Always good to see the Jays understanding the concept of 'sunk costs'.  BJ was not coming back and was wasting a roster slot so they dumped him.  Says something when Dirk Hayhurst is higher on the food chain than BJ was.

Now, the Jays are on the hook for one more season worth $10-million dollars.  

The Jays are actually on the hook for about 15 million because they still have to pay him for the rest of this season and next season.

It turned out to be a a terrible signing (which I supported at the time) by a bad GM.

My favorite BJ moment was from May 3rd, 2006. The Jays took the lead in the top of 9th vs. the Red Sox at Fenway. BJ Ryan came in and he punched out Big Papi and than got Manny to line out. Due to a passed ball, stolen base, and an error, the Sox had a man on 3rd. Varitek came to the plate and Ryan froze him with a called third strike to end the game.

My favorite too.  I was at this game see:  http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y234/andrewkw/fenway/100B5541.jpg
This game was my favorite Russ Adams moment too.

The jays had to have known they'd be lucky to get 4 years out of Ryan.  The 5th year was likely accepted as a wash and was needed simply to get the deal done.  They got one of the best years ever for a relief pitcher maybe not Eck historic but pretty damn good, and one acceptable year.  It could have been a lot worse.

I think I would have really liked to have been a fly on the wall during the JP, Arnsberg and Cito conversation about Ryan in deciding to release him. I think this is a mistake, but JP has lost a useful player by release only once (Scott Eyre but he went to the NL so who knows if he could have been useful in the AL East) or twice (and Johnson as a money dump). I will defer to management on this one that they can't get anything useful out of him anymore. Baltimore must think this is pretty funny.

I suspect there some of a player forcing managements hand in this one. In hearing Ryan's comments on sportsnet where he was quoted as blaming his lack of command on his inconsistent use. Ryan was horrible and I while I have no inside information, I can imagine him being malcontent or at least a negative influence in the clubhouse. As JP and Cito seem to value that aspect of players (see JP's comments on Dunn and Cito's problems with malcontents in the past) this could play into it.

I have a question -- why an outright release, could they not DFA him with the hopes of getting him some work in Vegas to get back to form? Perhaps there's something in the rules that I'm missing here, but that would seem the option if he was willing to work for the team. His outright release rather than DFA makes me think that Ryan wanted out and the team knew he'd refuse an assignment to Syracuse and just saved everyone some time.

I think keeping around BJ would have significantly helped the Jays get into a better draft position for next year. Getting to draft a top ten player and a higher pick in subsequent rounds is what this team needs this season at this point. Playing for .500 doesn't make sense. If you are not in it, you don't need to rebuild, but you can certainly make the best of a bad situation. I would hate to see the Jays choked out by being .500 year after year instead of tanking to at least have a chance.

Jays pitchers have honoured B.J. tonight by pitching as terrible as he did.

IMO, though we will never really know, the Jays probably ask BJ to back up his "all I need is regular work" comments by taking a few weeks in Vegas to prove it and he decilined and thus, the release.

I think it's time to give Tallet a rest. He served honorably but he's maybe running out of gas. The Jays need a #5 only one time before the first week of August - July 25. For me that would be Tallet's last start of the season.

By August Marcum is back and unless something very strange happens we need to be giving innings to Cecil et al in the last spot (or two depending on how Richmond holds up) in the rotation.

It's painful, but this was the right move.

It sucks to be paying him next year, but the Jays have several good relievers in Downs, Frasor, Accardo and League. I'd rather give innings to those guys.

Tallet should go back to the pen as the long relief man before his arm falls off.

Now, let Delluci be next.

A little off topic (but someone mentioned Marcum), is his service clock ticking when he's on the DL? 

Yup.  DL time, if you were in the majors when DL'ed, does count towards service time.  Same if you were on the 40 man and put on the DL during spring training before being optioned out iirc.

Robert Ray is accumulating major league service time right now.

How many innings should  Brett Cecil throw this year? He's at 88 IP now. The most he's thrown in any year (since high school anyway) is 118 last year.

