seem to have spent too much time looking for guys who would sign on the cheap, and not enough guys who were quality players who would sign for around their slot value.

Mike Green - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 01:57 PM EDT (#275977) #

They are in a rain delay in Manchester, NH. After 4 and 1/2 innings, the F-Cats lead 1-0 making use of their only hit, a Brad Glenn double to drive in an Andy Burns walks. Sean Nolin has been pretty impressive through 5 innings- 2 hits, no walks and 7 Ks. His line for New Hampshire this year- 11 starts, 56 innings, 12 walks and 61 strikeouts, and ERA of 2.38. He had 3 excellent starts for New Hampshire last year. He ought to be promoted to Buffalo. If all goes well, he should be ready for a late August/September callup to the big club.

China fan - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 02:05 PM EDT (#275978) #

Nolin is doing so well at New Hampshire that I'm wondering why he performed so badly in his major-league debut -- was he maybe just very nervous? With the jitters out of the way, will he do better next time? And do you maybe promote him ahead of Stroman because he's got more experience at higher levels?

hypobole - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 02:18 PM EDT (#275979) #

I would promote Nolin ahead of Stroman. In fact, unless the Jays are in the thick of the pennant race (which they aren't now) and need Stroman, there is no good reason to put him on the 40 man.

Mike Green - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 02:20 PM EDT (#275980) #

Good pitchers often perform badly in debuts, whether well-prepared or not. Nolin made his debut with fewer high-minors starts than would be optimal. He does not seem to have been harmed by the experience, so that is good.

I do think that both he and Stroman can be promoted to Buffalo. Both need a minimum of 5 starts there, and preferably more. It should be noted that the Nolin, Stroman and Hutchison are decent prospects for the 2014 rotation. If the club is thinking of adding a starting pitcher, presumably 2013 needs would mostly be what they would be focusing on.

Mike Green - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 02:28 PM EDT (#275981) #

I don't disagree with hypobole, as of right now. It seems to me that the logical course is for the club to promote both to Buffalo and re-evaluate the situation in about mid-August.

85bluejay - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 02:40 PM EDT (#275982) #

I see the draft strategy a little different - last year the Jays clearly punted rds. 4-10 , taking seniors with no prospects status and paying them 5-10 grand, a strategy that was questionable in my view - this year reflected an evolving strategy that I like better - the Jays punted fewer picks, instead many of those early picks have talent but were rated lower than where the jays selected them (some because of injury history) - you don't sign players for 100-500G if they have no talent - only rds. 8-10 seem to be true punts - here's hoping the extra scouting staff pays dividends with those gambles & it allows the team the chance to offer the extra savings to tough to sign prospects without losing that money if a specific prospects says no - July 12th will give us an indication of how well this strategy worked but it will be years before we see if those early gambles pay off - I'm sure the draft strategy will keep evolving.

Richard S.S. - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 02:52 PM EDT (#275983) #

Go to www.bluebirdbanter.com and read the comments (some with links) on the 2013 MLB Draft Signing Table.

Tellez wanted to go 1st round (despite many more better than him), but should accept $1.0MM to sign. Brentz wants 3rd/4th round monies, but wants to sign. He should accept $500K (mid-3rd/4th) to sign. Tewes was disappointed in not going by the 4th round and talks about going to College. He should take $425K (mid-4th) to sign.

Telluz (B.A. rank: 59 - $942,000.00) is the big power bat we never draft and as such should be a #1 priority to sign. Brentz (B.A. rank: 80 - $681,700) is a top quality LHP who wants to sign. Tewes (B.A. rank: 175 - $250,100) should also be signed. That still leaves ($73,525) a little bit left.

This is all prevalent on Bickford not signing. If he signs at slot the $73,525 remaining increases to $219,565. If Bickford sign for below slot, that gets added to the $219,565. There is enough money to sign both Tellez and Brentz with something left over. Waiting for anything to happen is hard.

China fan - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 02:56 PM EDT (#275984) #

"....Both need a minimum of 5 starts there, and preferably more...."

