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I got a bad case of loving you.


The Jays are now 24-4 when Halladay starts the game after a loss... He is, and ever shall be, the Stopper.

On that occasion, back in June 2005, I was thinking about other Blue Jays pitching very fine games, getting no run support, and taking a tough Loss. Which has nothing to do with Doc, because:

When Roy Halladay's team doesn't give him much in the way of offense, Doc hangs a Tough Loss on the other guy.

That's who he is, that's what he does.

I got a bad case...

Anyway, that was career win #97 - four Blue Jays have made it past 100 (Stieb, Clancy, Key, Hentgen). With a normal healthy season, he'll pass Hentgen... nah, let's not go there. I will say that his next start will be his 195th as a Jay, tying him for fifth place with Juan Guzman. His 25th career complete game moves him into a tie (with Alexander and Lemanczyk) for sixth on the franchise leader board, two behind Luis Leal. He needs one shutout to catch Hentgen, two to catch Key, and three to catch Clancy, who is second overall. Probably won't happen this year. (Stieb is way off in the distance, with the same number of shutouts as Clancy, Hentgen, and Key combined.)

OK, some Other Stuff -

This Would Have Been Cool, Dept.
If necessary, Josh Towers ("our fastest pitcher") would have been used as a pinch runner....

Otto Remembers: Velez was on the radio reminiscing with his old teammate Ashby about getting in trouble with Roy Hartsfield for drinking in the hotel bar. It was Hartsfield's policy not to allow his players to drink in the hotel bar because "that's where I drink." Many managers have the same rule and for the same reason. I'm sure that managing that team would have sent poor Roy there on a regular basis... unless he was made of far stronger stuff than ordinary mortals.

Roster Construction, Revisited: I would expect Adam Lind to be the starting LF today, tomorrow, and pretty well every day for at least the next two weeks, or whenever Sparky comes off the DL. The Matt Stairs Experience should now come to a halt, and his outfielder's glove can be safely stowed in the same place they keep All Things We Never Want to See Again.

It's not the most impressive bit of roster construction, is it? And if you're bound and determined to carry a four man bench, and all modern baseball teams do seem to have decided to plunge blindly off the cliff into that abyss... well, you need players that provide a little flexibility. Tony LaRussa, the Mad Genius (just ask him!) who kicked off this whole era of seven-man bullpens, always had a couple of multi-position guys around. It was the only way the whole thing ever could have worked for him. The rest of the baseball world seems to have largely overlooked that part of the equation.

I was always the Dude's Advocate, I am proud to say, and it was often a lonely and unrewarding task... but I think if I shouted "Come home, Eric Hinske, we miss you!" I wouldn't be singing solo anymore - a mighty, swelling chorus would fill the land. A left-handed bat, who can play two infield spots, two outfield spots, pinch run, pinch hit... worth every penny in the era of the four man bench.

I do think the notion that having Frank Thomas is a problem, not because of Frank, but because it means you can't rest Glaus by having him DH... I'm not sure that really matters. Glaus seems to be aggravating his physical problems by running the bases, and there's no getting out of that. He did lots and lots of base-running on Monday, of course, and he came out of Wednesday's game after a desperate, if futile, attempt to beat out a double play grounder. In those two games (it was just eight innings between the two of them), there wasn't a single ground ball hit in his vicinity.

Lind's defensive reputation suggests that he may at least be close to competent, if not quite there. If so, he'll be a huge upgrade. I feel somewhat sorry for Matt Stairs, because it's got to be a little humiliating being called upon to do something you are not remotely qualified to do. The man was a bad outfielder when he was 29 years old - why on earth would it occur to anyone that he might be OK this year, now that another 10 years have gone by. That said, he's been unbelievable. And he knows it, too - he knows he's hurting the team and it's only making it worse, because now he's getting tentative out there. With his wheels, he can't afford that.

But in three games, at a minimum, four balls that probably would have been outs became base hits. That's an enormous swing for a single defensive player - it's comparable to the difference between having Ozzie Smith in his prime playing shortstop and... oh, I don't know... not Jeter, considerably worse than that... Troy Glaus with his sore heel?

To get that kind of defensive impact from a left-fielder is barely conceivable (although the extremely small sample size has much to do with it.)

So just what they were smoking around the office when they decided that Stairs would be a perfectly useful fourth outfielder, and where can I get some?

All right then - today it's A.J. against Chad Durbin, and tomorrow Josh Towers makes his second start, facing the Official Poster Boy of the Detroit Advance Scout.

Alex, you got some 'splainin' to do...
14-15 April: Give Me The News | 94 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
Jim - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 07:46 AM EDT (#165760) #
"Come home, Eric Hinske, we miss you!"

Amen.  I believe The Dude has an 12 game hit streak going if you dip into the end of last season. 
Chuck - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 07:55 AM EDT (#165761) #
As for 4th outfielders (ignoring where Lind might fit into this new equation), how about a guy named Gabe Gross in Milwaukee who's stuck behind a whole bunch of players? I mean, if we're welcoming people home who would now be good fits...
Dave Till - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 07:58 AM EDT (#165762) #
The problem is that the roster limit of 25 was created back when teams carried only 9 or 10 pitchers. Now, a team can't get by without 11 pitchers, and many need 12.