Of course, making plans of any sort for the rotation in the year 2009 is a mug's game. Whatever you decide, events are probably just going to come up and bite you. Just asking for trouble

I believe Marcum will be like Josh Johnson (if he comes back in August)...he'll make around $1.5 mill with incentives next year. Unless he impresses the Jays and they offer him something like 3 years and $7-10 mill and a couple of options years to take him through 2014...

Michael Barrett, who's been playing with Las Vegas since the middle of June, was accumulating major league service time while he was doing so - he was on a major league Disabled List, in the minors on injury rehab.  His injury rehab is now over, he was outrighted to Las Vegas on Monday, and he's no longer getting service time.

His time on the Toronto DL got his career major league service over 10 years, which is probably pretty good for the MLB pension.

Also down on the farm - Fabio Castro is having another so-so outing (7 hits, 3 BB and 5 ER in 4 IP so far.) But Travis Snider's hit his second big fly in as many nights.

Mr Delucci, the clock is ticking.

And don't forget....Free Joe Inglett.  He is smoaking!!!  (see what I did there?)

Seriously, Joe was called up to the Jays about three minutes after coming off a long stay on the DL.  He wasn't able to find his stroke in sporatic action with the big club.  Well, he's found it now.  He's hitting .500 over his past 10 games with 8 doubles and a homer.  Give Dellucci another five minutes of fame and then show him the sidecar to BJ's bike.

Actually, Ray was demoted before going on the DL (May 22nd to minors DL was shortly afterwards) so he isn't accumulating ML service time.  Guys on the ML DL are Janssen, Litsch, Marcum, McGowan, and Richmond.

Ray was demoted

That was indeed how they originally planned to proceed, but it's not what ended up happening. The transaction (back to AAA) was voided and he's on the major league DL. Exactly like League last year.

The transaction page for the Jaysstill lists Ray being optioned out on May 22 - the daily Game Notes have been carrying the update. On May 28, the transaction was voided and he went on the DL retroactive to May 22.

Thanks Magpie.  I guess his optioning out was too close to the DL thus the Players Union would've complained.  It is a big financial hit for a kid if he is on the minor league roster (with minor league pay) vs the major league roster with the ML minimum, plus of course the service time which is very valuable long term.

I think this is a mistake, but JP has lost a useful player by release only once (Scott Eyre but he went to the NL so who knows if he could have been useful in the AL East) or twice (and Johnson as a money dump).

I think JP also released Brandon Lyon.

According to BBref, both Eyre and Lyon were lost to waivers, which is different than an outright release such as with BJ Ryan and Frank Thomas.  You can still argue that they were ill-advised moves at the time, but exposing players to waivers is one of the only way to demote players to AAA or to manage your 25-man and 40-man rosters.

Comparing releasing Ryan to losing Eyre on waivers is apples and oranges to me.

How many innings should  Brett Cecil throw this year? He's at 88 IP now. The most he's thrown in any year (since high school anyway) is 118 last year.

The Verducci Rule would put him at about 150, though the Jays went +40 with Purcey last year (maybe something to his struggles now?)

Anyway, IMO after Friday they should shift Cecil to the 'pen for a while because the Jays won't need a fifth starter very often over the next month.

If they keep Doc and Rick-Ro on a regular 5 day schedule, they will have to skip the fifth turn several times. i make it that a #5 will only pitch the following dates:

July 25
August 9 (and only here in order to push Doc back to the NY series instead of the Baltimore series and to insert Marcum into the rotation that week)
August 22

Then on September 1 they'll need a fifth and a sixth for the doubleheader.