Buffalo is a nice option for the Jays to have, but I'm not sure if their better pitching prospects will always "need" a minimum number of starts at Buffalo. I don't think there should be any kind of inflexible rule about it. Over the years, plenty of pitchers have vaulted straight from AA to the majors, without too many problems. It's more a matter of the team's assessment of their readiness. If they're ready to go, I don't think a specific number of starts at Buffalo should be mandatory. At this point, I would think that Nolin and Stroman are getting close, but it's probably best to give them a few more weeks -- either at New Hampshire or Buffalo. Consistency in coaching and mentoring could also be a factor in deciding where they should be pitching.

I admit, however, that Buffalo is being used differently from how the Jays used Las Vegas last year. It does seem that the better pitching prospects are more likely to spend time at Buffalo, compared to the greater chance of a direct leap from AA to the majors in previous years.

Ryan Day - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 02:58 PM EDT (#275985) #

Nolin was fresh off the DL when the Jays called him up, wasn't he? He hadn't pitched much, so likely wasn't in top form, which would contribute to any MLB-jitters.

Richard S.S. - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 03:13 PM EDT (#275986) #

The reason Prospects are promoted are due to the degree of difficulty they will face at each level. Since the move to Buffalo, we are getting a truer read on each player. To avoid AAA now is overly foolish. If they can't succeed in AAA, why do you think they'll succeed up here?

John Northey - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 03:41 PM EDT (#275987) #

This year was a bit odd. A few injured guys, a few guys who had surges this past year but not everyone is convinced the surge is permanent, stuff like that. I wonder if they guessed there would be quality in the 11 to 40th rounds based on interviews with guys and felt they could get someone of value down there to blow the cash on. Perhaps draft a few (as they did) and hope one takes the bait depending on how big the bait is. Also would allow them to pick a few guys who love to play and want to go pro but were being pressured to go to college by family - then hope to convince those guys to come for a few extra dollars. Few picks after the 10th round ever get a cup of coffee, let along a career, so risking/throwing away a batch of them isn't a big deal (and yes, I know about Orlando Hudson, Jeff Kent and Mike Piazza but they are the extreme exceptions).

Beyonder - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 03:42 PM EDT (#275988) #

"Punting" is hardly a term of art, but no matter how you slice it, the Jays overdrafted pretty consistently the whole way through, beginning with Bickford. Even assuming that Bickford was the best player avaialble on their draft board, the rest of the picks were all pretty large reaches. The rankings below refer to baseball america's top 500 prospects for 2013.

Hollon: Picked 47, ranked 95
Murphy: Picked 83, unranked by BA
Smith: picked 115, unranked by BA
Lietz: 145, 254
Greene: 205, 446
Graveman: 245, 470
Girodo: 265, unranked
Custons: 295, unranked.

I think there is a big difference between setting your sights on a specific high ceiling talent and then doing what it takes to sign him -- and punting picks at the outset of a draft without any sense of who might be available in the later rounds and using the extra cash to sign whoever is left over. And if they don't manage to sign any of these guys, the draft is a total strategy failure.

China fan - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 04:07 PM EDT (#275989) #

Bickford is apparently looking for $4.25-million. He won't get it, but if he gets anything even halfway close to that, it blows a lot of the supposedly available money.

Beyonder - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 04:26 PM EDT (#275990) #

I think that's crazy CF, but it would explain the Hollon signing. The Jays must be absolutely in love with Bickford to not only overdraft him, but also to punt their second rounder in order to free up room. Funny because no one else going into the draft had him rated that high.

CeeBee - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 04:29 PM EDT (#275991) #

CF, where did you see the rumours? I can't find anything past June 10th or so on Bickford.

John Northey - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 04:31 PM EDT (#275992) #

Bickford is a bit delusional if he is asking for $4.25 mil. The value of his slot is listed as $2,921,400 and he was an overdraft as was. One would think the Jays talked with him ahead of time and knew what his demands were, but if they didn't then he could be a big mistake. Also, if he pushes too much he might find himself out millions that he can never make up as being a 10th overall pick makes it hard to climb much higher. Of course, the Jays could punt him this year and use his slot next year (10th or 11th overall, forget the details of the rule) if they feel the draft will be significantly stronger then and use their leftover cash on other guys.

