He has been wholly unremarkable in AAA, and there is no reason to expect he would be an upgrade on what is here currently, especially when you factor in defence. Not to mention the fact that Hill is a great 2B and should probably be left where he is. It seems like this is just an attempt to "save face" on a high draft pick that just didn't work out.

And I agree with Pistol, the AJ as a 4th starter thing just seems like a nonsensical comment to me - it makes no difference in the context of whether a player gets hurt or not. Although maybe it made more sense in the context of the question posed - I did not hear the interview.

Old friend Tomo Okha has been cut for the second time this season:

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/sports/stories.nsf/cardinals/story/EEBCA6CF0038267E8625730F0015056C?OpenDocument

     I'm not a huge Ricciardi fan, but I actually would defend him against some of the criticism here.  I actually think he's made mostly the right moves over the past year.  First you have to consider the huge challenges that he's been up against.  The injuries have been truly terrible (he lost his closer and his set-up man in the bullpen, which would have devastated most clubs; he lost two of his best hitters in Reed Johnson and Lyle Overbay;  he lost his starting catcher and his No. 2 starting pitcher for significant periods of time; his heavy-hitting 3rd-baseman has been hobbling);  and he has also suffered from serious slumps by Wells and Thomas that few could have predicted; and he also suffered bad luck when Ted Lilly and Gil Meche walked away from very good contract offers in the off-season.   And his payroll, while improving, is still mid-range.  And the free-agent market has been unattractive too -- it did not have many good options in the off-season this past year.  So he's really had a lot of obstacles against him.

    Then look at his moves and his future plans:

      1) he lost Lilly and Meche, so he signed three other pitchers and then quickly shifted to Marcum and McGowan.  I'd say he handled that pretty well. 

    2) he had a gaping hole at shortstop, and instead of signing Julio Lugo (as many here suggested) he signed McDonald and Clayton, who have actually been better than Lugo so far this year at a much cheaper price.  Maybe not the perfect move, I admit, but better than Lugo and better than any other available option in the free-agent market.  Keep in mind the severe shortage of good shortstops in the free-agent market and the trade market.

    3) he knew that Adam Lind needed more seasoning in the minors, so he signed Matt Stairs.  An excellent move.  Unfortunately it was undermined by the injury to Johnson, but he was right to sign Stairs.

   4) he still needs to upgrade at shortstop, so he is considering putting Hill at SS, if he can find a decent 2B to replace Hill at that position.  This, I'd argue, makes perfect sense, because it is a lot easier to find a good 2B than a good shortstop, and at least he has Thigpen and Adams as possible prospects at 2B. 

    5) he knew that Zaun is not a great catcher, so he tried to sign Barajas.  Actually both of them are having poor seasons this year, so I'm not sure if Barajas was the answer, but at least Ricciardi was trying to upgrade at catcher. 

    6) his team has been weakened by injuries to Burnett.   Ricciardi's analysis of the situation is that Burnett needs to play through minor discomfort.  I tend to believe him on this.  Ricciardi has access to the medical reports on Burnett and the fans don't.   The notion that Burnett might "blow out his arm" is pure speculation.  Ricciardi has the medical opinions of the top specialists, and I'm sure that they are not telling him to treat Burnett with kid gloves in case he blows out his arm.  I think Ricciardi is absolutely right to try to light a fire under Burnett and motivate him to play through discomfort. 

   7)  He had two good young pitchers in Janssen and Accardo.  I'd say that he has handled both of them quite well so far.  And he still has Janssen as an option in the starting rotation in future.

   8)  I would certainly fault Ricciardi in a few of his moves (sticking with Jason Phillips at catcher, getting rid of Chad Gaudin, etc). 

   But overall, given the horrible string of injuries and the slumps by Wells and Thomas and the odd behavior by Burnett and the unexpected failure of his bids for Lilly and Meche in the off-season, I actually think that Ricciardi has reacted and adapted pretty well.    But I expect to be pelted with stones for this opinion!

MG: Adams' 2004, 2005 and 2007 lines are quite consistent, and suggest that .260/.325/.380 is a reasonable expectation for him in the major leagues.  It is hard to justify a starting slot for that kind of production unless he can play very good defence at second. 

Sounds like polling material. Given the dearth of shortstops and the abundance of second basemen (league-wide, if not necessarily within the organization), should Hill be moved to SS?

Given just how good his defense is at second base, I'd argue against it. Now, if Brian Roberts were to magically land on the team's doorstep, well, then that's a different story. But to contemplate moving Hill around for Adams or Thigpen, that's just insane.

ChinaFan: he had a gaping hole at shortstop, and instead of signing Julio Lugo (as many here suggested) he signed McDonald and Clayton, who have actually been better than Lugo so far this year at a much cheaper price. 