It would make more sense to have a 27 or 28 man roster now, but owners haven't been willing to pay for two or three more major-league contracts. But now that baseball is financially healthy - so healthy that the owners were willing to reach a new basic agreement without first trying the tactic of a union-busting lockout - maybe they could consider bumping the roster limit up a bit?

You have to feel sorry for Matt Stairs. While he's not even within standard hailing distance of being a good outfielder, he's had to face more than his share of tweeners and difficult balls in the gap. And he did make a genuinely nice catch yesterday (admittedly, on a ball that Johnson would have put in his back pocket).

Pistol - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 08:30 AM EDT (#165764) #
It would make more sense to have a 27 or 28 man roster now

All the pitching changes are bad enough now.  Imagine what they'd be with 14 man pitching staffs.  You'd be changing pitchers left and right.
China fan - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 08:46 AM EDT (#165765) #

      It's obvious that Matt Stairs is a defensive liability, but let's not be totally unfair to the four-man bench.  Offensively, at least, they've been fine so far.   Small sample size, yes, but all four of them are batting .308 or higher.  Which puts them ahead of Thomas, Overbay, Wells and Johnson.  And their bunting skills were certainly well-displayed last night.   If anyone wants to keep denouncing them as "the worst bench in the majors" or similar sweeping statements, they should at least admit that the statistics this year don't support that condemnation so far.

Barry Bonnell - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 09:01 AM EDT (#165766) #
I wonder if the turf at Rogers Centre is aggravating Glaus' injuries...
HoJu - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 09:18 AM EDT (#165767) #
Second time Halladay has pitched 10 against the Tigers. Last one was a shutout with pinch hitter Kevin Witt breaking up the no-hitter in the 8th.
Rob - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 09:40 AM EDT (#165768) #
the Official Poster Boy of the Detroit Advance Scout

Seeing as how it's either him, Grilli, or Zumaya, give the kid a break.

As far as Gabe Gross goes, he played 33 games (253 innings) in CF last year with the Brewers, hitting .274/.382/.476. In fact, he hit cleanup on Wednesday when Dave Bush (speaking of players we'd like to see again) started.
Paul D - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 09:57 AM EDT (#165769) #
The problem is that the roster limit of 25 was created back when teams carried only 9 or 10 pitchers. Now, a team can't get by without 11 pitchers, and many need 12.

Wasn't the roster limit 24 at the time of the 9 or 10 man pitching staff?    The 25 man roster is still a relatively recent change.
VBF - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 10:00 AM EDT (#165770) #
Now that we've gone there, might I suggest trying to acquire beloved ex-Jay, Shannon Stewart for one last hurrah? His arm is weak, but I recall his defense as being decent and he would provide some hitting.
Jim - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 10:20 AM EDT (#165773) #
maybe they could consider bumping the roster limit up a bit?.

I'd rather go the other way.
westcoast dude - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 10:24 AM EDT (#165774) #

I'll take Jason Smith over Eric Hinske in a flash. He plays all four infield positions and has the tools to play the outfield; a southpaw who hots bullets and can bunt.  The turning point in last night's game came in the tenth when Jason fleeced the Tigers. First time there'd been two Jays on the basepaths all night, tipping the balance and then the J-train left the station.

HollywoodHartman - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 11:15 AM EDT (#165776) #
But would you rather have Hinske over Stairs? I think that would be the logical guy "bumped" from the bench. And I'll be shocked if there's one person on the Box who wouldn't do it.
Mike Green - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 11:27 AM EDT (#165777) #
No thrill's goin' to cure my ill

Did Robert Palmer/Jim Palmer make the rock team?  They sure would have been more useful than Moon Martin/Norberto Martin.

It was nice to see Alex Rios go long.  A couple more and the walks will start to come.
Mike Green - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 11:36 AM EDT (#165778) #
No pill's going to cure my ill.  I need another cup of coffee...
Boss - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 11:49 AM EDT (#165779) #

Well the Stairs adventure is about to end, and quite soon enough. Regardless of the concerns others have had about Lind's defensive abilities, they will be better than the "Matt Stairs Experience". What I would say, this isn’t Much Music, this isn't 102.1 the edge, and there aren't Canadian content rules for the team the Blue Jays field.

Lind will at provide a beacon to draw attention away from the other fielding issues over the past few games (with the exception of last night), including Okha turning a solid inning ending double play into runners on 2nd and 3rd with one out. (Which ended up as the deciding run on the Sac fly). The other guys will feel a little less scrutiny, and Lind will hopefully provide the same sort of pop the other guys bring to the plate.

Should be an interesting game today.

 

Magpie - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 11:57 AM EDT (#165780) #
I'll take Jason Smith over Eric Hinske in a flash.

