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Jo-Jo Ryes made a good first impression by throwing a one hitter over eight innings to lead the Fisher Cats to victory.  Reyes had been pitching in AAA for the Braves so a step down to AA should see him pitching well.  Joel Carreno had another eight K's and Chris Hopkins hit a grand slam as Dunedin won easily.  Lansing came from behind for a narrow win.  The Auburn bullpen held up as Carlos Perez went 3-3.  The GCL Jays and the Las Vegas 51's lost.


Las Vegas 2  Fresno 5 

Bobby Ray had a rough start, Fresno scored two in the first inning and three in the second and Las Vegas were down 5-1 quickly.  Ray only went four innings.

Aaron Mathews singled and scored the first run on a ground out.  Brett Wallace's 15th home run accounted for the second run.

Las Vegas outhit Fresno 11-8.  Mike McCoy, Wallace, Manny Mayorson and Mathews had two hits each.  Arencibia was 1-4.


Binghamton 2  New Hampshire 6

Jo-Jo Reyes made a big first impression, he went eight innings and din't allow a hit until the eighth.  His final line was 8ip; one hit; 2 walks and six K's.  The Mets scored their runs off BJ LaMura in the ninth.

Darin Mastroianni got the Fisher Cats going, he led off with a triple and scored on a passed ball.  Adeiny Hechavarria doubled and scored on a single by Adam Loewen.  In the second inning Mastroianni singled, stole second and scored when Hechavarria singled.  In the third inning a solo home run from Eric Thames made it 4-0.

Hechavarria brought in run number five with a sac fly to score David CooperJon Diaz singled in run number six in the seventh.

Five Cats had two hits, Mastroianni, Hechavarria, Bowman, Cooper and Diaz. Travis Snider was 1-5 with a double and a strikeout.


Dunedin 10  St Lucie 2

Joel Carreno, in his first star after his 15 K performance, struck out 8 in 6 innings.  St Lucie scored two runs off Carreno with 8 hits.

The Jays scored two in the third, Jon Del Campo singled in Brad McElroy and Travis d'Arnaud's ground rule double scored a second run.  Dunedin scored five more in the fourth capped by a grand slam home run from Chris Hopkins, his first home run of the year in the FSL.  Jon Talley homered in the eighth and Del Campo hit a two run shot in the ninth.

Hopkins, Del Campo, Talley and McClanahan had two hits each.


Lansing 6  Wisconsin 4


Wisconsin scored three runs in the first inning off Dave Sever but Lansing came back with four in the third. Kevin Ahrens singled; Ryan Schimpf tripled; Kenny Wilson had an RBI single; Justin Jackson walked; and Brad Glenn doubled in the two speedy runners.

Wisconsin tied it at 4 in the bottom of the third but Sean Ochinko doubled and scored on a wild pitch in the fifth to put the Lugnuts ahead.  Lansing added an insurance run in the eighth.

Dave Sever pitched six innings for the win.

Wilson, Ahrens, Schimpf and Ochinko had two hits each.


Tri-City 2  Auburn 10

Auburn finally got some good relief pitching.  The bullpen pitched five innings and only gave up two runs.  The starter, Daniel Webb, went four shutout innings.

Auburn scored three runs in the second inning and five runs in the third.  In the second one run scored on a wild pitch and two on an RBI single by Stephen McQuail.  In the third Carlos Perez singled in two runs; Lance Durham doubled in Perez; and Yudelmis Hernandez homered to make it a five run inning.  Perez tripled in a run in the fourth and Durham singled in a run in the sixth.

Perez was 3-3 with a walk and is now hitting .333.  Durham had two hits and two walks, McQuail had two hits.  Marcus Knecht was 1-3 with two walks.


GCL Blue Jays 5  GCL Braves 9

Aaron Sanchez made his professional debut and pitched 1.2 innings facing eleven hitters.  Sanchez hit three batters and also gave up three hits, two of which were of the infield variety.  Sanchez was charged with two runs, just one earned.  Sanchez was followed by Grafton, Ontario's Nick Purdy.  Purdy gave up a couple of runs in the fourth and two more in the seventh.

