Dylan Axelrod (0-1, 5.79) goes on the hill for the White Sox. Josh Johnson (0-1, 11.05) will do the same for the home side.
Dylan Axelrod (0-1, 5.79) goes on the hill for the White Sox. Josh Johnson (0-1, 11.05) will do the same for the home side.
The hitting is coming around, meshing together. Starters are developing better control, better stuff and that's encouraging. The defense should be better with Lawrie's return although his bat will be a little behind. I suspect Bautista's back spasms were 3B induced, hopefully letting him play RF tonight. What's happened to Josh Johnson's fastball, it's barely high 80's? If he wants a big contract after this year he needs to really step up, especially if the Team's going to win tonight.
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The boys have the pitching advantage the next 3 days (they miss Peavy) so let's sweep em out of town.
I think JJ put that concern to rest with his start tonight.
Rajai Davis just let Paul Korenko score on a not-very-deep sac fly.
Not enjoying those two so far this year. Especially in the OF.
I've made my thoughts on this matter clear enough, I suppose.
It was simply a poor decision which as it turned out cost the game. Watching Davis up against Reed in the 9th just made it agonizing.
On a personal level I want to see Gibbons succeed. He's such a nice guy and a good guy. But this was simply bad managing that came back to bite hard. It's really possible that Gibbons will be fired mid-season again.
Starters are pitching better, but still making careless mistakes. Is Delabar not trusting his stuff or arm's tired or is J.P. not making the best use of his stuff? I ask because Delabar is better than this. Nice outing by Oliver.
My point was simply that today was a great illustration of the lack of flexibility and ability to make in-game tactical adjustments that having a short bench leaves the team with.
I don't agree with how AA has constructed the last few spots on the roster. I also agree that given how those spots have been utilized, Gibbons mismanaged them in today's game.
Honestly... think about it - we've had Bautista miss 5 games out of 14, Reyes is up to 4 and will miss another 60+ most likely, Lawrie missed the first 13, and Bonifacio has not missed a game yet. That is seriously messed up. Dickey and Buehrle have ERA+'s sub 80. Santos threw 4 1/3 innings before going down, again. Romero is in A+ ball. Plus Oliver seems to have forgotten he didn't retire last winter.
Now, given all that being 2 games under 500 and 3 1/2 back isn't as bad as it could be. Heck, the Jays are 1 1/2 ahead of Tampa.
Gibbons decided to pinch hit Rajai to lead off the 7th (not the 8th) in order to gain 60 points of OBP over Rasmus for that one low leverage at-bat in which he was sure to face a lefty. The potential cost was two innings of terrible CF defence from Bonifacio, the pop-gun arm of Davis in RF, the lack of a potential pinch runner further down the line, and the potential for a high leverage at-bat for Davis in the 9th. Murphy's law struck in a somewhat spectacular way and the result is a loss in a game that could well have been won.
Thomas makes a good point about the short bench but it's a separate point. The benefits of this move paled in comparison to the risk. Do no harm Gibby, do no harm.
Seems to me we need a bit of chillin' to take place. Lost is all the angst is that JJ had a good game. The starting pitching is starting to look something near what we expected. Lawrie is back. Corners are being turned, single malt is being sipped, hope is rising, and the new Superman and Star Trek movies are near... peace, calm...now - lets go kick some Chicago butt the next three games!
At this point, I'm fine with sending him down and taking Casper Wells off waivers. If Bonifacio is claimed, he's claimed. But stop the bleeding. Step 2 would send Ortiz down and bring up Goins, who can play 2B and shortstop. I'd love to bring up Negrych, but if something happens in-game to Kawaski, we have no reasonable option.
Instead of being strictly critical, however, let me add that I hope Buffalo Bisons fans are feverish with anticipation for the coming Emilio Bonifacio Era, because the Queen City is certainly where he deserves to spend the next five months.
These are how many innings pitched each of the Jays starters averaged in 2012 per start:
R.A. Dickey - 7.1
Brandon Morrow - 5.9
Mark Buehrle - 6.5
Josh Johnson - 6.2
JA Happ - 5.6
This pace would require the bullpen to pitch 13.7 innings every five games (assuming an even 9 innings a game). Even acknowledging that there be small stretches where the bullpen may be taxed pretty heavily because of a few bad starts in a row, I don't see why a six man bullpen couldn't handle that workload, especially when you add off days.