I've got no problem with having Jason Smith on a tiny bench, for the reasons you gave - on a tiny bench, his versatility is required. It also makes Phillips (who can play first) more useful than Fasano. Stairs, alas,while still a very useful bat,  is basically a backup DH and pinch-hitter - and your starting DH can't play in the field either. This is practically a three man bench. The problem hasn't been the quality of their play to this point (with the exception of outfield defense) - it's the quantity of bodies.

There was never a 24 man roster officially, but back in the mid 80s, all 26 major league teams suddenly decided that since they weren't actually required to carry 25 men that they might as well see just how much it would irritate the union if they carried just 24.

Yes, we look back in wonder at those days - how did teams get by with just four or five relief pitchers. They still played 162 games, they still had designated hitters. What a strange and mysterious time it must have been...
jerjapan - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 12:05 PM EDT (#165781) #
Is there a long-term solution at third if Glaus spends more time on the DL this season?  It can't be Hattig?  Or is it Johnny Mac and Jason Smith?  It's kinda scary to consider how fragile this roster is ... At the moment, I'd rather have Hinske and Cat back then Thomas at DH ...
ChicagoJaysFan - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 12:09 PM EDT (#165783) #
If we're replacing bench players, I'd rather we replace Johnny Mac first.  To me, Smith has a superset of MacDonald's capabilities - neither can hit that well (I think the start to the season is a fluke for both) and with MacDonald's bad play at defense to finish last season, I think his reputation in the field is overblown.  However, Smith can play more positions (I think he'll be getting time in the OF by the all-star break).  Also, we have guys in the minors (Olmeda, Adams, and even Roberts) that I think could fill in for injury as adequately as McD can.  If we're talking of bringing back Hinske, I'd prefer a bench of Stairs, Hinske, Smith, and Phillips.  We'd have a bunch of guys that I'd feel comfortable pinch-hitting with, some that could pinch-run, depth at most positions, etc.

If Hattig could ever reproduce the power numbers he showed in AA, he'd be nice addition to the Jays as well.

Aside from allowing Stairs to hit for Clayton, I just really see no reason to have MacDonald on this team.

Maldoff - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 12:29 PM EDT (#165785) #

To paraphrase Buster Onley on ESPN.com Insider:

"Reed Johnson's back injury is the type that could lead to an absence of months, not days"

Truly scary for our outfield defense, which was so good...

ChicagoJaysFan - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 12:40 PM EDT (#165786) #
What concerns me more than the immediate impact of this injury on the defense is the impact of another injury to the outfield.  We don't seem to have anyone that can play an adequate left field, but that doesn't overly concern me as it's only LF.  However, if Wells or Rios goes down, who are we playing in RF?
jjdynomite - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 02:13 PM EDT (#165790) #

Well, if most teams without an unlimited budget (see: Abreu 2006) lose two projected-for-the-season starting outfielders they *would* be in dire straits.  Positive in hindsight that Alexis wasn't traded for pitching.

Throwing the "blessing in disguise" and "on pace for" cliches out there, as of today's second inning, Lind is projected to break Ichiro's season hits record.  Unfortunately, Lind is not projected to face #5 starters a la Chad Durbin for the rest of his career.

But seriously, Lind's hitting potential coupled with V-Dub's long-term signing and Rios as a budding perennial all-star, the Jays outfield has the realistic make-up of the stellar offensive and defensive prowess of the Killer B (By's) of the mid-80s and/or the back-to-backers of the early-90s.  (Note: can't imagine Lind's D being worse than Big George's or Joltin' Joe's).  And it's not like Sparky was pencilled in as the left-fielder of the future; his career year was last season at age 29; Vernon's was at 24 ('03) and Rios' was 25 ('06).  Here's hoping....

Rob - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 02:28 PM EDT (#165791) #
Unfortunately, Lind is not projected to face #5 starters a la Chad Durbin for the rest of his career.

More unfortunately, once Leo Rautins showed up in the green seats, Durbin went 1-2-3 and the Tigers pulled within one. It doesn't matter that (as of now) it's only one inning; the way Durbin was "throwing" out there, I expected to see a new pitcher to start the third.
Magpie - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 03:15 PM EDT (#165792) #
can't imagine Lind's D being worse than Big George's...

I can. But that's because Bell's defense was actually pretty good when he first came up.
GregJP - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 03:39 PM EDT (#165793) #
Watching Lind in the field today............LOL  Let's just say that he'd be DHing for sure if big Frank wasn't on the roster.
jeff mcl - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 05:09 PM EDT (#165799) #
Would there be something between stellar or E's for Aaron Hill?



VBF - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 05:36 PM EDT (#165800) #
I don't have a word to describe that game. I think the best we can hope for is that that wasn't the real B.J. Ryan and an injured one. I'd gladly take the back injury over the possibility that B.J. Ryan has begun to lose it. (Which I don't for one second believe).

