Batter's Box Interactive Magazine Batter's Box Interactive Magazine Batter's Box Interactive Magazine
Jays lose 8-7 to the White Sox after Jason Frasor blows the save. More importantly: what is the record for most consecutive games with a save situation to open a season? I guess that's kind of a convoluted stat, but 7 seems like a lot to me. Also, Vernon homered again.


-----

During last week's discussion about Brett Wallace, I started thinking about the defensive comparison between first base and third base. It seems to be generally accepted wisdom that 3B is significantly harder to play than 1B, for a variety of reasons. Certainly a strong and accurate arm is a requirement at the hot corner, while a poor arm on a first baseman wouldn't have much of a negative defensive effect at all, since a first baseman rarely has to make a throw.

People also throw the word "range" around when comparing the defensive requirements of the two positions. Specifically, it's commonly believed that a third baseman needs to be much more mobile to his sides to be an adequate defender.

Is that really true? It seems to me that both corner infielders need to cover about the same amount of ground, laterally. Am I wrong in this assumption? Does the second baseman usually play closer to the first baseman than the shortstop plays to third, decreasing the number of plays the 1B makes relative to the 3B?

Of course, there are also "tweeners" - if a ball is hit such that both the 3B and SS could field it, it's likely that the 3B would take it, since his momentum is going the right way to make the play. On the other hand, the second baseman would probably take a first-second tweener to avoid the awkward pitcher-covering-first-base scenario. So this is a point in favour of the "yes, 3B need more range" hypothesis, since it increases the amount of ground a 3B covers, and decreases the amount a 1B covers.

Also, we must consider platoons. Since most batters are right-handed, and batters tend to pull, the third baseman sees more ground balls than the first baseman. This doesn't have any effect on the AMOUNT of range required, but it does increase the importance placed on the fielder's ability to cover that range. A 3B with good range adds more defensive value to his team than an equally good 1B, simply because more balls are hit his way. On the other hand, a 3B with poor range hurts his team more than an equally poor 1B by letting more balls go by. Here's point #2 in favour of "yes, 3B need more range".

This was all a long way of wondering "why not put Wallace at third, because if his range is poor, it won't really make a difference, as long as his arm is adequate for 3B?" But the answer seems to be no, it will make a difference, and he should probably be playing first, especially if reports of his potential as an above-average defensive 1B are true. However, I maintain my position that it wouldn't hurt to give him some time at 3B every now and then, especially given the lack of 3B in the organization. If Wallace could play a passable 3B, it would give AA more flexibility in terms of roster construction, by giving him an option for a back-up 3B who is already in the starting line-up. It would also open the door to potentially-cost-effective platoon scenarios, such as: against RHP, a LH platoon 3B at third with Wallace at first, and against LHP, Wallace at third with a RH platoon 1B at first.

Anyway, I don't want this to turn into a Wallace discussion since that's already been had. The question I'm more interested in is the general comparison between playing first and third. It seems to me that a third baseman doesn't need to cover much more ground than a first baseman, but since he sees far more batted balls, a greater importance is placed on his ability to cover that ground. So yes, third basemen do need to have better range than first basemen. What do you think?
TDIB 13 April 2010: Thoughts About Corner Infield Defense | 15 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
Mike Green - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 09:49 AM EDT (#213538) #
Third basemen need to be quicker, have greater lateral range and have better arms than first basemen, for a few reasons.  When a third basemen plays in (which he does more often than a first baseman- you don't play a first baseman in with a speedster at the plate), quickness is key.  The importance of lateral range for a third basemen, as compared with first basemen, arises from the asymmetry of the situation.  A ball in the short-third hole which gets by the third basemen is a hit over 2/3 of the time because the shortstop must field and make the long throw with his momentum going the wrong way.  A ball in the first-second hole which gets by the first baseman is a much easier play for the second baseman who has the short throw with his momentum carrying him towards the bag.  Often a first baseman will peel back if it is clear that the second baseman will be able to field the ball; third basemen don't do that.

I missed the middle innings of last night's game.  I was a bit surprised that Tallet was left in after 5 innings.  Wouldn't it have been a good time for Accardo or Valdez?  The White Sox list right, and having Tallet throw more than 5 innings in a game like last night's doesn't make sense to me, but then...(add mandatory comment about value of tandem starters)

Mike Green - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 10:03 AM EDT (#213539) #
I see that Alex Obal made the same point last night. 

