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Lefty Mark Buehrle (4-5, 4.73) takes on Ryan Dempster (5-8, 4.15) before the Jays hit the highway back home. First pitch is at 1:35 pm Eastern.

@BlueJays: Today's @BlueJays lineup: Reyes-SS Bautista-RF Encarnacion-DH Lind-1B Davis-LF Rasmus-CF Arencibia-C Izturis-3B Kawasaki-2B
Game Thread — 6/30 @ Boston | 72 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
Mike Forbes - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 10:36 AM EDT (#275417) #
Can someone please try and explain why Gibbons seems to be madly in love with JPA?
Mike Green - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 10:46 AM EDT (#275418) #
At the outset of the season, Gibbons said that the key to the team's offence was the long-ball.   He does not seem to have a good ability to achieve a balance between getting runners on and moving them around in his playing time/lineup decisions.
China fan - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 11:20 AM EDT (#275419) #
Kawasaki at 2B today. The Bonifacio era might be fading a little.
Thomas - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 11:31 AM EDT (#275420) #
We can only hope.
China fan - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 11:45 AM EDT (#275422) #
"...At the outset of the season, Gibbons said that the key to the team's offence was the long-ball...."

Can you provide a source, please? I'd be astonished if you're quoting him accurately. You're suggesting that he doesn't care about OBP, which is unlikely to be what he actually said. (Possibly he was just saying that the HR was a big part of the Jays offence in 2012 and he doesn't necessarily want to lose the long ball in 2013. But I doubt he said that the HR is more important than OBP or anything else.)
uglyone - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 12:33 PM EDT (#275424) #
Seems like gibby has done a pretty good job moving his obp up the lineup, and the unorthodox move of sliding Joey and EE up the lineup instead of trying to force a low obp speedy guy up there like most other managers would do is a good example. He even tried lind up there when his obp was north of 400 and he wasn't hitting any hr.

Menwhile the lowest obp guys have been relegated to the bottom of the order - jpa, boni, izzy.
Chuck - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 12:38 PM EDT (#275425) #
and the unorthodox move of sliding Joey and EE up the lineup instead of trying to force a low obp speedy guy up there like most other managers would do is a good example

Dusty Baker, for instance. In between two guys with a .400 OBP, he insists on batting his shortstop, the worst hitter on the team.
CeeBee - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 01:00 PM EDT (#275426) #
Jays sign some catcher insurance it seems.
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2013/06/blue-jays-sign-ramon-hernandez.html
Ron - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 01:19 PM EDT (#275427) #
It's +130 for the Jays right now with Ortiz, Salty, and Drew not playing today. I put $20 down on the jays.

Tomorrow's game is sold out.
smcs - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 01:26 PM EDT (#275428) #
2nd last graf, Gibby talks about not asking Arencibia and Rasmus to do too much because they are pure power hitters.

For all of his faults (and he has many faults), Arencibia is still a better offensive player than the alternatives, though a Thole/Arencibia platoon is probably ideal. Arencibia struggles to catch anything outside of his frame and be able to get the tag down, but he does seem to be able to hold onto the ball when he is hit, which is a a good thing, and probably the only thing, defensively, that he does really well.

I think it will be interesting to see how the Jays handle him this offseason. I hope they are just content taking him to arbitration, as he'll get maybe $2MM in his 1st time thru the process, which means he would be worth about $5MM on the open-market.
Chuck - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 02:11 PM EDT (#275429) #

Buck Martinez cites Nava's "production" as the basis for how valuable he has been this year: 10 HR and 49 RBI. But it would never occur to Martinez (or Tabler) to cite Nava's chief offensive skill, his ability to get on base. Nava's 373 OBP goes entirely unmentioned. Martinez and Tabler will talk "production" and RBIs and RBI-men and "run producers" and little else that takes them off this narrow path. It is beyond frustrating to endure their vacuous commentary day in and day out. In my personal version of Sarte's No Exit, I am locked in a room with these two.

Kasi - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 02:16 PM EDT (#275430) #
Can we have good Buerhle back again? This guy is pretty depressing.
Alex Obal - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 02:31 PM EDT (#275431) #
Take away sac bunts (but not unsuccessful sac bunts) and NL pitchers, as a group, have a on-base percentage of .181.
JB21 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 02:32 PM EDT (#275432) #
Kevin Pillar with another homerun today in Buffalo.
Alex Obal - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 02:36 PM EDT (#275433) #
Tomorrow's game is sold out.

And the Stubhub asking price is $73. Remarkable.
zeppelinkm - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 03:37 PM EDT (#275434) #
This 6th inning is testing the boundaries of my patience.

JPA, pop up. Izturis, pop up. Bonafacio comes in as a PH for Kawasaki.

