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The Jays return to their winning ways. If you tuned in late the 6-4 score looks much like last night, with the key difference being that the good guys one. Far from it, my friend. Both starters were very good, only to see their bullpens implode behind them. Fortunately the Jays imploded the least. Can you say another ten straight? Also, this game featured one of the worst strike zones I think I have ever seen.


Both starting pitchers in this game were phenomenal, and the game remained tied at 0-0 until the top of the 8th, when Gavin Floyd gave up a leadoff double to Travis Snider. After going 0-3 in attempting to cash a Lind leadoff double the previous inning, the Jays went bunt, soft single, infield single and Floyd was lifted. The flamethrowing lefty Matt Thornton came in, and even with 97 MPH heat could not get a called strike, literaly. He threw two pitches at Adam Lind's knees that looked awfully close to run the count to three and one, before Lind committed the cardinal sin of showing up the umpire, as he foolishly started to walk towards first when the next pitch was six inches out of the strike zone. The karma police caught up to him, and he promptly struck out. In any event, Lyle Overbay knocked a seeing eye single back up the middle to cash another two, Rod Barajas broke out of a nasty slump with a well placed double down the line, and Scott Rolen knocked a ball into the outfield to make it 6-0, before getting thrown out at first by the left fielder on a big turn (bet he won't hear the end of that one!) Anyway, that was all she wrote...

Until Marcum put two batters on with one out in the bottom of the 8th. In comes Downs, game over, right? Well, Downs gave up a massive fly ball that advanced the runners, and a double and a mamoth Jim Thome homer and it was 6-4, after Brandon League got the last out. Come the bottom of the 9th and the insane strike zone returned. BJ would eventually strike out the side, sandwiched around a hbp and an error. He got an awful lot of help from Mike Winters though. I believe it was against Nick Swisher, but BJ couldn't find the zone to save his life. Fortunately the two strikes that were called that were both at Swisher's shoetops probably helped expand the zone.

Anyway, bottom line is that the Jays won, and maybe we need some instant replay for the strikezone.

In other news, the Jays are 6.5 back with 7 to play against Boston, and 16 overall. Coolstandings has their playoff odds at 3.6%. It will probably take a minimum of 12 wins from here on out, and at least five need to be against the Red Sox. To do this, the Jays plan on starting Burnett, Litsch and Halladay on three days rest each over the weekend, because of the doubleheader on Saturday. The matchups seem to favour the Jays - Purcey-Wakefield, Burnett-Byrd, Litsch-Colon, Halladay-Lester. Then again, when you have the best rotation in baseball, these things tend to look not so bad.

Let's Roll.
12 September 2008: Of Streaks and Strikezones | 41 comments | Create New Account
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China fan - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 04:02 AM EDT (#192332) #
     Can anyone explain why Wilkerson was sent in to pinch-run for Snider in the 8th inning?  Is Snider really that bad of a base-runner?
     Speaking of The Kid -- he's now had 32 major-league at-bats, so maybe it's time to take a quick look at his numbers.  His line is .313/.353/.469 and his OPS is .822.    Nine strikeouts and two walks.   And he's been hitting against good pitchers and good teams in pennant races.  Does it mean anything yet?  He might get another 40 or 45 at-bats this season.  Is it enough to decide whether the Jays should spend $10-million on a free-agent DH, or allocate the money for other needs?
     One good thing about the past few weeks is that we're finally getting a glimpse at what Ricciardi envisioned as his team construction strategy for the whole season.  What we've seen in the past month is:  great pitching, great bullpen, good offence from the outfielders and 1B, adequate production from 2B, and reasonable defence at shortstop and catcher (with occasional bursts of production there too).  It's not a bad strategic model for a team, and it could have worked.  I've had my frustrations with Ricciardi a few times this season, but overall I'm beginning to think that his vision was a good one.
       If the Jays fall just short of the wild card, there's going to be a LOT of second-guessing about some of Ricciardi's decisions in the first half of the season -- but his overall plan for constructing a successful team in 2008 was a good one.  The flaws, I think, were at 3B and DH, and those weren't entirely his fault.   He'll be blamed for not bringing up Lind earlier, but that mistake wouldn't have mattered if Rolen and Stairs had managed to produce a bit better.   Some will say that he should have known that Rolen and Stairs were on the decline, but there was a reasonable chance that those two would have produced better this season.  That was Ricciardi's gamble, and it didn't quite work, but -- given the team's budget and the lack of availability of other options -- it was worth a try.