What I would do is this. Send Cecil to the bullpen (so he can keep working with Arny) so as to minimize the inning count;

Send Tallet back to the 'pen but give him that July 25 start;

Recall Purcey and demote Zep (assuming Purcey isn't a write off and if he is we need to see about dealing him)

Come out of the break with Doc, Romero, Richmond and Purcey as your four regulars (though not in that order - if you start Doc in the third game after the break you maximize his turns against the Big Three) - Tallet spots in on 7/25, Marcum is added to the rotation on 8/7 at the expense of Richmond probably unless Purcey is blowing his shot again in a collosal way....
(so as of August 7 your starters are Doc, RR, Marcum, and Purcey)
...then Richmond spots in on 8/22....Richmond and Cecil start the doubleheader and then depending on how many innings he has left in the tank Cecil steps into the fifth spot through the rest of September which would give hims seven turns...or 35-40 IP. To do that he'd have to 30 innings or less in the relief role. If for whatever reason Cecil can't pitch that much then Richmond I guess.

And yes, that isn't fair to Richmond at all. But we have to max out Cecil's innings and we need to settle the question of Purcey if we can. We know what we have in Richmond.

The alternative is to write off Purcey (and hopefully get something for him) and to let Cecil start in AAA after the break until he hits his ceiling (roughly 10 or 11 starts until you have to shut him down) and leave Richmond in the rotation the rest ofthe year.

I also acknowledge that this shuts out Mills and Zep from the majors the rest of 2009 but I don't know what you can do about that. probably someone gets hurt and it solves itself.

As you noted, it's a fool's errand to project it anyway because events and unpredictable decisions make it useless.

(It's really too bad we couldn't convince the Angels we are neglecting a great talent in Purcey and get them to take him and a reliever for Wood...)

Why is Bautista batting leadoff and Millar cleanup?  Is Cito throwing the game?  Halliday must have thought he was looking at the wrong team's lineup card.

Rolen with another day off,  I guess playing the hot hand isn't part of Cito's strategy.  Poor Dimaggio would have probably been sitting once a week under Cito.

I can't fathom why Rolen needs rest 4 days before a 4 day break.

*sigh*

Rolen with another day off

Yeah, what's the problem? Gaston always gives him the day off after a night game.  And by some bizarre coincidence, he's having his best (and healthiest) season since 2004. Pay attention.

Gaston's handling of Rolen... how can anyone possibly complain? Did anyone expect him to play this well? And be this healthy? Anyone?

Poor Dimaggio would have probably been sitting once a week under Cito.

This is just stupid. Willfully, deliberately stupid.

Halladay losing 3-2 to the Rays?

(rains)'  => pours

I agree with Magpie - I don't know how anyone can complain about how Cito has handled Rolen. And why send down Zep? If this kid is the real deal, I am not sure pitching in the PCL will necessarily help his development. And with only Halladay and Romero as rotation stalwarts, why not see if we can have a big 3 heading into 2010? I think we have seen what Purcey can do and frankly he doesn't really fit our organization. JP/Cito clearly prefer strikethrowers, even if they have less stuff. Purcey is too much of a project and I suspect the organization prefer someone who can be somewhat around league average (i.e. Tallet) than a high risk, high reward proposition such as Purcey.

And for the record, there is one thing I would love to trade Halladay for...more so than Drabek & Knapp or Kershaw...a balanced schedule with the top 4 AL teams making the playoffs...it is quite sad that we have a better chance to win with a balanced schedule without Roy Halladay (the best and most irreplacable player in the game) instead of the current division setup with Roy Halladay. Absolutely ridiculous that, once again, the top 4 teams (by run differential) are in the AL east and yet we get calls for JP's head. Sign him to a contract extension. I'd be shocked if the next guy does a better job than JP without a massive payroll hike (unlikely) or a 10 year period of futility like the Rays...

Magpie,

My comment is in the other thread.  I wholeheartedly approve of Gaston's resting of Rolen.  I just wish that he'd give others (Scutaro, Barajas, for example) the day off on a day that Rolen plays.  And batting Millar clean-up is inexcusable (Bautista leading off against a lefty is entirely fine).

I like how Romero had 12 good starts and he's a rotation 'stalwart'. How about he goes around the league a few times and pitches some in the division. It's 79 very good innings, but you can't just assume he's going to pitch like this going forward. Nothing in his record to this point portended this.