CeeBee - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 04:32 PM EDT (#275993) #

Do ranking factor in college commitments? I'm pretty sure injuries are factored in. Mlb had him ranked 25th, don't know if thats highest, lowest or in between.

Beyonder - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 04:39 PM EDT (#275994) #

Baseball America had him at 25, and Keith Law had him at 55. These are not mock drafts, but rather talent rankings.

China fan - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 04:41 PM EDT (#275995) #

The $4.25 million was apparently mentioned today by Callis and John Manuel in their BA podcast, according to DJF. To be fair, Bickford and his people were apparently aiming for $4.25 million BEFORE the draft, and that would have been "top-four" money, so they've probably reduced their demands since then. But if they had such a lofty target at the beginning, they might not settle for slot.

CeeBee - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 04:51 PM EDT (#275996) #

Slot is around 2.9 I think so I like your halfway close... figure it's gotta be 3m or thereabouts.

Mike Green - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 05:14 PM EDT (#275997) #

In Dunedin this afternoon, the D-Jays were no-hit by Matt Loosen, while Aaron Sanchez took it on the chin over 3 innings.

Richard S.S. - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 05:22 PM EDT (#275998) #

Maximum Bonus Pool of $6,398,200 + 4.999% Overage of $319,909 - existing Bonus Pool Spending of $1,773,520 = remaining Balance for signings of $4,944,589 and no more.

Without Bickford signing, there is a maximum of $1,947,325 to spend on signing picks 11-40 overslot. Bickford signing adds $2,997,264 to the Pool.

Sign Tellez and Brentz for as little or as much of the $1,947,325 as possible. Add the balance to the Bickford total and offer it to the Bickford Camp giving them 12 hours to decide. If they accept -fine. If not, announce they turned down overslot monies for a pick you considered a reach. Then take whatever is left from the Tellez/Brentz signings and try to sign others.

Jdog - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 06:43 PM EDT (#275999) #

Personally I would be thrilled if Bickford ends up not signing. I think the Jays really wanted one of the HS position players and when they weren't available, were left with Bickford as their highest ceiling player. All the experts find taking the next years comp pick as a loss of a year, and a big no-no. That seems to be the company line for all "experts".I feel if you have a high pick it makes more sense to punt the pick and try again next year. Generally there is a top tier of players and i felt like the Jays missed out on that top tier by one slot. I feel like if your in the later first round there will always be the same type of players available and less motivation to not sign a guy ( HS guys with high ceilings and more question marks and college guys with moderate ceilings). But if I have a top 10 pick and I don't get one of the uber prospects or high ceiling college guys I'm tempted to try next year. At the very least sign the highest guy on your list and play hard ball. If they Jays don't sign Bickford and end up getting a high ceiling college pitcher that is not a loss of a year that is gaining a few years. Worst case as far as development time is they sign a similar player and are set back a year.

PeteMoss - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 07:16 PM EDT (#276002) #

Hollon wasn't a punted pick. There was some issues on pre-draft physical which is why he signed for such low dollars.

greenfrog - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 09:28 PM EDT (#276003) #

Bickford sounds like an interesting prospect (big fastball, very good command, impressive makeup, still needs to develop secondary stuff) - somewhat similar to Syndergaard, perhaps?

I expect him to sign, but if he doesn't, it could work out fine. I think Law or another commentator recently said that next year's draft class looks very promising.

ISLAND BOY - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 09:31 PM EDT (#276004) #

What does everyone think Josh Johnson's future will be ? Will AA trade him at the deadline rather than lose him at the end of the season for nothing ? Given his performance, I doubt he would be resigned by the Jays. I read a piece by one commentator who stated that despite being a power pitcher, Johnson won't attack the inner half of the plate, and that seeing as he seems to do better against National League teams,he might be more successful playing with a team in that league.