The Jays scored one in the third, Jake Marisnick singled with the bases loaded to drive in one run but Carlos Ramirez was thrown out at the plate.  The Jays strung together five singles in the seventh to score four more runs but Purdy and Escalante gave those four runs back in the bottom of the seventh.

Matt Abraham had three hits, Marisnick had two.


Three Stars

3rd star - Chris Hopkins
2nd star - Carlos Perez
1st star - Jo-Jo Reyes (even though he moved down from AAA, he gets a first start bonus)

Jo-Jo Has the Mojo | 48 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
LouisvilleJayFan - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 09:24 AM EDT (#218604) #
Tim Collins went 2 innings last night, let up no hits, and struck out 5 in his Mississippi Braves debut.
Mike Green - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 11:43 AM EDT (#218605) #
People worry about Escobar's attitude, but me myself am terrified about what happens if Reyes ever makes it to this den of iniquity we call Canada. Jo-Jo left his home in Atlanta, Georgia for some Toronto grass.  Get back.
Helpmates - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 11:58 AM EDT (#218606) #
Tim Collins went 2 innings last night, let up no hits, and struck out 5 in his Mississippi Braves debut.

Let's turn the page, shall we?  Does it benefit any of us to continue to pine for a five-foot-seven middle reliever?
Joshua - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 12:06 PM EDT (#218607) #
agreed. It's time to move on. I bet you some braves fan posted on their forums that Jo-Jo pitched a one hitter
Kelekin - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 02:38 PM EDT (#218611) #
Just because someone is no longer a Jays prospect doesn't mean they can't post about them or follow them.  I'll still follow Collins and I'll still follow Chavez personally.

Oh and if Jo-Jo has a really weird start, I hope the title is "Jojo's Bizarre Adventure".   I appreciate obscure enough references.

TimberLee - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 02:56 PM EDT (#218612) #

Good lord, yes!  I still follow Vlad Guerrero's games and I understand he isn't based in Canada any more.

 BTW, is anyone keeping track of former Expos? I'd sure like to know when we're down to the last few still active.

Kelekin - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 03:42 PM EDT (#218615) #
TimberLee: We have Clint Everts in AA. :P
greenfrog - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 04:00 PM EDT (#218616) #
Like Pastornicky and Collins, Chavez is having a really nice season. The 21-year-old is hitting 296/365/557 (351/457/865 in his last ten games) in the California League / A ball. But that's the price you pay for talent like Morrow and Escobar.

As for the current baby Jays, Hechavarria is off to a solid start in AA, in an admittedly tiny sample size. And congrats to Reyes for an outstanding start last night.
Helpmates - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 04:20 PM EDT (#218617) #
Just because someone is no longer a Jays prospect doesn't mean they can't post about them or follow them.

I INSIST you stop following him!!
Mick Doherty - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 04:37 PM EDT (#218618) #

I still follow Vlad Guerrero's games

I never did before this year, and now that I see him up close and personal in North Texas, I regret missing the earlier part of his career more closely. I knew the reputation but never really knew it to be true until this year -- the greatest bad-ball hitter since Yogi Berra, and maybe better than that!

Cynicalguy - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 04:52 PM EDT (#218619) #

Here's a story in one of the Atlanta papers about Collins' outing, and some Braves fans comments.  It doesn't seem like they are talking about Jo-Jo's near not hit game.

I'll still follow Collins because he's an amazing human interest story, and he has a chance to defy the conventional wisdom of baseball scouts that only really tall and big pitchers can make it.

greenfrog - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 10:08 PM EDT (#218623) #
Interesting finish to tonight's game. Cito made the right move bringing Camp in to get the final out (after Gregg had walked the bases loaded) - maybe the run-in with Wilner over bullpen usage had some effect on Cito after all. Gregg sure wasn't happy about it, though.

katman - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 10:20 PM EDT (#218624) #
Speaking of mojo, or lack thereof... another maddening game from A.J. in the Bronx:

"Niemann went substantially longer in the game than Burnett, who got frustrated and punched the plexiglass lineup holder attached to a door in the Yankees' clubhouse. He came away from the punch with cuts on his hands, which led to his leaving the game in the third inning. "I felt completely out of whack," Burnett said. "I felt good coming into today. I felt good in pregame ... Once again, I didn't give our team a chance out of the gate."