China fan - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 04:17 AM EDT (#192333) #
I should add that Frank Thomas was another gamble for 2008 that might have worked if the universe had unfolded as Ricciardi had expected.  Some kind of age-related decline was predictable, but few of us would have expected that both Thomas and Stairs would deteriorate so dramatically this season.  The odds were that ONE of them, at least, would have been an adequate DH this season.  If just one of those two could have replicated his 2007 performance, and if Scott Rolen had managed to avoid that injury-related slump, the odds of a Blue Jays playoff appearance would be a lot higher than 3 per cent right now.
Magpie - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 04:34 AM EDT (#192334) #
Can anyone explain why Wilkerson was sent in to pinch-run for Snider in the 8th inning?  Is Snider really that bad of a base-runner?

Wilkerson is a little faster, it was the eighth inning, the score was tied.
John Northey - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 06:45 AM EDT (#192335) #
As far as second guessing goes, I'm betting not too many would second guess Snider now. Hitting for an 822 OPS with a few key hits during the streak does that. Stairs has done well in his very limited time in Philly - 3 for 7 with a double and a walk - but I think Snider has done all we could've hoped for.

Of course, if Snider comes back and goes 0 for 30 now then JP will look dumb but I doubt that is going to happen.
John Northey - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 07:00 AM EDT (#192336) #
For strike zone use check...
the pitch f/x site where you can get it for all games.

Checking the normalized zone for the whole game you can see the ump called two very, very high strikes on the Jays plus 6 more that were wide on them vs 2 balls that were strikes and one on the line a ball. For the Sox he called just one pitch outside the strike zone a strike, 5 inside the strike zone a ball, and 3 on the line balls.

The ump actually called a lot of low pitches balls that should've been strikes oddly enough. Different than it looked on tv that is for sure. He was very poor on calling strikes on pitches that were well outside the zone on the sides. From the looks of the detail charts it was issues with pitches that the hitter had to stretch a lot to reach that were his biggest problem.
Chuck - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 07:23 AM EDT (#192337) #

Can anyone explain why Wilkerson was sent in to pinch-run for Snider in the 8th inning?  Is Snider really that bad of a base-runner?

You know, when you're 20 years old and they are already pinch-running for you -- justifiably -- you might not have a long career playing the outfield. When Snider hit his ball in the gap, I was thinking it might be a triple. It wasn't even close to a potential triple.

Snider, as we all have seen, is one thick guy. Physically, I mean. Body type-wise he reminds me of Greg Luzinski. And Greg Luzinski got awfully scary awfully quickly as a left fielder.

Am I right to have concerns about how a player with his body type will age? Can anyone think of any current comps?

scottt - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 07:56 AM EDT (#192338) #
Stairs has done well in his very limited time in Philly - 3 for 7 with a double and a walk - but I think Snider has done all we could've hoped for.

Stairs is not a starter anymore, but he's still an awesome bat off the bench, especially against pitchers who haven't seen a lot of him.
Dave Till - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 08:17 AM EDT (#192339) #
Just noticed this morning that the Jays have the third-best run differential (runs scored minus runs allowed) in all of baseball.

Unfortunately, they're chasing the team with the second-best.

Mike Green - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 08:55 AM EDT (#192340) #
On the radio, Alan Ashby gently took Snider to task for not running hard out of the box on his ball up the gap.  My guess is that one reason Cito took him out for a pinch-runner was to make a point with him right then and there.  The difference, if any, between the speed of Wilkerson and Snider would be microscopic, although Wilkerson is probably a better baserunner at this point in Snider's career.

Snider is a better athlete than Luzinski was.  The Bull had an excellent career in his 20s, and had 3 fine years as a DH in his early 30s.  I'd expect that Snider will be a DH by age 26 or so, and I'd have no hesitation about the club signing him to a 10 year contract next year.



Sherrystar - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 09:20 AM EDT (#192341) #

I don't think that was the case at all. Substitution was for "speed" purposes only.