Richard S.S. - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 09:35 PM EDT (#276005) #

When signing their contracts, Draft Picks get a physical at that time. Hollon's MRI showed UCL problems. Some prior indication was there when he was taken (as a bit of a reach). Regardless, he was a top Pitcher who would go under-slot.

To sign two Overslots, add their $100K slot (each) to the available $1,947,325 = $2,147,325. That allows up to $1.0 MM be offered to each.

Bickford and Family wanted $3.0 MM per draft. Bickford's slot + 4.999% overage = $2,997,264 available. Chances are another pick might sign for $245K or mor.

metafour - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 09:36 PM EDT (#276006) #

From Bob Elliott two days ago:

“We had him as top high school pitcher in the draft, if you wanted to take a chance on upside,” said one scouting director. “Braden Shipley (who went 15th overall to the Arizona Diamondbacks) was closer to the big leagues, but his potential wasn’t as great as Bickford’s.

“We had (Bickford) down as a hard sign. The family wouldn’t meet with us until 48 hours before the draft and they wanted $3 million US.”

Hodgie - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 09:50 PM EDT (#276007) #

LugnutFan, if you see this can you give me your thoughts on Emilio Guerrero. Noticed he hit his fourth homerun today and was wondering if the recent power burst was a fluke or progression on his part. His BB/K numbers are impressive this season and I am curious if his frame will allow him to stick at SS going forward?

John Northey - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 10:02 PM EDT (#276008) #

Given his slot was just over $2.9 mil then $3 mil isn't crazy for Bickford if the Jays really like him. $4 mil though is a bit much.

greenfrog - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 10:26 PM EDT (#276009) #

I'll be interested to see which Jays players/prospects try the weighted ball program this off-season. It might really help someone like Nolin take his game to the next level.

smcs - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 10:31 PM EDT (#276010) #

I'll be interested to see which Jays players/prospects try the weighted ball program this off-season. It might really help someone like Nolin take his game to the next level.

I don't think Nolin would be open to it. I believe it's been Delabar, Cecil and McGowan try it thus far -- 3 guys who have seen their MLB mortality up close. If Romero trusted the team, I could see him doing it, but he's a real wild card at this point. Anyone at the bottom of the bullpen might give it a go if they are brought back, but how many of Neil Wagner, Todd Redmond, Thad Weber etc. are expected to be back?

John Northey - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 10:34 PM EDT (#276011) #

If the weighted ball program takes off it would give the Jays about a 1 year advantage I'd guess. I figure other clubs are starting to look into it with Cecil being an All-Star and Delabar being a near one when both looked done or close to it not that long ago and I figure other clubs will figure out a program similar enough to work for them. The old 'if it did that for them, what would it do for a good pitcher'. Any Jays pitcher who doesn't try the program at least is being silly imo after those results.

greenfrog - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 10:55 PM EDT (#276012) #

Nolin might be fine without it, but look at what the extra arm strength has done for Cecil, both in terms of his fastball velocity and the bite on his breaking ball. I'm sure Cecil wishes he'd started the program a few years ago.

Add Janssen's name to the list of pitchers who are at least experimenting with the program.

Richard S.S. - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 11:06 PM EDT (#276013) #

All Pitchers should ask themselves "Can I make the Majors without it"? If they cannot answer with a resounding yes, they should try the Weighted Ball program. Any College-drafted prospects who aren't in the Majors after 3 years should be using it. Any High School-drafted prospects who aren't in the Majors after 5-6 years should be using it. Why? It can't hurt.

Richard S.S. - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 11:14 PM EDT (#276014) #

If Cal Ripken could play SS, any one trained as a SS should stay as one. However weight could be an issue, but only if range is diminished. What's Emilio Guerrero's problem.

Hodgie - Monday, July 08 2013 @ 11:20 PM EDT (#276015) #

The main impetus behind adopting the weighted ball program is injury prevention (and recovery). Any gain in velocity is viewed as a happy by-product of the program. Given that the Jays have hired Jamie Evans as an exclusive consultant at the pro level, I would be shocked if the system was not implemented organization wide and relied on volunteers only.