They're seeing a lot of Mr. Hyde lately. Anyone still upset that we didn't match the Yanks' offer?
SJE - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 11:10 PM EDT (#218626) #
And in other news JPA hits 27th, yes I know its a hitters league.
Gerry - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 11:11 PM EDT (#218627) #

JP Arencibia, #27 tonight.   That is all.

Matthew E - Saturday, July 17 2010 @ 11:22 PM EDT (#218628) #
I understand that it's Arencibia's second year in the league. But there are probably lots of other hitters who are also repeating the league, and how many of them have hit 27 homers?
Mylegacy - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 12:17 AM EDT (#218629) #
JP is a catcher - the hardest - by far - position to play. He has to be able to call games, receive, select pitches, know his pitchers, throw and catch. I understand he leads the league in passed balls. The kid could be a DH or maybe a 1st baseman real soon. Not so sure he's a major league catcher yet though.

He'll have to become at least an adequate major league catcher BEFORE he gets the chance to show he could be an above average power hitter. His defense will get him to the bigs - if he makes it. His power offense will make him a star once he gets there... (IMHO).

christaylor - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 02:09 AM EDT (#218631) #
The only thing I miss about AJ is watching his right arm hang in the stretch and he doesn't even seem to do that anymore.

He gone.
christaylor - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 02:12 AM EDT (#218632) #
Shhh. Don't tell anyone, but, I think the secret is that Buck will be moved for a prospect (any prospect) before the end of July (or nothing before the end of August).

JPA will catch most of the games in September, book it.
earlweaverfan - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 09:08 AM EDT (#218635) #
One of the biggest stories about the Jays this year - if not the biggest - is that we have, in Alex Anthopoulos, an absolutely fearless, as well as smart, leader.  He is not afraid to pursue deals that bring significant risk but high potential reward.  He buttresses his decisions with the detailed perspectives of multiple scouts - a source of intelligence that he has shored up this year.

Many of his moves already appear to be winners - Morrow, Lewis, acquiring Gonzalez, acquiring Buck.  But when he takes a flyer on someone who does not pan out (Eveland). the price was low, and AA does not fall in love with his mistake - he moves on.  He also makes it clear that performance is what keeps a pitcher in the bigs - Roenicke, Carlson, Accardo, Lewis, Valdez all got a shot, failed to deliver, and found themselves in Vegas.

The large majority of BB aficionados like the deal he has done with Atlanta, but of course, time will tell.  The wonderful thing is his drive to do whatever it takes to make this team stronger.

So, BB editors, would you be willing to open up a thread on the topic of what further deals AA will do before the deadline?  Many of us feel Buck is among the most likely trade chips, especially with JPA outhomering Jose Bautista so far.  But what would constitute an attractive return for Buck, less than which AA should keep him for the rest of the year?  Which teams have the need for Buck, and also the ability to pay that price?  Who else has sufficient trading value and is not a keeper?  Which Blue Jay positions should AA be trying to strengthen?  Or should he be going for high potential, long term prospects?
cybercavalier - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 10:06 AM EDT (#218639) #
For catcher, the Expos (em... the Nats) need a starting catcher. Pudge is the starting catcher (1HR so far) there with Wil Nieves as backup. Maybe we can get some prospect(s) from their junior level minor leagues given their high draft picks. Or following the trade of Gonzalez for Escobar, that is packaging with a few passable or average prospects to get some better prospects or draft picks.
uglyone - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 10:25 AM EDT (#218644) #
I'm pretty stunned at how much I've loved every move AA has made. I was always a JP defender because I felt he was vastly overcriticized for being just a mediocre GM....but I have to say, after watching JP follow every good he made with an equally bad move for 8 years.....it's pretty fun to watch a GM who I can't help but love every move he's made.