Jeff Blair reports in today's Globe that the Jays have agreed with a radio station in Montreal to have a few games broadcast there.  As Blair describes it, these are the first baby steps towards national marketing of the club.  This is one area in which AA may be more of a positive influence than Ricciardi was.

Jdog - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 11:02 AM EDT (#213541) #

I think 90% of current managers would have taken Tallet out of the game after 5 innings. Very frustrating to see Cito stick with him long enough to give up a lead on multiple occasions. The only losses this team has on the season were blown saves in the 9th. Thats pretty impressive.

westcoast dude - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 11:54 AM EDT (#213543) #
Five innings and stick a fork in may be an oversimplification, but Cito tends to be sclerotic in these things.  Relief pitching in the last three innings was like night and day: White Sox throwing 95 mile an hour heat past the Blue Jays and the home team pitching pinball, starting with a homer, then fouled rockets and and great defence up the middle. Most entertaining, and a dramatic success, if nothing else.
Thomas - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 12:02 PM EDT (#213547) #
I was a bit surprised that Tallet was left in after 5 innings.

Once Tallet was left in to face Andruw, I have no issue leaving him in to face Pierzynski. Tallet's splits aren't great, but Pierzynski is ineffective against lefties and hadn't looked too good at the plate all evening. At that point, maybe you leave Tallet in until he gives up another hit, but I would have probably taken him out after 5 and, if I hadn't, certainly after Rios singled. After seven games this team hasn't been out of a ballgame for a single inning, which is quite a nice start to the year.

Parker - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 12:36 PM EDT (#213550) #

I didn't see this mentioned anywhere else yet:

mlbtraderumors.com has the Jays listed as a likely trade destination for Fred Lewis.  I hope AA can get a deal done... it'd be nice to have a leadoff guy who can hit right-handed pitching.  Also might be nice if he can play a passable CF and the Jays are finally willing to admit that Wells can't.

Parker - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 12:40 PM EDT (#213551) #
Somehow I missed rpriske's comment from over half an hour ago.  Oops.
martinthegreat - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 03:33 PM EDT (#213567) #
Also, according to Rotoworld we now officially have Hech.
braden - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 08:23 PM EDT (#213579) #
Romero looking, um, completely unhittable.  10 Ks through 5.
Thomas - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 08:37 PM EDT (#213581) #
This is completely off-topic, but does anyone know what happened to Curtis Thigpen? I can't find any record of him playing after the team traded him to Oakland in the spring of 2009.

(It came up because in an interview Marcum said he hasn't shaken off Buck once this year, which he is very pleased with. He said he's usually been on the same page as his catchers, but mentioned Thigpen as someone he had to shake off "a few times" as opposed to "almost never" or "never" for guys like Barajas and Zaun.)
scottt - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 08:48 PM EDT (#213582) #
From what I understand, Thigpen missed 2009 because of a back injury.
scottt - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 09:14 PM EDT (#213583) #
Romero was unhittable, but Pierzynski wasn't.

Should be save opportunity  #8.


Spifficus - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 09:22 PM EDT (#213584) #
The only intelligable thing I have to say about that game (and the only thing I've been saying for a couple hours) is WOW!
Alex Obal - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 10:39 PM EDT (#213586) #
What stood out to me about this start was how sharp Romero's curveball was. He threw it for a first-pitch strike at least four times and wiped out a few batters with it, swinging and looking.
 
If not for a nice play by Encarnacion, the no-hitter wouldn't have made it out of the first inning.

After the no-hitter was broken, and after Romero's last inning, some Skydome employee started the slow clap-inducing drumbeat. How stupid do they think fans are? I think the crowd at the second game of the year has a few baseball fans in it and probably knows what's going on. That was either condescension or self-promotion. Either way, it was weak.

Kevin Gregg overpowered three RH batters in the ninth. He's on a roll. Playoffs?
John Northey - Tuesday, April 13 2010 @ 11:05 PM EDT (#213588) #
Playoffs? Hey, the magic number to eliminate the 2nd place Yankees is at 155 (combo of Yankee losses and Jay wins to eliminate the Yankees). Let the countdown begin!

The 5 game spread between the Jays and Orioles is the biggest spread in any division from top to bottom. However, the Phillies and Giants do have a better record 7-1 vs 6-2.
TDIB 13 April 2010: Thoughts About Corner Infield Defense | 15 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.