The silver lining, if there's even one is that the fans seem to want to rejuvenate this rivalry. There was definitely another game being played in the stands today. It was good to see. All we need is JT to light a match and bean someone tomorrow and we could have another great rivalry on our hands.

And that would be the case if we actually played the Tigers again this year*. Who makes up this schedule?



*excludes rain out make up games.


Mike Green - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 06:03 PM EDT (#165801) #
That was a painful one.  I was surprised that Ryan didn't come on to face Granderson with 2 outs in the eighth. Ryan hadn't pitched in 3 days, and you would normally want him to come into the game in a high leverage favorable matchup like that.  Perhaps Gibbons knew something about his health. Or maybe there's a hard and fast rule now- 9th inning only. 
braden - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 06:19 PM EDT (#165802) #

Sigh....That was depressing. BJ looked like he *might* get out of it when he had Thames down 0-2. The following pitch was pretty damn good as well. Could have just as easily been a popup to Smith.

On the play where Smith decided not to go home, does anyone else think that maybe he thought there were two out? It's like he didn't even consider the option. Oh well, could easily be 8-3. Let's hope Ryan's struggles are just a symptom of a short spring training. I'd hate to see him go all Lidge on us seeing as he has four years left.

Ron - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 06:27 PM EDT (#165803) #
What's going on with Frank Thomas?

There's no shame in your production falling off a cliff at age 38 but I would prefer if it didn't happen in a Jays uniform. He's having trouble catching up to fastballs. I simply hope he's just off to a really slow start like last season. If the Jays want to make the playoffs, they need Thomas to be a real power threat in the 4 hole.


GregJP - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 06:41 PM EDT (#165804) #
I think he was just as bad in April last year.  He's the least of the worries at the moment.
Joanna - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 06:44 PM EDT (#165805) #

Yeah...

Well, Thomas got off to a slow start as an A too, so maybe he'll snap out of it soon.  And, needless to say, BJ seems off.  There is a lack of fire.  And he couldn't throw strikes to save his life, let alone the game. I think he got Sheff, but it was close and it shouldn't  have to get to the point of quibbling. I hope he snaps out of whatever the issue is.  Is his back bugging him? 

This team seems to be playing at two levels.  Bad-ass and ass-bad.  I just hope the D and the bat show up for Towers tommorow.

Joanna - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 06:50 PM EDT (#165806) #
make that bats.  He is probably going to need more than one.  Poor fellow.
Magpie - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 07:12 PM EDT (#165807) #
Ryan's throwing just as hard - 91 or 92 is his top end. The funky delivery and the way he hides the ball makes it get on the hitters quickly. I think what we're seeing is Extended Spring Training.

It was a lousy error by Clayton, but by then, who really cares. I mean a:) the whole damn herd had bolted out of the stable by that time, and b) you never get crisp defensive play when the fielders have been standing around watching walk after walk walk.

Two Blown Saves in the same game? I could be wrong, but I think the last time that happened was the Felix Escalona Game. Which also saw three ninth inning walks, by the way.

(Shivers in dread, at the mere memory of it.)

timpinder - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 09:50 PM EDT (#165813) #

I'm not really that worried about Ryan.  He's been very consistent the last three years and was solid in 2003 before he was even closing games.  I'm chaulking this up to the effects of missing spring training. 

I was worried about Rios, and Mike Green commented that it was early, he missed winter ball, and that he'd probably come around.  It seems as though he has.  So I have faith that Thomas, Overbay, Ryan and Burnett will come around as well.

HollywoodHartman - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 10:11 PM EDT (#165815) #
ramone - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 10:22 PM EDT (#165817) #
After watching BJ pitch today I'm thinking he's the one going on the DL?  Back still hurt maybe.  I hope I'm wrong.
Gerry - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 10:30 PM EDT (#165818) #
There could be several pitchers who are injured but instead of guessing let's focus on Jamie Vermilyea.  Jamie is a very nice guy who will be making his first trip to the major leagues.  Vermilyea is a sinker, slider pitcher who relies on his defense.  Think Brandon Webb or Derek Lowe but obviously not in that class.  Vermilyea will top out in the high 80's.  Vermilyea had a great rookie season at Auburn in 2003 but has moved more slowly since he got to AA.  It's interesting that Vermilyea was called up rather than some of the other guys in the Chiefs pen such as Brian Tallet or Matt Roney.
Thomas - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 10:31 PM EDT (#165819) #
Syracuse pitching coach Rick Langford said the Blue Jays called and asked for a pitcher who's fundamentally sound, holds runners on base and throws strikes, and Langford suggested Vermilyea.

I don't know if that's just the way the article was written, but that sentence surprised me. I assumed the front office sought the opinions of the the minor league staff when making promotions, but I always assumed it was in the manner of, "We want to call up Smith or Jones. Who is throwing better? Who could do three innings if we need a long man?" or "We want to promote an outfield backup, but not Lind because the callup won't get regular playing time. Is there any reason to take Lydon over Mottola?"