Snider was running hard all the way through... he wasn't going very fast... huffin and puffin...but he was trying.

Looking forward to an "interesting" weekend. But I'm dreading the fact the weather is not going to cooperate.

jmoney - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 10:25 AM EDT (#192342) #
I believe the Jays should go out and get a big DH bat on the free agent market. If the Jays are serious about building a playoff contender. They need to get the pieces in place and have the prospects compliment the lineup or hit their way onto it.

Cheaping out and handing the DH/LF job to Snider who is all of 20 years old would be a bad idea.

Denoit - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 10:47 AM EDT (#192343) #
If the weather doesnt hold up tonight it could be a good thing, our pitchers would then pitch on regular rest. It would probably mean they might have to mess up their rotation further down the line, but they could mix in a callup against Baltimore if they have too. Im not worried about Halladay, but Litsch and Burnett might have troubles dealing with the short rest.
Magpie - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 10:52 AM EDT (#192344) #
Am I right to have concerns about how a player with his body type will age?

Actually, Snyder's body type - stocky and thick - is a baseball classic. Snider isn't as fast as Kirby Puckett or Tony Gwynn, but neither was Yogi Berra. They all had nice careers.
VBF - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 10:59 AM EDT (#192345) #
Am I right to have concerns about how a player with his body type will age? Can anyone think of any current comps?

Since his name's been brought up, Matt Stairs?
Chuck - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 11:39 AM EDT (#192346) #

I think everyone is comparing a 20-year old Snider to how other players looked at the end of their careers.

I may be mistaken, but I recall Gwynn starting out life thin. Puckett was round, to be sure, but not as round as he would become. But, as Magpie said, both Gwynn and Puckett had wheels and were terrific defensive outfielders, at least early on. Snider is starting off his career as a slow, stocky man. He doesn't seem to have a lot of leeway to add weight onto his short frame, or to lose much footspeed and still not kill you on defense.

I have no recollection of what Matt Stairs looked like early on.

BBRef lists Berra as 5'8", 194 lbs. I'll trust them (and Magpie) but that seems heavier than I recall seeing him in pictures and videos.

Maybe I am worried about nothing.

katman - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 11:41 AM EDT (#192347) #
Anyone know what's up with Scott Downs? He really hasn't looked the same lately.
R Billie - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 12:32 PM EDT (#192348) #

Snider's still carrying a lot of football weight.  The hope is it is mostly muscle.  If it is then I think he'll be fine.

Eric Hinske had a problem with ballooning during his latter Blue Jay years but he still plays the outfield competently around the age of 30.  I think Snider will be a lot like Hinske only a bit shorter.  And much more accomplished with the bat.

That said, 32 at bats is nothing.  Even 100+ at bats is nothing to draw conclusions from.  The Jays decision to spend a lot of money on a DH for 2009 should have nothing to do with how Snider does this last month.  In my mind there are a lot of very good reasons to sign an impact DH no matter what.

1.  If you believe this team really is close, then adding that big bat can only help.  Hopefully though you sign someone who is a much better value than Frank Thomas turned out to be.

2.  Depth...even if Snider is 'ready', chances are he's not going to be playing at the top of his ability at age 21 in the major leagues.  It would be great experience for him but if this team wants to contend, then having Snider consolidate his gains in AAA and ready to fill in for a major injury on the big team puts you in a much better position.

3. You have one less year of service time used up of Snider not playing at his peak.

4. You have an asset (the DH or another outfielder) that can potentially be traded for return when you're ready to bring Snider up for good.

greenfrog - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 12:41 PM EDT (#192349) #
I don't think the main issue is whether adding a big bat at DH would be helpful for 2009 (it would). The question is: with the emergence of Snider, Lind and (potentially) David Cooper, does it make sense to sign another free agent DH in his late 30s to a multi-year contract? It would be great to have Ibanez or Thome for next year, but do you want them for two or three years?
fozzy - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 01:02 PM EDT (#192350) #
Katman, I gotta agree, something may be up with Downs.

He only threw one curveball to Anderson (4 fastballs), 0 curves to Dye (5 fastballs), and 3 curveballs (0 fastballs) to Thome, the last of which was crushed. Very strange pattern (or lack of one). Considering his fastball was all over the place, it's surprising he didn't go with his #2 more often.