The only moves by AA that I've had some issue with are his treatment of EE, and his super-duper patience with promoting the prospects.....but neither of those are huge issues, and they really pale in comparison to all his successful value moves.

His veteran pick ups have been pretty brilliant, really - Lewis, Buck, Gonzo, Gregg, Eveland, Molina, Wise - have all worked out as well as could possibly have been hoped...and he's already been able to move two of them at high value for IMO better young assets in Escobar and even Uviedo.

As for needs going forward....am I the only one starting really like all the talent around the diamond on this team? are they really so far away from being a good team as people keep saying? I mean, once Bautista's bat moves to 3B, which positions do we not like on this team now and going forward? maybe 1B and C - but we have two studly pretty much MLB ready prospects about to fill those holes.  Not so sure I see many glaring holes in this roster right now, pure talent-wise at least.....I mean, I think we're getting near having all-star level talent at most every spot on the diamond.

And the pitching looks even better.


bball12 - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 10:38 AM EDT (#218645) #
For what its worth - I think AA has done an exceptional job in a very short period of time.

When you really look hard at what he inherited from JP related to position players - you begin to see the daunting challenges he faces.

JP's selections of position players in the 2007 and 2008 drafts were as bad as anything I have ever seen. A drunken monkey throwing darts at the draft board could not have done worse.

This - I believe - is AA's biggest challenge - developing a solid pipeline of future position players and addressing the glaring deficiencies of the current team at the same time.

So far - AA gets an A+ in my book - as he has been very abruptly faced with making chicken salad out of chicken ****

 

ayjackson - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 10:45 AM EDT (#218646) #

JP's selections of position players in the 2007 and 2008 drafts were as bad as anything I have ever seen.

Well he only selected three, and one was JP Arencibia and another was the type of high risk prep bat people had been longing for.  The other was David Cooper, who seemed like a decent, if not uninspiring option at a poor place in the draft.  JP bashers like to ignore the fact that the Scouting Director made all the picks after the first round in the JP era.

bball12 - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 10:50 AM EDT (#218647) #
I stand corrected.

JP and the Scouting Director made those selections.

BTW - I am not a JP basher - I dont even know the guy.




ayjackson - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 10:59 AM EDT (#218649) #
Fair enough.  I'm sorry if I less-than-subtly implied you were a basher.
uglyone - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 11:17 AM EDT (#218650) #
But isn't it  "bashing" to try and criticize a GM's performance over 8 years for his selection of specifically position players in specifically only 2 of his drafts? how is that a valid criticism?

especially when one of them is currently the best hitter in the minors as a 24 year old catcher?
bball12 - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 11:45 AM EDT (#218654) #
ayjack - I appreciate that - thanks

Uglyone - Looks like you are - once again - absolutely correct.
It is bashing - in your "opinion" of course. LOL

OK - you win - They did a great job with the 2007 and 2008 position player draft.
Bravo.


 



ZekeBella - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 01:38 PM EDT (#218659) #
I think that when trading the Bucks or Overbays what AA should be looking for is decent young relievers, the kind that he can control for a couple of years anyway and the kind that are not worn out by having pitched too many innings in a career year. You just need to go through the effectiveness of this year's present relief corps and check how many will be free agents in 2011. We will need relief and I don't subscribe to the theory that you just slide a couple of failed starters into a relief role and everything will be fine. The good news is that based on his performance so far, and especially the Escobar trade I am confident that he will make good moves in the next 2 weeks.
TamRa - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 02:00 PM EDT (#218660) #
with the number of good SP we have competing, it's not a given that the starter in the bullpen will be someone who has "failed" as a starter.

You could say that of Purcey - but if Mills ends up in the pen next year or (god forbid) Zep, these are not "failed starters" - i wouldn't even say that of Richmond necessarily.



85bluejay - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 02:27 PM EDT (#218662) #

I Think that AA will be looking for high ceiling young talent - which means he will probably need to package our

veterans with some of our B/C prospects. With the B-type FA, if AA doesn't get quality offers then he will probably

be better off holding on to the player and collect those 1st. rd. supp. in a deep 2011 draft - the beauty with those type

B FA is that the signing team doesn't lose a pick so it isn't a consideration in signing.