That sentence makes it seem like the Jays had no idea who they wanted. It could have been Tallet, Houston, Kemp, etc.... and it was because of Langford's call that they promoted Vermilyea. I'd be surprised if the team simply left the decision entirely in Langford's hands, but I've often been wrong on these things before.
Gerry - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 10:40 PM EDT (#165820) #

If the promotion is injury related, and the Jays are looking for someone for only two weeks, and maybe someone to pitch tomorrow, they often ask for the pitcher who is pitching well right now.  The Jays want someone who can jump in and pitch like a major-leaguer.  The Jays probably did go through a list and it's not 100% Rick Langford's call but the parent club does rely on the AAA coaches for feedback.

Ty Taubenheim might have been an option but he started today and could not pitch for another four days.  Geremi Gonzalez could have been an option but he started on Thursday and was ejected after giving up several runs.  Dustin McGowan was an option but he is probably better served building on his success rather than being the seventh man in the bullpen.

HollywoodHartman - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 10:41 PM EDT (#165821) #
I'd heard a similar story on how Reed was called up in '03 when Stewert went down.
JB21 - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 11:00 PM EDT (#165822) #

Umm, there is another one?

Gustavo Molina #55   |   Catcher   

HollywoodHartman - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 11:01 PM EDT (#165823) #
Unrelated.
VBF - Saturday, April 14 2007 @ 11:27 PM EDT (#165825) #
After some light research, I could only find this which discusses that it's a possibility. It doesn't imply that and there's no quote to support this notion. Saying Reed could be out for the season is like saying "Jason Phillips is having eye surgery so he could go blind".

Of course the spine is a serious issue. That doesn't mean squat until we actually hear something with some substance to it.


http://www.cbc.ca/sports/baseball/story/2007/04/14/mlb-bluejays-injuries.html
greenfrog - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 12:23 AM EDT (#165827) #
Well, Johnson was quoted in the Globe as saying, "This breaks my heart...I worked hard for three years to get where I am - I really wanted to be part of this team. I just hope I can contribute at some point."

And JP said that Reed has "a great deal of discomfort."

http://www.globesports.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070413.wspt-jays-johnson-13/GSStory/GlobeSportsBaseball/home

That doesn't sound like a player who will be back anytime soon.

actionjackson - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 02:29 AM EDT (#165828) #
Back away from the ledge everybody. Frank Thomas isn't hitting, Overbay isn't hitting much, Glaus is looking 10 years older than he is but hitting while he's in there, Sparky is out, leading to Matt Stairs' brief brilliant impersonation of a fence post, Brandon League farked up his shoulder, B.J. Ryan is in the middle of Spring Training, A.J. Burnett is being more inconsistent than usual and Aaron Hill's defence ranges from Alomar to Cantu and back again from game to game...gasp! and the team is still 6-5. Sure, they could be 8-3, but they also could have lost last night's game, and the game B.J. blew in Tampa took quite the comeback to get it to a save opportunity.

Even Mariano Rivera has been known to cough up a fur ball every now and then. Look at Games 4, 5 and 7 of the 2004 ALCS plus his first 2 games of the 2005 season. Four blown saves and a token one out appearance in game 7 to get the final out in the 10-3 blowout that clinched it for the Sox. In those 5 appearances, he worked 6 IP, allowing 8 H  7 R  3 ER, while walking 5 and striking out 6, and that's the Mighty Mariano in some extremely pivotal games. If Ryan does have an injury, he'd better start talking because the roles could be re-arranged temporarily, until he works himself back, but I tend to side with Magpie's extended Spring Training line of thinking.

I too would like to see more depth in the position players. I'm glad J.P. worked hard to build up the depth in the pitching ranks and I like where that's at right now and the roles people are slotted in right now. Zambrano, McGowan, or Thomson (should he recover) could be used as starters should they be needed, but I wouldn't move Marcum or Janssen into the rotation until Brandon League is back to throwing aspirins at the major league level and B.J. regains his touch. J.P. really needs to work the waiver wire/low-end trade market now for those utility type players and the Jays can't be giving up Rios for a solid #3 starter anymore, as if they ever could have. Although I'm not happy with certain positions (oh let me think: SHORTSTOP), overall I think this is a better team than the '06 version. I also think it's a team that will be constantly evolving over the course of the season, and hopefully there will be further tinkering. Interestingly enough, I'm much more concerned about the position players right now because I think the pitching is well stocked. The question with the pitching is will Gibbons and Ricciardi be able to find the right combination from the many applicants? I sure would like to see the position player injuries halted here, but you can't control that. The system is pretty threadbare in that area. Surely, they can take the depth of the pitching and use it to improve the depth of the rest of the team. Until then I'm just going to relax and enjoy the best baseball team we've had in this city in 14 long years. There we go, that's a little perspective.

On a far more important note: Happy Jackie Robinson Day everybody. What an athlete and what a man. I wish I could have seen him play. Sixteen full years before Dr. Martin Luther King's "I have a Dream" speech, which I also missed. Sometimes baseball does get it right.