The Jays have 3 of the top 43 pitchers in the MLB in 2012 in terms of innings pitched. The 2012 Jays had none. If you want to tell me that the 2012 Jays would have really suffered trying to carry a six-man bullpen to the point where it wouldn't really have been feasible, I won't argue. But until it has been proven not to work, I don't see anything here to suggest the 2013 Jays need 7 relievers, let alone 8.
This is different from the well-reasoned criticism of Gibbons' managerial moves during this game that Charlie made and others, including myself, noted earlier. Given the players available to him tonight, I believe Gibbons absolutely made the wrong call in today's game and gained a small advantage for a larger disadvantage later and eliminated the possibility of deploying Davis more usefully later.
It sure is nice to have pitchers going into the 7th and Lawrie back manning the hot corner.
If we are imagining alternative universes where Casper Wells delivers the dramatic late-inning game-winning hit, I hope we also permitted to imagine an equally plausible hypothetical scenario for the past couple games: Johnson or Buehrle gets knocked out of the game in the 3rd or 4th inning, the bullpen gets burned up, relievers heroically offer to pitch for 2 or 3 innings, and key pitchers end up following Santos onto the DL list. (Yes, I know that Loup and Rogers have done multi-inning stints this year, and it can be done again, but I also know that the Jays bullpen has pitched more innings than any other team in the division this season, and we can't assume that they can just blithely continue at that pace without consequences, especially so early in the year.)
The real reason for the Jays troubles, in my view, are the injuries to three of their most important players: Reyes, Bautista and Lawrie, and the cold bats of the Jays offense in general, which is scoring less than 3.9 runs per game, the second-worst performance in the division. (And let's not imagine that Lawrie is back to mid-season hitting form on his first game after a 6-week injury rehab.)
On the quibbling over the managerial decisions, we tend to forget that these are always gambles, and many of them are guaranteed to be failed gambles, because baseball gambles always have a high probability of not succeeding -- which make it easy for us to criticize afterwards. For a more balanced response, here's another way of looking at it:
http://blogs.thescore.com/djf/2013/04/17/searching-in-vain-for-a-culprit/
What I really wonder tho, is what is the motivation for playing Lind at first and Encarnacion at DH rather than vice versa? I'm thinking EE is a guy you never want to pinch hit for, while Lind is a guy you want to replace as soon as a lefty reliever comes on. If Lind is at first base, pinch hitting for him means either
a) you have to use DeRosa or
b) you use Davis or Bonifacio but then have to bring in DeRosa on defence or
c) you use Davis or Bonifacio but then have to have him play right field with Bautista coming in to play 1B
All of these have significant downsides in my opinion. Whereas if Lind was DHing Gibbons would be free to use anybody as the PH with no secondary considerations.
And if Casper Wells was on the roster he'd have a RH bat worth talking about...
Anyways. Is there reason to believe Lind is a better defensive 1B than EE? My impression is that they're both middling.
It's true that Gibbons generally always carried a seven man bullpen in his first tour. I don't think he's the kind to reinvent the wheel, and there are real reasons managers like these huge pens. But still - quite often Gibbons' seventh guy man someone who was never going to get into a game anyway. There was one year Jordan de Jong spent almost two months on the roster and in the pen. How often did he pitch? Anyway, I have trouble believing Gibbons wanted eight guys out there. But who knows.
None whatsoever, and "middling" is more than either deserve. Encarnacion's below average, and Lind is below Encarnacion. I would assume that the main reason Lind was playing first last night was be to keep the smell of mothballs away from his glove, as the team may need him to use it from time to time.
I am wondering what precisely Janssen's role is. Normally in a 2-2 game in the ninth at home with Delabar having thrown an inning, you would expect Janssen to come on. I guess that the club is trying to avoid throwing him on back-to-back nights, which does put the club in a bit of a spot. With Santos out, Gibbons needs to redefine the roles of Loup, Oliver and Cecil, I think.
"Johnson or Buehrle gets knocked out of the game in the 3rd or 4th inning, the bullpen gets burned up, relievers heroically offer to pitch for 2 or 3 innings, and key pitchers end up following Santos onto the DL list. (Yes, I know that Loup and Rogers have done multi-inning stints this year, and it can be done again, but I also know that the Jays bullpen has pitched more innings than any other team in the division this season, and we can't assume that they can just blithely continue at that pace without consequences, especially so early in the year.)"