Also, and I know it's Monday night quarterbacking, but I thought it quite odd that Downs came in at all, I would have rather seen League pitch to Wise and Dye, rather than Downs pitch to Anderson and Dye. Save Downs for Thome, or one of the number of other pitchers I have forgotten even play for this team since they're never in play.

Seems like Cito is developing his bullpen to two camps: winning and losing.

uglyone - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 01:15 PM EDT (#192351) #

I don't think the main issue is whether adding a big bat at DH would be helpful for 2009 (it would). The question is: with the emergence of Snider, Lind and (potentially) David Cooper, does it make sense to sign another free agent DH in his late 30s to a multi-year contract? It would be great to have Ibanez or Thome for next year, but do you want them for two or three years?

The way I see it:

  • 2009: it absolutely makes sense to sign a big money DH. None of the kids are old enough to be relied on as starters, and there's plenty of payroll room.
  • 2010: the roster is pretty clogged here. The payroll jumps considerably, and you're not losing many contracts. Barajas' contract will be up leaving room for a 24 year old Arencibia, but we'd still have no room for Snider or Cooper.....although at ages 22 and 23, I'm not sure they'll be ready to be relied upon for starting roles even then.
  • 2011: the roster clears. All the contracts expire aside from Wells/Rios/Hill, including Overbay's - which opens up a spot at least one of Snider/Cooper right away.

So yeah, there might be some roster clogging for one year in 2010 (although perhaps a guy like Overbay, in the last year of his deal making $7 mil, would be very tradeable at that point), but otherwise I don't think buying a big-money DH this offseason would cause any real roster problems.

 

Mick in Ithaca - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 01:16 PM EDT (#192352) #
To me, Snider is ready to be with the Jays next year, along with Lind. He's already a very good hitter. The at bat against Nathan last week was astonishing for somebody so young, and he's had 2 or 3 other plate appearances that were as good. Occasionally he's looked bad striking out, mostly against lefties, but so has Lind. In general though, he's producing quality at bats against quality pitchers on good teams, and often under high stress conditions. Yup, it's a small sample, but so far he's doing exactly what he's done at every step up the ladder.

And because greenfrog is correct in pointing out that the Jays don't want to be locked into a 3, or even a 2 year contract with an available free agent DH, I think they'd be wise to spend some money elsewhere. On pitching even, especially if Burnett opts out. (Maybe they should just pay Burnett whatever it takes to get him to stay; supposedly he likes being here with Arnsberg and Halladay.) But with Lind and Snider (and Cooper eventually), what we need are a couple of decent bench bats who can take up some slack if one of the kids falters, but who won't command more than a year long contract. Bautista maybe (as long as he doesn't play first base!), maybe Mench. Not Wilkerson please.

vw_fan17 - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 01:24 PM EDT (#192353) #
Can anyone explain why Wilkerson was sent in to pinch-run for Snider in the 8th inning?  Is Snider really that bad of a base-runner?

Wilkerson is a little faster, it was the eighth inning, the score was tied.

Isn't Brad also a little better/more experienced defensively? Given that Travis was playing LF last night, and Lind was already in the game at DH, my take was: a) a little more speed and b) Wilky would probably be in the game in the 9th anyway for defense, so might as well get the little extra speed now.
uglyone - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 01:33 PM EDT (#192354) #

 

2009

  1. SS A.Hill
  2. 2B J.Inglett
  3. RF A.Rios
  4. DH $15-20m
  5. CF V.Wells
  6. 1B L.Overbay
  7. 3B S.Rolen
  8. LF A.Lind
  9. C R.Barajas
  • UT J.Bautista
  • UT M.Scutaro
  • IF J.McDonald
  • C cheap vet
  • -------------------
  • OF T.Snider
  • C J.P.Arencibia
  • IF S.Campbell
  • 1B D.Cooper

 

  1. R.Halladay
  2. S.Marcum
  3. J.Litsch
  4. D.McGowan
  5. D.Purcey
  6. B.Cecil
  7. R.Romero
  8. S.Richmond
  • CL B.J.Ryan
  • SU J.Accardo
  • SU S.Downs
  • MR B.League
  • MR J.Carlson
  • LR C.Janssen
  • LR B.Tallet
  • XR B.Wolfe
  • XR D.Romero
  • XR S.Camp
  • XR J.Parrish

 

That team there would cost just about the same as this year's team, and we wouldn't be forcing any of the young kids into the lineup, even as a backup. If they ripped it up at AAA, then we could consider making some trades to fill other holes.