John Northey - Tuesday, July 09 2013 @ 06:37 AM EDT (#276017) #

I don't see why pitchers would avoid the program. Generally speaking, if something appears to work players tend to jump in quickly as they want to succeed too. I suspect Cecil and Delabar will become evangelists of the program to all pitchers on the ML staff and would happily talk to anyone in the system to praise it. Pre-program both were looking at struggling to get a ML deal, now both are all-stars. Seems to me to be a pretty strong incentive to all pitchers. I suspect the injury pains Delabar is feeling right now would've taken him onto the DL in the past instead of just a few days rest without the program. Plus mix in the massive number of injuries the Jays have gone through recently and that jumps it further. Doesn't hurt that Janssen is doing it lightly right now too, as he is a near-all-star as a closer. What will be interesting is if we hear of a starter going onto it and see what the results are.

Beyonder - Tuesday, July 09 2013 @ 10:12 AM EDT (#276021) #

From John Lott's article on Dustin McGowan:

"McGowan is among the Blue Jay converts to the Velocity Program, the weighted-ball regimen designed to strengthen the shoulder. Its purpose is twofold: to accelerate recovery after pitching and to boost velocity."

uglyone - Tuesday, July 09 2013 @ 02:32 PM EDT (#276029) #

I'm hesitant to label cecil's velocity as a result of anything other than a starter moving to the 'pen.

heck, even last year, he was hitting 94 occasionally - even late in starts.

greenfrog - Tuesday, July 09 2013 @ 02:42 PM EDT (#276031) #

Perhaps this article will help you overcome your hesitancy:

http://sports.nationalpost.com/2013/04/09/blue-jays-brett-cecil-revives-his-velocity-with-weighted-ball-program/

uglyone - Tuesday, July 09 2013 @ 02:50 PM EDT (#276034) #

not entirely.

take a look at his velo charts the last 3 years: http://www.fangraphs.com/fgraphs/2660_P_FA_20130707.png

it seems the big jump came at the end of '12, after he was recalled and sent to the bullpen in september, without a huge difference between those last few outings and this year.

greenfrog - Tuesday, July 09 2013 @ 03:25 PM EDT (#276036) #

Thanks, uglyone. That chart is interesting - I would be interested in seeing the numbers broken down in more detail (for example, by pitch type).

I thought this quote was interesting: “From the first throw, I noticed a difference right away,” he said. “The ball jumped out. I wasn’t even trying very hard, just playing light catch.”

This suggests that whereas previously Cecil might have been straining to get into the sought-after low-90s range, the weighted ball program may have helped him gain velocity *and* focus more on pitching with precision, instead of simply airing it out to hang onto his job. His drastically improved component stats arguably bear this out.

Also, it's not just fastball velocity that has increased. The velocity of *all* his pitches is up significantly in 2013: fastball, cutter (a largely new pitch for him), curveball, changeup.

It's perhaps also be worth noting that McGowan's FB velocity is up: it's 2 MPH faster than in his relief appearances in 2011. And the 29-year-old Delabar is throwing as hard or harder than ever - FB and splitter.

The move to the 'pen may have contributed to Cecil's velocity uptick, but it sounds as though there's more to the story than the usual "converted starter" narrative.

greenfrog - Tuesday, July 09 2013 @ 03:30 PM EDT (#276037) #

Correction: in 2011, McGowan made five appearances. Four were starts (ranging from 3 to 5 IP) and one was a 4 IP relief appearance. All involved 70-80 pitches, so he wasn't exactly airing it out in short relief.

rfan8 - Tuesday, July 09 2013 @ 03:46 PM EDT (#276039) #

The whole weighted ball thing sounds like my weighted golf club which really just gets me into a better rhythm, makes sure i stay back and do some of the other fundamental things I'm supposed to do which has the happy effect of adding distance/ball velocity.

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