You're not suggesting that Ricciardi knew that Lugo was headed for a demise of such epic proportions, are you? That would have been amazingly prescient given Lugo's consistency (OPS+ from 2002 on: 84, 95, 94, 105, 94).

he lost Lilly and Meche, so he signed three other pitchers and then quickly shifted to Marcum and McGowan

Many in these parts were suggesting he bypass the predictable failures in the first place, arguing that none of the 3-Headed Discount Beast were likelier to be any better than what was already in house.

he still needs to upgrade at shortstop, so he is considering putting Hill at SS, if he can find a decent 2B to replace Hill at that position.  This, I'd argue, makes perfect sense, because it is a lot easier to find a good 2B than a good shortstop, and at least he has Thigpen and Adams as possible prospects at 2B. 

The word "prospect" has to mean something. Adams has done nothing to warrant the label and Thigpen has only just recently jettisoned the tools of ignorance. Maybe you attempt a Biggio-type catcher-to-2B migration if you don't already have a top notch second baseman, but why move Hill based on a decision that will more likely flop than not?

I will take it as a good sign if the organization were to cut Adams loose. Ricciardi would be tacitly admitting that the pick was a flop which would be a sign of humility that's badly needed.

To me the potential is for Adams to hit at an 80-90 OPS

Based on what, John? Adams turns 27 next month. Major league players typically peak at ages 27-28.

I don't argue that Hill's fragile psyche might not withstand a move to SS, and then potentially back to 2B, but if you're going to move him to SS, let it be for a good reason. Russ Adams is not a good reason.

Playing Hill at second base because he's good there is not a good reason to keep him there. Play him at second because he either can't play shortstop, or you've got a better shortstop. The latter certainly isn't true, and I'm not yet convinced the former is.

If Aaron Hill can play short, he should be playing short. It's much easier to find a second baseman, whether that's Adams, Thigpen, or Some Other Guy.

Lots of good news in this thread.

Sparky back - GOSH do we NEED him! Hope he's the old Sparky.

Hill to SS now - Admas at 2nd (cut Clayton - the PM as backup) . Thigpen to 2nd base at AAA, next spring Adams and Thigpen go man to man for 2nd.

AJ - make him the number 5 - if' he's here and can pitch great, if not use Litsch or Janssen. Next year: Roy, McG, Marcum, Janssen, AJ/Litsch/Romero/Magee.

Glaus - trade him to a west coast team for a 3rd base near ready prospect, three teams out there have such a guy we could get. Glaus is WONDERFUL but FRAGILE.

We are 8 games back of the wild card we COULD make that up or end up 16 out by seasons end. What we do in the next while, ending with the NY and Bos series', will tell a lot about which option comes true.

It seems like the Jays have once again decided "calling out" AJ in the public is a good idea. JP had similar remarks after AJ was injured during Spring Training last season. I would like to hear AJ respond to these comments.

Good point, Ron.  If JP has issues with AJ, he should keep them in the clubhouse.

That would be an awful lot of money for a set-up guy, and should be beyond last resort. The Jays are currently well set at that position with Janssen, and when BJ comes back, Accardo/Frasor/League could all possibly occupy the role even if Janssen moves into the rotation. Guys in that role are a lot easier to find than starters like a healthy AJ. Before such a drastic move, it would be prudent of management not to ride him hard until his arm gives out each and every start, as stated above. Unlikely, but prudent.

Did anyone notice Shawn Marcum crediting Sal Fasano for noticing a flaw in his delivery? This after Sal showed Roy how to throw the split finger fastball without hurting his shoulder.

This raises 2 questions:

1)Why is he in Syracuse while Phillips is on the ML roster?

 2)Should Brad Arnsberg be looking over his shoulder? The second question I ask (half) in jest but why does the back-up catcher notice things that our pitching coach doesn't?

 http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070705&content_id=2068431&vkey=news_tor&fext=.jsp&c_id=tor

I'd much rather have a 2008 middle infield of Eckstein/Hill than Hill/Adams or Hill/Thigpen.

Agreed. Eckstein will outhit Adams next year and the defensive loss of moving Hill to short and teaching Thigpen second will negate any offensive value Thigpen has over Eckstein. On a one-year deal at around a million or a million and a half I'd sign Eckstein if the alternative consists of in-house options.

That article is the straw that broke the camel's back. I don't like calling for Phillips' job, but we have no choice. I, among many others, have been clamouring for Fasano's return in several threads already. It's time for the FREE SAL FASANO campaign to begin.

On a one-year deal at around a million or a million and a half I'd sign Eckstein if the alternative consists of in-house options.

He made over $3 million last year (and presumably more this year), he's been consistent, he's acquired some "scrappy veteran" mojo, and he's the best free agent SS on the market. I don't think you'll get him that cheap.

I don't think you'll get him that cheap.