If Ole' Ted wanted to boost the payoll, we could think of adding another quality starting pitcher.

 

 

John Northey - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 01:41 PM EDT (#192355) #
What we need for 2009-2011 is a shortstop who can hit. We have a kid or two (ie: Justin Jackson) waaaay down in the minors but no way he'll be here for 2010 and most likely not until 2012 if he makes it ('09 in A+, '10 in AA, '11 in AAA is the optimistic timeline).

Rafael Furcal is a free agent, but most likely a 95-105 OPS+ and coming off an injury. His RZR is in the 810-835 range so his defense is acceptable on the surface. If we are lucky he'll be looking for a 'chance to prove himself' and will sign a 1-3 year deal at a reasonable price (ie: under $10 mil per year) and be healthy. He is making $13 mil this year for reference. I don't think any other 1/2 decent shortstops are on the free agent market.

Any chance Colorado goes stupid and trades us Tulowitzki for a bag of magic beans due to his poor season and budget reasons (signed through 2014 for a total of over $30 million). However, they would probably require us to take Todd Helton as well (owed another $57 million over the next 3 years). Hmm. Covers a DH and SS, OPS+ for Helton is still over 141 lifetime (factors in that crazy park). Clears tons of payroll in Colorado but might get the GM run out of town (Helton popular, I think Tulowitzki is still too). Also would make Richard Griffen's head explode with both 'I told you so' articles but also trying to figure out how to blast JP for getting the guy he feels should've been here all along.
uglyone - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 02:28 PM EDT (#192356) #

I don't get why everyone is so desperate for an SS.

Scutaro is a perfectly average SS, both offensively and defensively.

And this year he's hitting right on par with his career averages...and he's outhitting most of the guys people keep suggesting we should go after - his .708 ops is ahead of Tulowitzki, renteria, cabrera....and ahead of what Furcal did last year in his last healthy season.

I saw we try to see if Aaron Hill can handle his old SS spot (and with his great range and arm at 2B, I can't see him being anything significantly less than average at SS).....and if he's not healthy, or he just can't handle the position, we just go with Scutaro.

I don't think we should waste one more penny on another SS.

Rich - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 02:39 PM EDT (#192357) #
Count me in the Sign A DH camp.  Snider may well be ready but it's naive to imagine that:

A. He's ready for a 500 AB season in the big leagues and can produce all season long.

B. Lind, Rios, and Wells will stay healthy all year

If the Jays sign a DH and both A and B actually happen, well, that's a nice problem to have - maybe it means they can deal Overbay mid-season if need be.

whiterasta80 - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 03:19 PM EDT (#192358) #

IMO we have the following major holes in the team going into the offseason

1. DH (obviously... its been talked to death)

2. SS

3. SP (assuming AJ opts out)

4. 3B cover if Rolen is hurt

5. Backup C

Right now I think that we have the money to solve one of those problems well, or two of those problems poorly

(i.e. Sign Ibanez and Oliver Perez for two problems or sign Adam Dunn to DH)

Assuming we don't wheel and deal- my preference is to solve the SP problem before anything else (ideally re-signing Burnett before anyone gets to show him the money, or getting Ben Sheets instead).

I would also consider "funding" another problem being solved by dealing BJ Ryan (Accardo/League/Carlson get the job) and/or Lyle Overbay (Lind or Syndo get the job with the other patrolling left). At that point my desire would be to sign a DH (Dunn, Burrell, Thome, Ramirez, Griffey, Delgado... I'm not picky, even Ibanez would be a big help)

The rest of the problems will probably have to be solved internally or through cheap gambles.

I think most of us would be prepared to gamble with the backup C job going internally (Thigpen with Jerolman, or Arencibia being next in line)

I don't see SS being solved internally (I'd prefer Scutaro to Hill there myself), but Hill, coupled with Joe Inglett and Marco Scutaro is probably enough cover for Scott Rolen at 3B. So I say Bautista can walk.