I wouldn't call Romero a stalwart yet either (he'll probably get hurt anyway) but I can say that from what I've seen he has first-class stuff as opposed to the middle-of-the-rotation ceiling nonsense I've been reading for years now.

Very good point Jim.  Romero has looked very good and being a first round pick you'd assume it has higher odds of being 'real' vs a guy who was picked in the 40th round.

So far in those 12 starts he has had 2 games allowing 5 runs (Boston & Baltimore), 3 allowing 3 runs, 3 allowing 2 runs, 1 allowing 1 run, and 3 with 0 runs allowed (7,7,8 IP vs Oakland, Philly, and Tampa). 

Vs the Yankees he went 6 1/3 allowing 3 runs.  Boston he allowed those 5 runs in just 4 IP.  Tampa was 8 shutout innings.  So vs the big 3 he went 18 1/3 innings allowing 8 runs 3.93 ERA.  Not bad.  His two starts vs the Phillies were solid (14 IP 3 runs, 2nd game 10 days after the first was his 7 shutout inning one) and that is the only team he has faced twice.

The early returns have to be ranked very good for Romero, but I agree that counting on him for 2010 to be an ace or near ace would be a mistake. 

Just thought of something else... Jays record when...

Romero starts: 8-4
Halladay starts: 10-7
Richmond starts: 8-5
Tallet starts: 6-11
Cecil starts: 3-4
Janssen starts: 2-3
Purcey starts: 2-3

That covers guys with 5+ starts.  Tallet seemed strong at times but boy do the Jays suck when he pitches overall.  More losses with him pitching than with Romero & Halladay combined.

I know there is a no criticizing Rios rule on this site but I didn't know it applied to Cito as well. 

Any reason Rolen can DH after a night game with the All Star break around the corner and in the middle of a 25 game hit streak?

I know there is a no criticizing Rios rule on this site

Now I know you haven't been paying attention. Wells has surely been the number one whipping boy, but Rios has been running a pretty strong second. Most of the criticism has focused on his baseball intelligence (or lack of same) and habitual brain cramps.

As for Rolen - look. He's a 34 year old with  a chronic shoulder condition since the original injury in 2005. It's cost him big chunks of the last two seasons. It's aggravated by swinging the bat. His manager thinks that if he doesn't send him back out there 12 hours later he might have a better chance to stay healthy and be productive. And it's working. And as a bonus, the people I talk to at the press box and around the team tell me that player is extremely happy with the situation and loves playing for the manager. There are all sorts of things to be unhappy about, but this? Something that's actually working?

Lose 3 of 4 to the Yanks. Get swept by the Rays. The Roger's Center is gonna be full after the allstar break I tells ya!

"And as a bonus, the people I talk to at the press box and around the team tell me that player is extremely happy with the situation and loves playing for the manager. There are all sorts of things to be unhappy about, but this? Something that's actually working?"

What's the good being a complainer if you don't have something to complain about, bogus or not? 

So both joe inglett and travis snider aren`t in the lineup tonight.

Read into it what you will but it seems awfully suspicious if you ask me.

Since his return from the DL, Travis has either not played or played half-games every other day. 

Jordan Bastian's blog advises that Cito Gaston will not be making the trip to Baltimore, as he is attending his sister's funeral.  My condolences to him.

Her you go stat-heads (and fantasy-players), the revolution you've been waiting for.  Check it out at the NYT.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/10/sports/baseball/10cameras.html?_r=1&hpw

What would Honus say?

From the NY Times story:

“It’ll be neat to find out what the numbers are,” said Toronto Blue Jays center fielder Vernon Wells, who is known for smoothly tracking down deep fly balls.

It might not be neat Vernon, you might not like the results.

Gaston's handling of Rolen... how can anyone possibly complain? Did anyone expect him to play this well? And be this healthy? Anyone?