I don't like moving Thigpen, particularly when you're giving Phillips so much playing time, but it makes a little sense if

1. He can play a good second base (or possibly third?);
2. Aaron Hill can play a good shortstop;
3. Robinzon Diaz is a future major-league catcher, or Arencibia is on the super-fast-track.

Of course, even if you want to go with that plan, the execution sucks: If Hill can play short, play him there. If Thigpen is going to learn a new position, don't stick him on the ML bench and use him as the backup first baseman.

I'm not sold on Diaz, who reminds me of Cesar Izturis: Fine player if he can play great defence and hit around .300, but a bench player, and not a particularly good one, if he can't.

Rob (Toronto): KEITH I've been asking about this for weeks. Curtis Thigpen moving to 2B, your thoughts?

SportsNation Keith Law: Also interesting; I know that was something player development wanted to do in instructional league that year.

When I look at the Dodgers and see (1) how close they still are in the West race and (2) the trouble they've had getting much offence from third base as well as (3) the almost-ready infielders they have and (4) the money they must have available, I ask myself:

   Troy Glaus for Andy LaRoach and Wilson Betemit?

We can give them Clayton too, or let him go. LA's offence gets a big boost and Toronto's infield prospects for '08 and beyond look better.

  Gee, that was easy.

I finally heard the JP comments about AJ and his injuries.  A person's body wants to avoid pain and will make adjustments to do so.  So pitching through pain will mess up a pitcher's mechanics and potentially hurt him in another way.

JP's tone was what was most annoying.  He was implying that AJ was pulling himself from games and put himself on the DL, as though the team had no say whatsoever.  Also JP speculating whether AJ's injuries were a mental thing, as though he has no access to him personally.  Think it's a mental thing? GO TALK TO HIM ABOUT IT.  Send Arnsberg or a sports psychologist or someone to go talk to him.  Some might think AJ should just suck it up or something, but I don't think that is going to work here.  AJ is a big investment and the team should work to nurture that investment.  And it should most definitely be handled in house.  Because this does nothing but turn the fans on him.

It's one thing for AJ himself to wonder whether there is a psychological element to rebounding after an injury (I seem to remember him mentioning this after the elbow injury last year). It's another thing altogether for the GM to call him out in public.

What amazes me is that JP still hasn't learned his lesson about shooting his mouth off. He's either incredibly obstinate, brilliant (ie, if it somehow gets AJ on track), or an idiot. One big problem with alienating players is that sometimes you want to re-sign them (case in point: Ted Lilly)--or create an environment that will attract other players--which is harder when you've blown some of the team's goodwill.

John Gibbons' John Wayn-ness attitude with Burnett's workload. This is in line with Mike Green's point. Gibbons has only maximized Burnett's potential over the course of 5 or 6 weeks when everyone including the jumping chilli peppers knew that Burnett needed to be treated so as to maximize his return for the entire season!

I think the reason Gibbons left Burnett out there as long as he did as often as he did was job preservation.  Burnett, amongst other little league traits, hates to come out of the ball game.  One more player run-in and Gibbons is toast, and he knows it.  I don't think he wanted to deal with Burnett's antics (probably didn't trust his own reaction) and was therefore too quick to buy AJ's "I'm fine skip" responses.

 Burnett, amongst other little league traits, hates to come out of the ball game.

Any pitcher worth his salt wants to pitch, all the time.  Doc hates to come out of the ballgame. 

Any pitcher worth his salt wants to pitch, all the time.  Doc hates to come out of the ballgame.

The difference being that Doc has it between the ears as well as in his right arm.  Regardless of how badly he wanted to stay in the game Doc would never show up his manager/team with a tantrum after handing the ball over.  I expect a David Wells-like toss down the left feild line EVERY time Gibbons comes for AJ.

If the manager is afraid to change pitchers because of how the players will behave if he does so, then he should be fired. Now, I don't think that's why Burnett keeps getting left in there, but if that was true, Gibbons would need to go.

Are you saying Manager's never make decisions based on self-preservation but always only with the long-term interests of the organization in mind?  Few managers are that organizationally loyal 100% of time, fewer still with as tenuos a hold on their position as Gibbons.  Possibly he left him in too long to try and turn the season around (and not to avoid confrontation) but even this reasoning can be somewhat painted with a self-preservation brush.  But do I think AJ's erratic behaviour had something to do with it?  Yes.  Do I need think Gibbons needs to go?  Absolutely.