Gah.
JB21 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 03:38 PM EDT (#275435) #
Why isn't Mark DeRosa pinch hitting in that situation?
China fan - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 03:39 PM EDT (#275436) #
Well, that's going to set the cat among the pigeons. Bases loaded, nobody out, a close game against the division leader, and a total fail by JPA, Izturis and Bonifacio. In case anyone didn't realize how bad the bottom of the Jays lineup has been (with occasional exceptions), that was a very depressing reminder.
eudaimon - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 03:40 PM EDT (#275437) #
Can't we just DFA Bonifacio already? I went away from the game only to return to Boni predictably striking out, pinch-hitting for some reason. Derosa is the obvious choice, but I wouldn't have even minded Kawasaki batting out there. By far the stupidest thing I've seen Gibbons do this year.
China fan - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 03:41 PM EDT (#275438) #
And by the time I wrote that, the cat was already well among the pigeons....

There will obviously be a lot of second-guessing about Gibbons decision to go with Bonifacio, but there really wasn't any attractive option in that situation. The real problems were JPA and Izturis, who couldn't even manage a sacrifice fly among them.
China fan - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 03:44 PM EDT (#275439) #
"....By far the stupidest thing I've seen Gibbons do this year...."

But it should be a lot easier to hit a sacrifice fly than to get a base hit, and it was Arencibia and Izturis who flunked that little task. There's enough blame to go around, but I think the bigger fault is more fairly directed at the first two hitters.
eudaimon - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 03:44 PM EDT (#275440) #
Attractive options including anyone without a .215 OBP in June that hasn't shown anything offensively all season.
JB21 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 03:45 PM EDT (#275441) #
I'm not so sure anybody is disagreeing with you, but after those two painful outs, Gibbon's decided to put one of the worst hitters in baseball in that situation, on purpose.
eudaimon - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 03:47 PM EDT (#275442) #
I just have to wonder what game management is watching sometimes. Don't get me wrong, I like Gibbons a lot, I just don't know how Bonifacio seemed like a good option. He hasn't looked good all year. Buddy should be locked to the bench and have to work with Mottola before seeing the field again.
JB21 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 03:50 PM EDT (#275443) #
DeRosa vs. LHP this year

.243/.341/.443/.784

.338 wOba

113 RC+

You don't want to see Bon's #'s.

I'm very happy Jose Reyes is back.
JB21 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 03:51 PM EDT (#275444) #
Joey Bats heating up a bit.
Eephus - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:07 PM EDT (#275445) #
Interesting spot to use McGowan. Dunno if it's a good one but it's an interesting one.
Alex Obal - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:22 PM EDT (#275447) #
"If Henry Cotto is a major league ballplayer, I'm an airplane. Cotto is one of those guys who runs well and throws pretty decent, and one year he hit .270-something (in less than 150 at-bats, in Wrigley Field, with a secondary average of .164), so you get guys like Don Zimmer who will rave about this great young prospect and keep trading for him, so he'll get about eight chances to play in the major leagues before they figure out he can't hit. ... They always figure that if you can run and throw they'll teach you to hit.  Of course they can't teach anybody to hit, but they always think they can, so they keep trying."
- James
Chuck - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:24 PM EDT (#275448) #
Interesting that McGowan pitches out of the stretch with no one on base. I can't recall if he did this as a starting pitcher (it is unusual, but not unheard of, as Darvish does this as well).
Mike Green - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:29 PM EDT (#275449) #
There might be some younger folks here wondering what James' last name is. It's Bill James, for the benefit of the uninitiated.
Chuck - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:30 PM EDT (#275450) #
"I ain't an athlete, lady, I'm a baseball player."
- John Kruk
Mike Green - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:32 PM EDT (#275451) #
Can you provide a source, please? I'd be astonished if you're quoting him accurately. You're suggesting that he doesn't care about OBP, which is unlikely to be what he actually said. (Possibly he was just saying that the HR was a big part of the Jays offence in 2012 and he doesn't necessarily want to lose the long ball in 2013. But I doubt he said that the HR is more important than OBP or anything else.)

No.  He didn't say that he didn't care about OBP.  What he said at a presser apparently (If the broadcast guys have it right) is that the key to this offence was the long-ball.  It's a state of mind.
92-93 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:33 PM EDT (#275452) #
There will obviously be a lot of second-guessing about Gibbons decision to go with Bonifacio,

And rightfully so, with DeRosa on the bench.

but there really wasn't any attractive option in that situation.


I wonder why.

Good thing Jose Bautista woke up and decided to become a monster again.
Kasi - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:33 PM EDT (#275453) #
This game was totally winnable, but the awfulness of the bottom of our lineup sunk it. They have to do something about JPA. At least make it more of a platoon split and give him some time off. Not sure what to do about 2b though. Izturis/Kawasaki should be okay I guess when Lawrie returns, but Bonafacio needs to go.
JB21 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:34 PM EDT (#275454) #
Joey Bats heating up a bit. (understatement)
JB21 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:35 PM EDT (#275455) #
"This game was totally winnable, but ..."