Before yesterday's game, Aaron Loup and Esmil Rogers had combined to pitch to six batters over the previous three games. In none of those three games did the team's eighth reliever pitch. In the event of Johnson having been knocked out early last night, I am going to assume that they could have completed a multi-inning stretch that shouldn't be characterized as heroic and that they would likely have suffered no greater chance of injury as a result that the inherent risk of injury present every time a pitcher takes the mound. (At least as far as can be discerned by an outside observer, I'm open to hearing evidence that counters this point, but relievers like Luis Perez and Sergio Santos weren't being overworked before suffering serious arm injuries.)
I don't think fans are turning on Farrell. Many of us still think he's a good manager. That doesn't mean he's infallible or that a reasonable consideration of the game and options at his disposal doesn't suggest that the Jays would likely have had a better chance of winning the game if he hadn't managed the game the way he did.
HAHAHAHAHAHA. This is just too much. It's now heroism for a reliever to throw 2-3 innings. When did this mentality set in among fans?!
"Normally in a 2-2 game in the ninth at home with Delabar having thrown an inning, you would expect Janssen to come on."
Personally, I loved seeing Delabar stay in the game instead of immediately going to Janssen. He got squeezed a little and it didn't work out, but the team will be better off down the road if everybody gets it out of their head that after an inning of 16 effective pitches it's time to yank a reliever.
And just imagine if one of "the internet kiddies" suggested the new manager may be fired 2 weeks into the season.
I think it depends. There are, at any given moment, more than 200 relief pitchers gainfully employed in the majors leagues. And sonovagun, but I don't think even half of them could be described as good pitchers. I think you've really got a few good pitchers, and a whole bunch of guys who can come charging out of the bullpen, full of adrenalin and excitement, and do a credible Goose Gossage imitation for... oh, 16 pitches. Then they go sit down in the dugout and lose their mojo. Because they're not really Goose Gossage at all. They're just a modern reliever.
I don't have a big problem with Delabar coming back out for the second inning because one of the things Gibbons - or any manager - has to do at this point of the season is find out what he's got. Which of the guys in his pen are the actual pitchers, that he can confidently send out there for a second inning. And which of them are just modern relievers, to be used accordingly.
I don't have a problem with Delabar throwing 2 innings in general. 2-2 in the ninth with Adam Dunn up is a bit high leverage for my taste. I'd rather send him out with a 4-2 lead in the seventh or something and have him go 2 (or 3) innings.
The point is that we, as fans, are ignorant of the health of pitchers, and we can't just assume that the Jays should keep tossing them into games, based on the number of innings in their previous games. Health is about more than innings.
Those kinds of injuries are often NOT announced publicly. For strategic reasons, the team might want to conceal those injuries, so that the opposing team doesn't know exactly what hitting match-ups to use in the late innings. Something for people to remember when attacking a manager's use of the pitching staff.
Unfortunately, that 2011 season appears to be an outlier, and considering Boni's skill set is predicated on speed and not power nor (obviously) defense, it just ain't looking good for him, nor for the Jays' offence with Reyes and Bats on the shelf.
"And pitchers often try to stay in games, or volunteer for more innings, when they shouldn't. That's reckless heroism."
If Santos is unavailable because he was complaining of arm trouble, as he may have been immediately prior to his DL stint, you don't pitch him. It's not complicated. It's entirely on Gibbons if he calls upon Santos to throw 2 or 3 innings, given the pitcher's injury last year and upon him complaining of arm troubles.
If Santos has never alerted Gibbons to his injury, that's on Santos. It may be understandable, but there's an onus on the player to alert management to a potential injury. A manager can't manage a bullpen on the assumption that relievers are hiding soreness and potential injuries.
And as per the Frasor example, nobody is suggesting Bauxites are omniscient. If Aaron Loup and Esmil Rogers go on the DL tomorrow with arm injuries, I will probably withdraw these criticisms (although I will likely have new questions as to why AA tried to survive several days with two potentially injured pitchers in the bullpen). However, I'm not going to refrain from commenting on roster and in-game management decisions on the assumption that every move the front office and coaching staff is optimal.
Nor do I have any sycophantic relationship to the team. If they hadn't boosted the payroll substantially this year, I would have been as critical of the Jays as anyone. My motivation is simply a desire fairness: I think the criticism by some fans is sometimes unfair because it neglects the likely counter-argument from the team. In the interests of making it a better debate, and to cover the points more accurately, I'm giving the counter-argument. I hope it sharpens the focus of our debates and forces us to provide evidence for our arguments.