TamRa - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 02:40 PM EDT (#218663) #
When you really look hard at what he inherited from JP related to position players - you begin to see the daunting challenges he faces.

JP's selections of position players in the 2007 and 2008 drafts were as bad as anything I have ever seen. A drunken monkey throwing darts at the draft board could not have done worse.


Here we go again.

without bothering with the point already made vis-a-vi who does the choosing, let's take the points in order:

first - what he inherited in terms of position players:

That's Hill, Lind, Snider, Jeroloman, Arencibia, Emaus and a bunch of guys who haven't had time to prove out yet either way, some struggling and some just young or inexperienced. but they are not all scrubs. the include Thames, McDade, Jimenez, Marisnick, Goins, and Hobson who are playing well

that's certainly not as many as the pitchers he's produced but your focus is on position players.

I've bolded those who came from the two drafts you criticized most heavily.

But if that still seems like too little for you, let's compare it to a team that no one questions are wizards of the draft.

Here are the Red Sox position players prospects and success stories from the draft, counting back from 2009:
(I only checked the first ten rounds of the last three drafts for this)

2009:
none
2008:
Ryan Westmoreland
Ryan Lavernway (never heard of him but having a good start)
2007:
none
2006:
Zach Daegas
Ryan Kalish
Lars Anderson
2005:
Jacoby Ellsbury
Jed Lowrie
2004:
Dustin Pedroia
2003:
David Murphy
Matt Murton
2002:
none of note

specifically in the 2007-2008 draft - which team had the better draft on position players? is Theo Epstien something less than a "drunken monkey throwing darts"?

On the whole

Hill + Lind equal to, better than, or worse than Pedroia + Murphy?

Rather have Snider or Ellsbury?
Arencibia or Anderson?

Or are we going to conclude that the Red Sox suck at drafting position players too?

All that said, I agree that AA seems to be a quantum leap upward from JP - but that says more about AA than it does JP.

bball12 - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 02:51 PM EDT (#218664) #
Well - at least you agree with something. LOL

I'll take it.

As for JP - he's another Steve Phillips - I'll pass - gladly.

Spifficus - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 03:12 PM EDT (#218665) #
I don't see JP as a publicly scandalous intern-diddling sex addict, and I don't see a Scott Kazmir giveaway (or a Scott Kazmir drafted) on his record. I also don't see him with any playoff appearances. He's probably the anti Steve Phillips, actually.

Chuck - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 03:20 PM EDT (#218666) #
There's lots to dislike about Phillips but the Kazmir traded can't be included. That was a Dan Duquette move.
Spifficus - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 03:41 PM EDT (#218668) #
Umm... nah, I'm still ok with blaming Phillips for it. Maybe Bernie Madoff, too.
92-93 - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 04:43 PM EDT (#218671) #

The only moves by AA that I've had some issue with are his treatment of EE

Have you watched the Blue Jays play since the All Star break? Do you still think E5 is capable of being a starting MLB 3B? Funny how we both have some issues with the treatment of EE, but for entirely different reasons.

JP's selections of position players in the 2007 and 2008 drafts were as bad as anything I have ever seen. A drunken monkey throwing darts at the draft board could not have done worse.

This is just too much. The Blue Jays 2007 draft was widely regarded by the "experts" as one of the best in baseball, if not the best. Even if he missed entirely on position players, who the heck cares? You don't draft for need, and the 2007 draft has already brought Brett Cecil, Marc Rzepczynski, and Brad Mills to the majors, 3 LH arms likely to be around for awhile (Mills doesn't get enough credit for what he's doing in the PCL, even if he's only a #6/7 SP swingman RP type). Sure, it would have been nice if the Jays went for Travis D'Arnaud at 16 instead of Kevin Ahrens as some people were speculating, but you really are discounting the crapshoot aspect of the draft, and the fact that they almost nabbed D'Arnaud anyway instead of Cecil at 37. Heading into the draft it seemed like consensus they were going after JP Arencibia, who looks like a guy that will provide them some nice pre-FA value, but here's some of the other names that were being thrown around for the first 2 Jay picks at 16 and 21 - Matt Dominguez, Pete Kozma, Beau Mills, Devin Mesoraco, and Nick Noonan. It's not exactly a who's who of prospects. Day 2 in 2007 brought Brad Emaus and Darin Mastroianni, 2 guys who might provide the Jays utility bench value in the near future. It's true that Ahrens, Justin Jackson, and Eric Eiland look like duds, but when you add in Trystan Magnuson and John Tolisano to Arencibia, Cecil, Rzepczysnki, Mills, Emaus, and Mastroianni, you have the makings of a damn good draft.