The Game is tied.
92-93 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:43 PM EDT (#275456) #
"And the Stubhub asking price is $73. Remarkable."

The cheapest pair I see is now $95. Ridiculous market.
China fan - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:44 PM EDT (#275457) #
".... What he said at a presser apparently (If the broadcast guys have it right) is that the key to this offence was the long-ball....."

I really don't think those guys got it right.
Kasi - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:47 PM EDT (#275458) #
And then after getting up to tied in a game that is a must win, Gibbons brings in Perez. Where is Cecil or Jansen?
Chuck - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:48 PM EDT (#275459) #
Why wouldn't Janssen just be brought in to start the inning? Why wait for trouble? If Janssen gets through the 9th and the game goes to extra innings, then you've got Perez around to go multiple innings.

And when Tabler said that Perez had not been scored upon, he really meant that Perez had been scored upon three times (albeit unearned). But it's not like he's paid to know these things... or to just look down at the stat sheet under his nose.
Chuck - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:49 PM EDT (#275460) #
Not Gibbons' best managerial effort today. Some very dubious decisions.
China fan - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:53 PM EDT (#275461) #
That was a winnable game. Got to question the decision to bring in Perez in the 9th inning. And the failure to cash in any runs with the bases loaded and none out in the 6th inning is inexcusable.
Chuck - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:57 PM EDT (#275462) #
The only reason I can think that Gibbons might have opted for the lefty for the 8-9-1 hitters was that #8 or #9 might have invited Ortiz as a pinch-hitter had a RHP been on the mound. Not enough of a reason to pass on Janssen, but at least it would have been a reason.
Magpie - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 04:59 PM EDT (#275463) #
Got to question the decision to bring in Perez in the 9th inning.

I can't blame him too much for that - all contemporary managers are Slaves to the Save, and Perez has still allowed just 12 baserunners in his 15.1 IP. And Thole's played plenty of first bases as a pro, he has to make that play.

But like everyone else, I'm mystified at choosing Bonifacio instead of DeRosa. Did the Red Sox have a RH up and ready, and Gibbons figured Bonifacio with the platoon advantage was a better option than DeRosa without?
92-93 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 05:00 PM EDT (#275464) #
I had zero problem with Gibbons going to his most rested, non-closer reliever in that spot.

What I really didn't like was not using DeRosa at 1B just because it was Dempster on the mound.
92-93 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 05:02 PM EDT (#275465) #
"I'm mystified at choosing Bonifacio instead of DeRosa. Did the Red Sox have a RH up and ready, and Gibbons figured Bonifacio with the platoon advantage was a better option than DeRosa without?"

Having gone with Thole at 1B earlier because of the RHP, Gibbons was forced to use Bonifacio or he wouldn't have had a backup C anymore.
Magpie - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 05:07 PM EDT (#275466) #
Where is Cecil or Janssen?

Janssen is the Closer, and they're on the road. He doesn't pitch until the team has a lead or there is an urgent crisis.

As for Cecil, it's Fenway Park, and he simply turns into a pumpkin here. Possibly because of the traumatic experience that happened to him the very first time he pitched there. Maybe the Wall gets into his head. But definitely something...
smcs - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 05:10 PM EDT (#275467) #
No one left the game for Buffalo, but Moises Sierra didn't start and hasn't played. So either they don't think Lind needs to be DL'd or Sierra is getting the call. Other options already on the 40 are Mauro Gomez, Ryan Goins, Anthony Gose (all in BUF) and AJ Jimenez (DH'd for NH). Maybe they rush Lawrie back again...
92-93 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 05:10 PM EDT (#275468) #
DeRosa got hurt, so they played today with a 2 man bench. Brilliant.
Magpie - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 05:11 PM EDT (#275469) #
Gibbons was forced to use Bonifacio or he wouldn't have had a backup C anymore.

I don't understand what you're saying. His backup catcher was in the game, playing first base. He wasn't coming out of the game, Kawasaki was. The choice was Bonifacio or DeRosa, with the pinch hitter staying in to play in the infield and the other guy staying on the bench. If DeRosa comes in (say he goes to 3b and Izturis goes to 2b) and Arencibia goes down, it's siple enough - Thole to C, DeRosa to 1b and Bonifacio comes in to play infield.
Magpie - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 05:12 PM EDT (#275470) #
DeRosa got hurt

That changes everything.

Never mind!
92-93 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 05:14 PM EDT (#275471) #
Good point, scratch what I said. With DeRosa hurt there were no options, though in that case I let Kawasaki hit for himself and I don't burn Bonifacio.