Bring on Nate Robertson. They beat us with Chad freakin' Durbin against A.J. today, so why can't Josh return the favour. This ain't 2006 anymore. He's bustin' out.

One more thing: that Halladay/Bonderman game reminded me of the Jimmy Key/Dan Petry classic in 1985. They both went 10 shutout innings on June 6, 1985. A big fat unprize to the Bauxite who can name the Blue Jay who hit a 2 run walkoff shot off Aurelio "Senor Smoke" Lopez to end it in the 12th inning. No cheating with Retrosheet. It was one of the early games that season that suggested the boys were on their way to something special. 
Magpie - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 06:18 AM EDT (#165829) #
Well, I don't want to give too  much away. The fellow who hit the game winning homer... didn't make any post-season appearances for the Jays.

I seem to remember Key taking a no-hitter fairly late into the game... seventh or eighth inning.

Andrew K - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 06:27 AM EDT (#165830) #

Since Vermilyea has been called up, someone must be going on the DL (nobody has pitched badly enough to get sent down). Occam's razor suggests that it is Ryan.

When I heard he had a sore back in the spring I was worried. With that pitching motion, he's a prime candidate for back troubles a la Kevin Brown.

China fan - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 06:36 AM EDT (#165831) #
   Regarding the Vermilyea call-up:  this is a real mystery.   Who is he replacing?  All of the Jays relievers have pitched in the past three days, without any apparent health issues.  BJ Ryan insists that his problems last night were not health-related, so it's not him.   Just a wild guess here, but is it possible that Ohka or Chacin is being dropped from the rotation, with Janssen or Zambrano going in?   If so, that would necessitate a call-up, unless the starter was put into the bullpen.  However, that's pure speculation on my part.   I just find it mysterious that none of the media have reported any hint of a health problem with any of the seven relievers in the Jays bullpen, yet Vermilyea is being called up.   Or maybe a trade of some kind is in the works?
China fan - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 07:07 AM EDT (#165832) #

    The mystery deepens:  the Star today is reporting that Ryan and Ricciardi yesterday were refusing to comment on the state of Ryan's back.   Both were unusually terse and refusing to comment when reporters wanted to ask them about Ryan's health.   So -- just maybe -- it could be Ryan going on the DL.

     The other clue is the sequence of events.  The Jays played yesterday afternoon, and Vermilyea got the call from Toronto last night.  So, if there was an injury in the Jay bullpen, presumably it was one of the relievers who pitched on Saturday afternoon, necessitating the call-up a few hours later.  Again, this might support the notion that it could be Ryan.

     I've always found it annoying that the Jays are so secretive about their injuries.   Here we are, 16 hours after the end of yesterday's game, and half a day after Vermilyea got the call-up from Toronto, and there's still no announcement about what's happening.  

zeppelinkm - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 07:34 AM EDT (#165833) #
I'll add to the speculation bucket: Downs got up and warmed up for a bit yestarday, but never did make it into the game (despite a good situation for it in the 8th, I believe it was).

Isn't Gibbons notorious for, if he gets you up to warm up, he gets you into the game? I thought he was well known for that.

Soo, maybe it's Downs!

(I don't think it is, but I'd sure as hell rather speculate that it's Downs hurt then BJ.. )

China fan - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 07:40 AM EDT (#165834) #
  Downs is a southpaw, so presumably the Jays would have called up Tallett if it was Downs who was injured.  Vermilyea is a rightie, so it seems he is not replacing Downs.
zeppelinkm - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 08:18 AM EDT (#165836) #
Sorry, to double post (Needs to be an edit button!)

The Jays asked this about the pitcher they wanted: "Syracuse pitching coach Rick Langford said the Blue Jays called and asked for a pitcher who's fundamentally sound, holds runners on base and throws strikes, and Langford suggested Vermilyea."  I'm not sure if they are interested in replacing the exact role as much as they are interested in getting someone into the bullpen who can perform adequately. Anyways, let's hope theres an announcment made today to put an end to this speculation.

And I imagine you'd be pretty terse too, after blowing your 2nd save in just over a week when you are being paid close to $10,000,000/yr to not do that.


Barry Bonnell - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 10:14 AM EDT (#165838) #
Rosario pitched yesterday for the Phillies. 1 inning, no hits, no walks and 1 strikeout.
ramone - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 11:13 AM EDT (#165842) #

Well it is Ryan, it's not his back but his elbow apparently.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/article.jsp?content=20070415_104539_592

Mike D - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 11:18 AM EDT (#165843) #
I think it's a good, decisive move to send BJ to the DL.  He can't work out the kinks in the ninth inning of any more tight games.  Get him checked out, get him healed, and get him into a few minor league games.  Once he's good to go, he'll be back and (hopefully) all will be well.  No use risking another lost lead to then put him on the DL anyway.

Mags, as I've reminded you before...as painful as it was for you and everyone else, I was at the Felix Escalona Game.  In the upper tier.  Surrounded by hateful, taunting New Yorkers.  I'm still not over it.  Stop reminding me, I implore you!