I think you are being really unfair to Burnett.  Yes, he had a little spaz after his last start but it was hardly showing Gibbons up.  It was frustration with himself and with his performance.  Ted Lilly refusing to give up  the ball and telling his manager "F-you, John" to his face, while standing on the mound and David Wells throwing the ball down the line, that's showing a manager up.  The only other incident I remember was Burnett taking his frustration out on a Gatorade thing last season.  That's twice.  And Gibbons talked to Burnett about the last freak out, it really isn't a big thing.  The high pitch count outings were probably due to trying to get Burnett a victory, not fear of pulling him.  The manager should pull a guy when he thinks he's done, no matter the reaction.  If the bats were working as they should (which is the real problem of this season), AJ would prob have 8+ victories, and all this bitching about him would not be as loud.  This guy stepped up big time when Doc went down and I think all of this stuff is unfair to him.

People get on guys like Vernon Wells for not showing any emotion and then people get on Burnett for showing too much.  It's a bit crazy.

I'm not sure how much twisting is being done - the main gist of what he said, and what is being reported verbatim, is that AJ has to learn to pitch with some pain. There is no doubt in my mind that this was a direct shot at AJ for public consumption. JP is no rookie when it comes to generating controversy via interviews, so he knew this would be a big story. This was a calculated move on JP's part. Remember Blair's article earlier in the week, saying AJ may be trade fodder? Many speculated at the time that that came straight from JP. Now it seems likely that it did.

I agree that media outlets do sometimes twist things around, but I don't see that being the case this time.

I don't think calling out a player in public is necessarily a bad move. J.P did it last year with Vernon, etc and Vernon re-signed so no problem there. I think a little pressure is fine and the players have it easier here than in New York and Boston and if they can't take a little criticism then it's time to grow thicker skin.

However, the mitigating factor is that A.J was pitching great while Roy was gone and Gibbons obviously overused him and caused the shoulder strain. Gibbons should be called out by J.P, not A.J.

Burnett was on JP's wish list a full year before the Jays signed him as a free agent -- he'd been watching him with the Marlins, considered trading for him mid-season, made no bones that Burnett was his #1 free-agent target, and finally outbid the Cardinals (who must be thanking their lucky stars on that one) with a $55M offer that raised eyebrows even among Burnett's boosters. Given that, nothing about AJ Burnett -- his personality, his injury history, his discomfort threshold -- should come as a surprise to JP Ricciardi. If it does, that's an indictment of the GM's ability to judge a player's all-around package. Calling out Burnett like this serves only to underline Ricciardi's own failure to manage this very expensive acquisition.

I'd like to see Curtis Thigpen show he can hit major-league pitching -- and adjust to his first prolonged slump -- before worrying about which position he should play. I'd also like to see Aaron Hill become a less streaky hitter, but for the moment, he's got 2B nailed down and there's no compelling reason to change that. Shortstop is going to be a black hole all season, so we might as well accept it and see what the off-season brings. For myself, I say find a SS who will make a dynamite defensive infield combo with Hill, regardless of what he hits, and pencil him into the #9 spot. The long-term problem position for the Blue Jays is third base, because I don't see Troy Glaus with this team next spring and there's no one around to replace him unless somone arrives via his trade.

The thing with Ricciardi is that he does enough good things to stick around as GM and enough bad things to keep the team from the playoffs.  He's an average GM and that's not good enough with so many teams in the AL with better GMs and/or more resources.

Absolutely correct. I'll add that, for me at least, part of what makes him only an average GM is his tendency to spout off in public ("our 3-4-5 guys are killing us," "Gil Meche is afraid to compete," "Keith Law is officially an idiot," and this Burnett situation), which hurts the organization's reputation for professionalism.

That sounds like Ray Olmedo to me. The club could do worse than bringing up Olmedo and letting Clayton go.

I was thinking a week ago that I'd like to see a Santos/Olmedo platoon at Syracuse for the rest of the year with a view to being the Jays solution next year.  Santos could fill in his at bats with starts at 3B and DH against RHPs.  While Santos may not be a great defensive SS, we might be able to get by with him there against LHP only if Olmedo is in there against RHP.

"Given that, nothing about AJ Burnett -- his personality, his injury history, his discomfort threshold -- should come as a surprise to JP Ricciardi."

This is what I find most amazing about this whole thing. Not only did JP know this stuff, everybody knew it.

1) Jays sign injury-prone starter with a career high of 12 wins and pretend as if he is about to become an ace. 

2) He gets injured

3) Jays rush him back and abuse his arm

4) He gets injured

5) He gets criticized for being injured.

I don't think JP is going to hold on to his job much longer, nor do I think he should. He is a mediocre GM at best, and he doesn't have an ounce of professionalism. If you were a player, why would you want to be subjected to this?

The long-term problem position for the Blue Jays is third base, because I don't see Troy Glaus with this team next spring and there's no one around to replace him unless somone arrives via his trade.

If Glaus is traded it will almost certainly be for a 3rd base prospect. The only problem will be if Glaus becomes seriously injured. Otherwise, either he is here for a couple more years or he is traded for a 3rd base prospect.