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=6327

As for the 2008 draft, equally ludicrous. People were hoping Brett Wallace or Brett Lawrie would fall to the Jays at 17 but it didn't happen, so they chose David Cooper over Ike Davis, which was pretty well liked around these parts, considering Cooper flashed better power and K zone control in college. Fangraphs writer and BB commenter Marc went so far as to say he would puke if the Jays selected Davis. The only decent position prospect remaining in the first round seems to have been Lonnie Chisenhall, but everyone was scared away by the whole stealing computers thing (a shame, he'd be nice to have). When you dig deeper into the draft you see Tyler Pastornicky in the 5th, a nice pick which definitely helped the Jays land Yunel Escobar, followed by Eric Thames (7th) & Daniel Farquhar (10th) who are having solid seasons at AA, and A.J. Jimenez (9th) who might turn out to be the crown jewel of the draft as a 20 year old C (.301/.350/.431) at Lansing.

I guess the Richard Griffin reading crowd will just never accept that much of what Ricciardi did in his time here was positive, and that he left the team in pretty good shape for Anthopolous. It's hilarious to see the rippage of two JP drafts that occurred within the last 3 years, as if other teams around MLB are flush with regulars coming from those classes.

slitheringslider - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 05:07 PM EDT (#218674) #
I definitely think JP has his faults but much of his apparent lack of success is due to him being plying his trade in the AL East. Is JP an elite GM? No, but I do think he is an above average GM that would succeed in producing playoff teams in a weaker division. Looking at the 2006-2008 teams, you can argue they would've been a playoff team in the NL or one of the weaker AL divisions. If you look at the record of JP's mentor Billy Beane, his record is not that much better than JP's over the past 8 years, and his A's get to play the dreadful Mariners and Rangers teams instead of the Yankees and Red Sox. We can all agree that JP is excellent at identifying and developing pitchers, and finding useful veteran pieces. What bothered me about him is his lack of cajones in the trade market, and his unwillingness to admit his team is not destined for the playoffs and still hold on to his veterans through the deadline. I don't think the Halladay deal, Morrow deal, or the Yunel deal would've ever happened if JP was still around.
Paul D - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 05:58 PM EDT (#218676) #
That was a Dan Duquette move.

Not quite - it was Jim Duquette.
Chuck - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 06:01 PM EDT (#218677) #

Not quite - it was Jim Duquette.

Spifficus had Steve Phillips and Bernie Madoff implicated in all this. I will add Dan Duquette's name to the list of those somehow involved. And Jeff Gillooly.

Yes, it was quite the conspiracy.

 

earlweaverfan - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 06:15 PM EDT (#218678) #
Right, everyone, can we let the mediocrity of JP go?  Can we get it behind us?

Everyone here seems to agree, that AA does have the cajones in the trade market and that he is not finished with his efforts to improve the team.

So can we stop arguing about how bad JP was  - maybe strong, but flawed; maybe mediocre, maybe poor, maybe horrible, but do we need to debate any of this?

What I find fascinating about the Escobar deal was that, while everyone expected AA to do one or more deals about now, nobody here that I saw was able to predict this at all.  So, can we raise our game a bit?

Is there anyone here who has a strong idea of what AA's next deal will be (or a brilliant idea of what it ought to be)?  After all, if the best this site can do is to be a bunch of armchair GMs who provide brilliant after-the-fact analysis of AA's deals, that's not too impressive.