AWeb - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 11:23 AM EDT (#165844) #
Dr. James Andrews...not a name you want to see in a brief medical report about a pitcher's elbow. I know he's the expert, and it's great that the Jays can send BJ to the best for a checkup, but still, I am now worried about BJ. That same link has Johnson going to Florida to see a spine specialist too.


Mike D - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 11:29 AM EDT (#165845) #
In the short term, AWeb, I'm worried too.  But just as it was the right move to send Burnett to Dr. Andrews -- even though it was early in a big contract -- it's the right move here.  They have to get BJ right, and the sooner they do so the better.
A - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 11:44 AM EDT (#165846) #
If the first 15 days of the campaign are any indication, we're in for The Season From Hell Part 2. Thankfully it's a long season.
Flex - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 11:54 AM EDT (#165848) #
Bit more information in the Star report. Looks like Frasor's the closer.
Rob - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 12:10 PM EDT (#165850) #
Ryan's injury, Johnson's back, yesterday's game...I knew it: the Curse of Leo Rautins.
MrElbertBuffin - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 12:34 PM EDT (#165852) #
From Buster Olney at ESPN.com

The worst-case scenario, Ricciardi said, is that Ryan blew out his elbow. "And if that's the case, then we'll adjust."

Yikes - J.P. isn't exactly inspiring confidence with that statement. 

With Glaus resembling my immobile grandfather, Johnson seeing a spine specialist for a disc problem, League's shoulder/arm becoming an enigma, and B.J.'s elbow getting wonky, it hasn't taken long for all of our spring dreams of a relatively injury-free season to shatter.  Of course its early, and these might all be minor problems that are long forgotten come June, but my spring training optimism has definately taken a hit. 

Oh well - I suppose that we should take a page from the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Universe, and not panic.

VBF - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 12:35 PM EDT (#165853) #
Well, here's the situation facing the Jays:

-Big Time Closer out for 15 days at least, could be much worse.
-Young kids in bullpen impressive
-3-4-5 starters rather unimpressive

I'll probably get shot down for proposing this, but with the possibility of BJ out for a while, and the fact that Marcum and Janssen will find their way to the rotation sooner than later, thus leaving holes in the bullpen, this could be a good time to consider a low cost, high reward type trade, such as an effort to acquire Brad Lidge. Even if BJ comes back in 15 days, it certainly wouldn't hurt to have him in the bullpen.

Maybe a change of scenery is all he needs.

Maldoff - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 12:47 PM EDT (#165854) #

MrElbertBuffin, you definitely took the mosat negative parts of that article into account. It also says that Riccardi and the trainers believes it's a strained tendon, and it's been that way for a few weeks.

Which begs the question, if he has been feeling this for a few weeks, why did they keep him on the active roster to start the season? Why not shut him down for 15 days, and keep a guy like Rosario on the roster?

Ryan C - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 01:18 PM EDT (#165855) #
I think Frasor will be ok as the Closer for a short time.  He's looked good so far this year and he did close for a large portion of the season three years ago.  Obviously I don't have the faith in him that I have in BJ, but I wouldn't exactly panic over it.

I guess this means Accardo moves into the setup role, which I think is great personally.  I've liked him from the moment the Jays acquired him.  Obviously I would've hoped for better circumstances to see him get more use though.  He also closed a little bit for the Giants last year.

Any more injuries and the bullpen is going to be a major problem.  But for now I'm still cautiously optimistic.

Rickster - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 01:22 PM EDT (#165856) #

-3-4-5 starters rather unimpressive

Not to add to the pessimism, but I would put the #2 starter on that list. AJ has been brutal this season so far, and was a big contributor to yesterday's loss. Hopefully he'll get some control soon.

GregJP - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 01:31 PM EDT (#165857) #
I think that at this point Gibbons trusts Janssen much more than Accardo, so it wouldn't surprise me if Jannsen is at least for the moment the key 8th inning guy.
ChicagoJaysFan - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 02:20 PM EDT (#165863) #
Well, if most teams without an unlimited budget (see: Abreu 2006) lose two projected-for-the-season starting outfielders they *would* be in dire straits.

I think you're either overestimating the depth that the Blue Jays have or underestimating the depth that other teams have.  To continue with your use of last year's Phillies as an example, they had Delucci to take his place after the trade and a young Victorino that could play well.  (After writing that, I think that you were using Abreu as an example of the Yankees can add depth and not how the Phils actually have depth, but the Phils part makes my point anyway I think).  Similarly, last year's Jays had 5 players that could play the OF (Cat, Johnson, Wells, Rios, Hinske).  Right now, the Jays only have 4 and it puts them in a very precarious situation.

Also, the Jays problem with OF depth is not budget related - it's roster construction (2 DH's (Thomas and Stairs) and 2 backup middle IF's (Smith and MacDonald)) and minor league management (they didn't draft well enough initially to get depth at AAA for their OF or another way to look at it is JP hasn't followed through on his "pitching can be traded for hitting" idea at the minor league level).
Cristian - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 02:55 PM EDT (#165866) #

Oh well - I suppose that we should take a page from the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Universe, and not panic.