It's inexcusable to play games with a 2 man bench.
China fan - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 05:33 PM EDT (#275473) #
Okay, as long as we're all fired up about Gibbons and his decisions, everyone who complained about the failure to use DeRosa should now retract that criticism, since we now know that DeRosa was injured.

As for the two-man bench: it's not "inexcusable", it's a perfectly defensible decision to prioritize the pitching. People who try to simplify the issue are ignoring the other side of the argument.

I still question the use of Perez when there were better relievers available. Perez is a decent long-man and 8th reliever. He's not a 9th-inning guy.
Chuck - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 05:41 PM EDT (#275474) #
Okay, as long as we're all fired up about Gibbons and his decisions, everyone who complained about the failure to use DeRosa should now retract that criticism, since we now know that DeRosa was injured.

Mrs. Gibbons, we said bad things about your son because we didn't have all the facts. We are sorry if we hurt your feelings or your son's feelings.
BlueJayWay - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 06:00 PM EDT (#275475) #
+1
China fan - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 06:05 PM EDT (#275476) #
Hurt feelings? That's a weird notion in professional sports. But waiting for facts? Perhaps not worth scoffing at.
JB21 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 06:09 PM EDT (#275477) #
He was joking...

Magpie - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 06:12 PM EDT (#275478) #
as long as we're all fired up about Gibbons and his decisions

Well, now that DeRosa's secret injury has been revealed, the only second-guessing involves going to Perez in the ninth. Which was fine by me.
JB21 - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 06:37 PM EDT (#275479) #
Kevin Pillar watch... he's 4 for 5 today, including 3 extra base hits, 3 runs, 3 RBI, and a SB for good measure.
greenfrog - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 07:01 PM EDT (#275480) #
Before today's game, Pillar's career minor-league line was up to 326/372/467 (almost identical to his 2013 line). It'll get another nudge upwards after today's 4 for 6 performance. He's had a heck of a run, ascending from Bluefield to Buffalo over the course of two seasons without missing a beat.
greenfrog - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 07:12 PM EDT (#275481) #
Also, Pillar has hit very well against RHP in his career:

2013: 279/331/410
2012: 330/382/442
2011: 311/346/492

But he has absolutely raked against lefties (338 total PA):

2013: 387/430/555
2012: 304/351/430
2011: 458/475/661
scottt - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 07:34 PM EDT (#275482) #
Perez is a decent long-man and 8th reliever. He's not a 9th-inning guy.

It's not like he was asked to close.
scottt - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 08:06 PM EDT (#275483) #
I would DL DeRosa and go back to platooning Lind. 
If Lind needs some time off, Encarnation can play first while rotating guys at DH.
Pillar would look good in left field right now. It's just a matter of making some room on the 40-man roster.



Mike Green - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 08:24 PM EDT (#275484) #
Dear Josh,

You are no longer a New York Met.  There was no need to reciprocate for Mookie and Bill.

Best regards,

Mike

Mike Green - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 08:34 PM EDT (#275485) #
Bonifacio is struggling mightily.  For the season, he's hitting .179/.233/.214 as a RHB.  Pinch-hitters are always at a disadvantage.  The only circumstance where I can conceive of using Bonifacio as a pinch-hitter now is for a pitcher in an inter-league game, and even that would be as a last resort only.  He needs to start succeeding more to build up his confidence and pinch-hitting is not the way to do it. 
Magpie - Sunday, June 30 2013 @ 10:51 PM EDT (#275486) #
Does Pillar remind anyone else of Dan Gladden?
scottt - Monday, July 01 2013 @ 06:58 AM EDT (#275487) #
Don't know about that, but if they bring him up and he hits like that, he'll remind me of Jesus.
JB21 - Monday, July 01 2013 @ 10:16 AM EDT (#275493) #
Which Jesus?
Mike Green - Monday, July 01 2013 @ 12:01 PM EDT (#275499) #
Pillar seems to have somewhat more native hitting ability.  Gladden was hitting .303 and .308 (in Phoenix in the PCL) at age 24 and 25 with comparable levels of power, plate discipline and speed to Pillar.  Pillar is probably somewhere between Gladden and Piniella as a hitter. 
hypobole - Monday, July 01 2013 @ 12:30 PM EDT (#275503) #
I think Gladden had better wheels than Pillar who only has average speed.
CeeBee - Monday, July 01 2013 @ 12:36 PM EDT (#275504) #
I'd be happy with Jesus Alou
Mike Green - Monday, July 01 2013 @ 12:52 PM EDT (#275505) #
It's probably true that Gladden was somewhat faster than Pillar.  In the power/speed/hitting ability continuum, Pillar is probably between Gladden and Piniella on all counts.  Both Gladden and Piniella were valuable players, unusually so for late-age arrivals to the majors.
Game Thread — 6/30 @ Boston | 72 comments | Create New Account
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