From the scrapheap I wouldn't mind gambling on Nomar Garciaparra (cover at 3B, SS, 1B, and DH) but that might just be the nostalgia talking

I can't imagine Hinske wanting to come back, but his versatility (and bat) would be welcomed by me

At short I prefer Lopez or Juan Uribe to Furcal and they will almost assuredly come cheaper- although Lopez is playing well for the Cards (and has a 40 steal and a 20 HR season on his resume).  Uribe would bring more pop then we've seen from SS in quite some time, though we'd still need MacDonald for defensive cover.

I don't see many bargains on the pitching scrap heap, Derek Lowe, or Oliver Perez are the only sub 10 mils I see being worth it.  Hence the spending on a #2.  Alternatively we could see if the Giants still like Rios for Lincecum hehe.

Zao - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 03:51 PM EDT (#192360) #
All this talk about next year is depressing me when we have 4 games coming up against Boston. All I can think about is this series. Once we're eliminated I'll start thinking about next year.
Jays2010 - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 03:59 PM EDT (#192361) #

Right now I think that we have the money to solve one of those problems well, or two of those problems poorly

(i.e. Sign Ibanez and Oliver Perez for two problems or sign Adam Dunn to DH)

If JP manages to sign Dunn, I'd say he's the best GM/salesman in the league. The only position that i think we need a long term solution for is SS. Scutaro is okay, but I'd consider Greene/Hardy to be a pretty significant upgrade. A one yr DH (or 2 yr DH if we move Overbay) is probably the best way to go and it wouldn't block our prospects. I'd say the same is true for a SP. A quality one year addition (if any can be found) is the best way to go, because we have Halladay/Marcum/McGowan/Cecil/ Purcey along with Litsch/Romero/Mills and other prospects to form our 2010 rotation. Another big money SP probably isn't the best investment. I'd be happy if JP can acquire JJ Hardy without having to give up Marcum/Cecil/Purcey (moving Litsch/Romero/Mills/Tallet or whatever is fine by me).

Quite frankly, I'd be okay if NYY sign AJ and we take Mussina for one year. I'm pretty sure NY would regret that contract pretty quickly...

Dan Daoust - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 04:05 PM EDT (#192362) #
Hear, hear, Zao.
whiterasta80 - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 04:22 PM EDT (#192366) #

You mean we can't do both? I'm just as excited as the next guy for this series... but its not like there's a game on right now.

Obviously I was kidding with Dunn.

As for SS- Hardy would definately be an upgrade offensively, but I'm not sure Khalil Greene would be as dramatic as you make him out to be.  I'm a big Greene fan, but he isn't better defensively then MacDonald and he may actually be a step back offensively from Scutaro.  Sure he combines (sort of) the best of both guys, but I think we'd see fairly similar production out of SS next season. 

You'd have to have to be pretty confident in a resurgeance out of Greene to spend money bringing him in. As for Hardy- I just think he's going to cost more than I'd be willing to pay.  8-10 Million is alot to spend on a SS when your lineup has other holes.

christaylor - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 04:52 PM EDT (#192367) #
On the negative side: I really hope that if the team acquires a DH that said player can play at least 1B/LF competently. If the bat is good enough (read: Manny) it doesn't really matter much but anything less I really don't want to see a repeat of the line-up inflexibility that Thomas brought us... if the choice is that or seeing a 2009 Eckstein at DH, I'll take the inflexible slugger, but when the inevitable injuries come I think it is really terrible to no have the DH slot to ease in a player coming off say and injured Hamstring or broken wrist.

On the positive side: I'd noticed he'd been hot, but it is almost eerie how Overbay has become the player we all though JP had traded for in 2006. His line as of today is : .279/.368/.436 ve, rsus .276/.367/.449 with his defense, that's more than acceptable at 1B. I've always been a fan (reminds me of my all-time favorite Jay, Olerud) but as opposed to say, a couple of months a go, moving Lind to 1B in favour of Overbay, doesn't look like a great move. If the DH who comes in can man 1B, trading one of Lind/Overbay makes sense; especially to get someone to fill in at SS (Brandon Wood, perhaps whose lost a a shine as a prospect?)
King Ryan - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 05:17 PM EDT (#192368) #
Isn't Brad also a little better/more experienced defensively? Given that Travis was playing LF last night, and Lind was already in the game at DH, my take was: a) a little more speed and b) Wilky would probably be in the game in the 9th anyway for defense, so might as well get the little extra speed now.