And on this Jackie Robinson Day, 42 is the ultimate answer.

jsut - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 03:02 PM EDT (#165868) #
Great start from towers today, he just got pulled and Downs finished the last third in 2 pitches.  Here's hoping Frasor closes it out, and/or they manage to put a few more runs on the board.  Either way, Josh really deserves that W today.
ChicagoJaysFan - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 03:45 PM EDT (#165876) #
Splitting against teams like the Tigers and going .666 against the Royals and Devil Rays is a good recipe for a solid season I think and what I was hoping we'd do these first couple of weeks.

Doing it the way we did (2 blown saves, great non-closing relief, our offense performing to what I consider beyond even their lofty expectations, etc.) is not what I would have expected.  At the same way, you always have to figure for some unexpected good news and some unexpected bad news each season, so overall I'm pretty happy with the first 4 series.

jjdynomite - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 04:25 PM EDT (#165879) #
ChicagoJaysFan, I was obviously meaning the Yankees salvaging their playoff streak after losing two All-Star OFs to the long-term DL; the Phillies were punting the season anyway and the Jays aren't (yet) so I certainly wasn't comparing the Phillies side of the trade nor the skills of their replacement players.

I do agree, however, that Stairs is a literally big fat mistake (PR over talent), but I also think the Jays' outfield depth could be worse; why can't J-F Griffin get a shot and Stairs get DFA'd?  Small sample size: http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?n=John-Ford%2520Griffin&pos=OF&sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=424366 but an OPS of 1.203 is purty good.  Maybe he's finally figured it out at age 27?

Also, I think Smith's versatility is a bonus.  But yes, Stairs is done like dinner, especially with Biggie Hurt in the DH slot.
Gerry - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 04:49 PM EDT (#165882) #

AJ Burnett + Casey Janssen + Jason Frasor + BJ Ryan = 10 runs allowed

Josh Towers + Shaun Marcum = 1 run allowed

That is why baseball is such a beautiful game.  In the words of the immortal sage Juaquin Andujar "youneverknow".

Thomas - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 05:02 PM EDT (#165884) #
I do agree, however, that Stairs is a literally big fat mistake (PR over talent).....But yes, Stairs is done like dinner, especially with Biggie Hurt in the DH slot.

I'm not sure what to make of this comment. You can quibble with whether Stairs is the right fit for the Jays roster given the insistence on carrying 7 relievers and using a 4-man bench. However, I don't understand your criticism that he's "done like dinner" or that JP would prioritize "PR over talent." Given that we are arguing about a bench player, I don't see any reason why JP would choose a Canadian over a more qualified player solely because he's Canadian. When have the Jays marketed Stairs as Canadian? Does the casual fan know Stairs is Canadian? Is the casual fan more likely to attend a game because he's going to get the chance to see a Canadian sitting on the bench instead of an American or Latin American? JP signed Stairs because he felt he was the right player for the Jays bench, given the price.

Maybe Stairs has finally hit a wall. But what is your evidence for suggesting he has? Here are his OPSes since 2003: .950, .795, .817, .748. 2006 was the first year since 2001 he's had an OPS+ under 100. There's no reason that Stairs, utilized mainly against right-handed pitchers, won't post an OPS in the mid-to-high 700's. Maybe he won't, but I'll take his past statistics and the fact the Jays front office saw no reason to doubt his bat in spring training over your "he's done like dinner" pronouncements after 14 at-bats.

Furthermore, why would you suggest Griffin is a better option for the bench than Stairs? His 2006 OPS of .677 at Syracuse is brutal, particularly given that he's a DH/corner OF. The year before he had an .810 OPS at Syracuse and in 2004 his OPS at New Hampshire was only about .780. His good 36 at-bats this year notwithstanding, he's still someone who has a career OPS at Triple-A of about .750 and who strikes out in 25-30% of his plate appearances. You might say that Stairs is defensively challenged and slow, which aren't good qualities for a backup outfielder, but both those criticisms apply to Griffin, as well. Stairs has had a higher OPS than Griffin each year since 2003 and he's been in the majors, while Griffin has been in Double or Triple-A. I hope Griffin can become a serviceable major leaguer, but right now there's no evidence that he's better than Stairs. 

Again, feel free to criticize the roster construction, but it's far too early to call Stairs washed-up.
westcoast dude - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 05:23 PM EDT (#165887) #

Magpie, you held your ground defending Towers and you were right.

The play of the game today was Jackie Robinson running through Butter's stopsign with the winning run. It's been a while since he's had a chance to play.

Chuck - Sunday, April 15 2007 @ 05:38 PM EDT (#165888) #
I like having Stairs around, even in AAA, as Frank Thomas insurance. He's no outfielder, but there's no clear evidence that he can't be moderately helpful with the stick against RHP.
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