I don't question his handling of Rolen in the overall context - I support it. BUT including today, and for the next six weeks or more a lot of the DGANG situations will be close at hand to opportunities to rest -  in this case the upcoming all star break. i can't imagine that rolen's shoulder would still be holding together if playing in today's game when there's such a rest coming up soon would have hurt him. Sunday will be another DGANG, with 4 off days to follow.

There are 16 DGANGs in the second half, and most of them will be days in which rolen should obviously rest. but five of them proceed off days (including the last game) and another one comes on the heels of two off days in the previous five days.

I think a reasonable argument can be made for Rolen starting in a few of those games, depending of course on where the Jays are in the race.

I do have to amend my previous post though to say that I'd be much more bothered by this if they jays were not in the process of flying over the cliff anyway.

Still, it's certainly not a huge issue to me.

And why send down Zep? If this kid is the real deal, I am not sure pitching in the PCL will necessarily help his development.

Because there are only so many spots in the rotation. The same thing can be said about Cecil and Mills. And Zep - while I think he has a shot at being our #1 prospect by the off-season (not counting Snider of course) is nominally behind both those guys in terms of development.

And I qualified my remarks by saying that if we want to just write off Purcey then an argument can be made for keeping Zep up until/unless he fails to handle it.

But as much as we'd like to see them all, we can't practically have a rotation of Doc > Romero > Marcum > Cecil > Mills > Zep > Richmond > Purcey

SOMEONE has to be in AAA...in my opinion that's more logically the 23 year old who's barely out of low-A ball than the 27 year old who's running out of chances.

Unless, as I said, we assume the 27 year old has already used up his chances.

Purcey is too much of a project and I suspect the organization prefer someone who can be somewhat around league average (i.e. Tallet) than a high risk, high reward proposition such as Purcey.

If that's true then fine, but don't let him rot in Vegas...get some good out of him while he has some precieved value...even if you flip him for another underachiving "former prospect" who needs a change of scenery (a non-pitcher)

And with only Halladay and Romero as rotation stalwarts, why not see if we can have a big 3 heading into 2010?

No more than you can count on romero based on his work so far, you wouldn't be able to count on Zep (or Cecil for that matter) based on half a year. Heck, Purcey pitched very well down the stretch last year and you see how THAT is working out now.

In a best case, Doc -  Romero - Marcum is your "big 3" next year...well, no, the VERY best case includes McGowan...but if Zep is going to step up and break out like Romero did this year, he can as easily do so having spent half of this year in AAA as he can having finished out 2009 in the majors...maybe more easily.

What happened to Lyle Overbay?

3 for his last 36?

I agree that Purcey's being mishandled. Especially given that lefties tend to develop late.

This season is all but toast. Bring Purcey up for the rest of the season and throw him out there every fifth day. Best case scenario he pitches around league average (a valuable commodity) and can be used in replacing either Barajas/Scoot. I like Scoot but if he wants a contract longer than two years, the Jays need to lay off and let him walk. Ditto for Barajas but w/him one year with an option as at some point, JP or one of the other kids have to step up. Despite his struggles in AAA, I don't this JPA's production would be that far off from Barajas now.

Very interesting prospects for new defensive stats...

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/10/sports/baseball/10cameras.html

Law called Zep a reliever in his chat Thursday.  Low slot, bad arm action, reverse splits in minors was his reasoning. 

He said later he did like the core of the team.

Albert Pujols had a typical day at the office today, a homer, a triple and two walks in five plate trips.  At age 29 1/2, he's nudging past Jimmie Foxx on the greatest 1st basemen by age and closing in on Gehrig. 

I watched that game this afternoon, and Pujols is truly incredible. Most telling was that Pujols gets walked with first base empty in the first inning and a runner in scoring position. In his next at bat he took a 1-2 high and tight fastball and spanked it down the left field line for a triple (misplayed by the lost Soriano in LF). His third at bat he didn't get all of the ball and still drove it out to dead CF for a HR, and followed that up with another walk. Pure beast.