Indeed.

I thought Wilkerson made a great play to cut off Uribe's single and hold him at first (and hold Bourgeoius at third.)
John Northey - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 05:46 PM EDT (#192369) #
I'm the type who hates to see good prospects blocked. Snider/Lind/Wells/Rios for OF/DH with Overbay at first I can live with. Hill mixed with Scutaro/Inglett at second and Rolen/Scutaro at third are both acceptable situations although I'd be signing as good a AAAA third baseman as possible. Catcher is OK too with Barajas/whoever where I'd sign a AAAA guy again as the backup who can be sent back down to AAA whenever one of the two kids sharing time in AAA is ready (Thigpen should be no more than an emergency choice at this point). Our pitching staff is deep and prospects abound along with high level major leaguers.

That leaves shortstop. Scutaro and McDonald are endurable but not good solutions as Scutaro is poor defensively based on one of the methods of measuring it while McDonald is horrid on offense and wears down quickly. We've been seeing a parade at short these last few years and the closest prospect who is a high end one is at low A ball still. That is the biggest bang for the buck potentially - a 3 year deal can be made with no fear of blocking a hotshot, offensively an improvement is a virtual guarantee, and we have a top defensive guy in McDonald to fill in when needed (late in a game).

No question in my mind that shortstop is the slot where $10 million will go the furthest.
chris_jays - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 06:26 PM EDT (#192370) #

Anyone else as worried as i am about the lineup tonight?

Scutaro
Wilkerson
Rios
Wells
Overbay
Mench
Barajas
Rolen
Mcdonald

Dez - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 06:27 PM EDT (#192371) #
Maybe we should hope that it gets rained out.
Matthew E - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 06:30 PM EDT (#192372) #
Against Wakefield? Well, it's easy to see what Cito has in mind, anyway.
brent - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 06:36 PM EDT (#192373) #
Please stop suggesting Greene. He had a broken hand this year and players just don't come back quickly from that. It has taken Overbay over a year! Greene's power was way down before he had his hand broken too. He couldn't be worth more than backup money.
TamRa - Friday, September 12 2008 @ 07:49 PM EDT (#192375) #
Overbay's slugging is now near what it was in Milwaukee and has been climbing all year. If you take Greene's road numbers from 2007 and cut the home runs in half he's still got a sluging and OPS that's would put him in the top 10 in the majors this year.

Here's his road numbers for the three years previous to this year:

.273.328.500.828

Cut his HR total in half (which is far more of an impact that Overbay has suffered) and his Slugging falls to .434 - for an OPS of .762. Those would rank 7th, and 10th in the majors respectively this season.

Drop the HR by 1/3 instead of 1/2 and you get .455 and .783, good for 6th and 7th respectively.

Now, I AM concerned about why he was just off the table even before the injury...but it'd be pretty damned weird for a guy his age to just suddenly lose it permenantly like that.

If it doesn't cost us elsewhere, I'm certainly willing to gamble on him bouncing back.


uglyone - Saturday, September 13 2008 @ 03:58 PM EDT (#192387) #



No question in my mind that shortstop is the slot where $10 million will go the furthest.

How? Who?

What SS out there are you going to spend $10 million on, that can be reliably depended on to give better than average offense and defense at the SS position (which Scutaro gives us)?

Who? Furcal? Furcal who hit worse than Scoots all last year, and has a bad back forcing him to miss all this year?

Maybe we get a guy who's more expected to post a .750ops than a Scutrao .700ops....and that's worth $10 mil?

 

92-93 - Sunday, September 14 2008 @ 01:13 AM EDT (#192395) #
"Kouzmanoff was hit by a pitch from Lincecum in the second inning, tying Gene Tenace's single-season club record of 13 set in 1977."

-AP
12 September 2008: Of Streaks and Strikezones | 41 comments | Create New Account
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