I was under the impression that you weren't alowed to trade a newly signed FA until quite a ways into the season(something near June 1 maybe).

I don't see the Jays signing Cabrera, for all the reasons previously mentioned.  If they did, then I'd finally join the chorus of chants calling for Ricciardi's firing.  He's not much better than Scutaro and the cost (1st round pick) is too great.

Unless the Jays are in a terrible financial position and have been directed to further slash payroll, it wouldn't make sense for them to trade Rolen or Overbay right now, from a position of weakness.   Perhaps if the Jays were getting a great deal or Rolen or Overbay were wrapped in a trade package that returned a replacement for their position, it would make more sense.  I think the ideal situation is that the Jays hold on to both Overbay and Rolen and they both have good, healthy seasons, and one or both are traded at the deadline.

My personal prediction is that a relatively minor deal will be done.  Perhaps a reliever or two to the Tigers for Mike Hollimon, who the Jays are reported to have interest in.

On that note, Are Star Passes out yet?

I haven't received mine either.  I don't know about you but I was told we're supposed to get a letter to pick them up in mid-February.  I think I'll be placing a call to the box office this week.

Blair just posted about the jays doing a sign and trade with the white sox for a reliever or minor league position player.  He specifically mentions the jays don't want to loose their first round pick.  Thank-you, this makes so murch more sense.  I still don't want to give up league or even scott campbell for Cabrera mind you.

A sign and trade deal for Cabrera makes sense if they can move Overbay first.

It makes ZERO sense if it is ROlen that is moving.

Ahhh thank the heavens. Now, if we can stop talking about Rolen for a bit. Even if he's just an overpaid league average hitter for this year and next, while providing outstanding defence, who else could we get for less that will provide anything close to that level of production? At least at SS you can tolerate a complete black hole on offence if the defence is acceptable. But we don't have a SS either, we can't have total black holes at both.

At least at SS you can tolerate a complete black hole on offence if the defence is acceptable.

Why? What major league shortstop currently fits this description (terrible bat, good glove, net positive)?

Adam Everett.

Maybe total black hole was laying it on a bit thick, but if you've got an elite fielding SS who will give you a 75 OPS+, he probably won't kill you. An elite fielding LF who posts an OPS+ of 75ish will do your team a lot more damage. Bartlett (82 OPS+), Aybar (83 OPS+), Cabrera (OPS+ 84) were all terrible hitters in 2008 and started the vast majority of their teams games at SS.

Each of those teams won their division. I didn't look very hard, I checked the 3 AL division winners and that's what I got. Obviously the NL would look better with Rollins on the Phillies and Theriot on the Cubs. Although Angel Berroa posted a 62 OPS+ over 84 games at SS for the Dodgers.

I stand by my statement. If there is a position (there are 2, actually) where you can sacrifice hitting for defence, it is at SS and C. Of course this hedges on the rest of your team being adequate, but my statement was not outlandish.

I looked at 2008 only and found a couple decent examples. I'm sure if I spent more then literally 6 or 7 minutes looking, I could find many more.

Oh look! It's your 2006 Toronto Blue Jays, rocking John McDonald's OPS+ of 50 over 90+ games at SS.

The rest of your lineup need not be ridiculous to hide a bad hitter. To have a good offence, you need a good top 5/6.  Contributions from the bottom 3rd are nice and all, but it's how your top 6 rolls that will dictate the majority of the time if you have an above average or below average offence.

1992 Toronto Blue Jays - 2nd in the AL in runs - C - Pat Borders, 85 OPS+, 3B - Kelly Gruber, OPS+ 72, SS - Manny Lee, OPS+ 83

That lineup seemed to hide 3 bad hitters pretty well, actually. 

Bartlett (82 OPS+), Aybar (83 OPS+), Cabrera (OPS+ 84) were all terrible hitters in 2008

Okay, I see where the source of our miscommunication lies. You are comparing shortstops, as hitters, to the average AL hitter rather than to other AL shortstops.

In 2008, AL shortstops combined for a 694 OPS while Cabrera was at 705. So Cabrera was not a terrible hitter, by shortstop standards, and as such, I'd not classify him as an offensive blackhole. Adam Everett, discussed above, was an offensive blackhole in 2008 (601 OPS), even when graded on the charitable shortstop hitting curve. Aside: earlier in his career he was that rare example of a player whose glove was so high caliber that it carried his very weak bat. I don't know that his glove is quite at that level any more.

An elite fielding LF who posts an OPS+ of 75ish will do your team a lot more damage.

This is all the more true as the average left fielder will have an OPS+ of above 100, given the large pool of players available to play the position at a passable defensive level (unlike at shortstop, say).

All this is to say that I concur with your position that you can "hide" a weak hitter (compared to league average levels) more easily at ahortstop or catcher, since the average hitter at those positions is relatively weak (compared to league average levels) to begin with.

But I do believe that the assertion that offense at shortstop doesn't matter overstates the truth. Offense and defense at all positions matter, to different degrees. It is the rare team that can elect to punt offense at a given position because the rest of the team is so strong.

1992 Toronto Blue Jays - 2nd in the AL in runs - C - Pat Borders, 85 OPS+, 3B - Kelly Gruber, OPS+ 72, SS - Manny Lee, OPS+ 83

Using my approach of comparing players to their peers at their position, neither Borders nor Lee really hurt the team with their bats. Borders' OPS of 675 was not far off the average AL catcher (678). Lee's 659 was better than the average AL shortstop's OPS (648). By the standards of their positions, neither were offensive sinkholes.

Gruber's 627 OPS did not hold up well against the average AL third baseman's (713), so his bat did hurt the team. He was bailed out quite a bit by Jeff Kent's 767 OPS, however (Kent started a quarter of the team's games at 3B).