What I would love to see AA do is to pull off one of those trades as ambitious and fearless as the Carter/Alomar challenge trade, or if not, at least to snag a couple of lights out younger relief pitchers that the Jays could then control - whether any of Thornton, Santos, or Bard would be available on terms AA would be interested in, I don't know.  There may well be others more likely to be available. 

Any one of the three of them would represent major step up to the bullpen that could really support our young starting pitchers through the next few years when we no longer have Downs, Frasor and Gregg anymore.  When combined with Camp, Janssen, Purcey, Rzepczynski, (and one or two of Carlson, Roenicke, Magnuson, Stewart??) we could have an absolutely reliable bullpen.

But likely, someone here has a much better idea.  If so, bring it on...

bpoz - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 06:57 PM EDT (#218679) #
Earlweaverfan... Help can come from anyplace.
B Jenks waiver wire.
Henke was some sort of compensation draft pick because we lost a player in an earlier draft. The Jays and another team were the only teams to lose anyone so they got to pick.
Dennis Martinez... IMO the Expos flooded spring training with reclamation projects and he survived.

IMO with all his scouts he must have a list of potential closers that can be groomed. I am sure he will go after a few of these.
Mick Doherty - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 09:30 PM EDT (#218686) #

get to play the dreadful Mariners and Rangers

Really? You're using present tense "get to play the dreadful ... Rangers" about a 53-39 team with the biggest division lead in the major leagues, also 9.5 games ahead of Beane's A's and having must taken three of four from the Red Sox?

These Rangers are, Vlad Guerrero aside, also one of the *youngest* teams in the major leagues. I don't think *anyone* sees them as a team they "get to" play ...

uglyone - Sunday, July 18 2010 @ 10:31 PM EDT (#218688) #
What I find fascinating about the Escobar deal was that, while everyone expected AA to do one or more deals about now, nobody here that I saw was able to predict this at all.  So, can we raise our game a bit?

True, it did come pleasantly out of nowhere......I was spitballing an idea of Marcum + Gonzo for Andrus over on Scout before the rangers picked up Lee....

......but then AA went out and got a better SS than Andrus, without giving up a piece like Marcum, so I'm more than a little impressed with the Greek right now.
Mick Doherty - Monday, July 19 2010 @ 10:51 AM EDT (#218705) #

a better SS than Andrus

Respectfully, uglyone, he absolutely is NOT that. I think you can make an argument that Excobar is better (though I think you'd be wrong) but keep in mind, Andrus is six years younger  -- he's not even 22 yet!  The Rangers would have, quite rightly, laughed at the idea of Marcum and Gonzalez for Andrus.

That said, it was a hell of a deal for the Jays to get Escobar at that price. Well done and all that.

R Romero Vaughan - Monday, July 19 2010 @ 10:51 AM EDT (#218706) #

Signing bonuses.

Whilst holding on to players, letting them leave and get picks may make sense in a deep draft, there is the economics of the situation too.

If you deal a Buck or a JBau then you save the money on their contracts (could be $3m dollars total this season) plus you don't pay the signing bonuses of the prospects you get. (could save another $1.5m)

You can then use that $4.5m to plough into the international market (as we are doing) or to pay people who slip in the draft (Dickie thon Jr)

If you can get equivalent talent in a trade you have to consider it for this reason alone - becuase it gives you the money to go and buy some other draft or draft-like players.

Holding on for picks is effectively a double tax in this sense.

 

 

 

 

 

 

uglyone - Monday, July 19 2010 @ 10:57 AM EDT (#218707) #

Respectfully, uglyone, he absolutely is NOT that. I think you can make an argument that Excobar is better (though I think you'd be wrong) but keep in mind, Andrus is six years younger  -- he's not even 22 yet!  The Rangers would have, quite rightly, laughed at the idea of Marcum and Gonzalez for Andrus.

Well, he IS better than Andrus.

True Andrus is younger, and might catch up, but Andrus has yet to reach anywhere near the level that Yunel has.

 

 

Kasi - Tuesday, July 20 2010 @ 03:15 PM EDT (#218822) #
The problem with Andrus is that he has absolutely no power. I'm sure in time he could be better as he fills out, but right now he's not.
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