Batter's Box Interactive Magazine - Jays Sign Baldwin To Minor League Contract

Jays Sign Baldwin To Minor League Contract

The latest player to sign a minor league contract with the Jays is pitcher James Baldwin.

After pitching just 21 innings in 2003 and 2004 combined Baldwin had a decent year in 2005 in the bullpen, primarily for the Orioles. If he makes the Jays out of spring training he will make $450,000. Much like Weber and Phillips this is a no-risk move with modest upside.

In other Jays news Ricciardi says "We're going (to an arbitration hearing). I just don't see a middle ground with these two (Walker and Hillenbrand)." The team must be pretty confident in their case to take such a hard stand.

Additionally, the Star reports that Ricciardi confirmed that the Jays have a "$4 million standing offer for Bengie Molina".

Posted by Pistol on Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 08:50 AM EST.

Jays Sign Baldwin To Minor League Contract | 108 comments | Create New Account

The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.

eeleye - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 10:10 AM EST (#140213) #

I like Mike Piazza personally, if we can get him for 2 or 3 or even 4 million dollars. What a bargain! The only problem is, he wants to play a lot, and will want to be DH when not catching about 70 games, and we have Shea Hillenbrand for DH, who we axed Koskie for...And with Bengie Molina, the only way he would fit is if he became primary catcher, and Zaun back-up, because he wants to start and get paid 6 mil/year. If I had a cold heart I would do this, but once you start being disloyal to players, it sets a bad tone. So all in all, I think its close but no cigar, which is unfortunate. If we didn't have Hillenbrand to DH, I'd really think Piazza would be a PERFECT fit for back-up catcher

greenfrog - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 11:17 AM EST (#140215) #

Blair's latest suggests that Piazza isn't coming to Toronto, and that it's wait-and-see with Molina:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20051101.wblai/BNStory/Sports/

Jim - TBG - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 11:37 AM EST (#140216) #

Always a good move to have some veteran arms in the minors to do the dirty jobs and spare the kids. Though it has to be tough to add the "Expendable Ligaments" bullet point to the resume.

Tons of new stuff at the revamped http://www.torontobaseballguys.com including:

Discussion of the Backup Catchers
http://www.torontobaseballguys.com/20060123jim.html

Spirited Defense of Albert Belle as a human being
http://www.torontobaseballguys.com/20060117chris.html

and 100 Reasons to Hate Derek Jeter
http://www.torontobaseballguys.com/jeter.html

Enjoy

huckamaniac - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 11:49 AM EST (#140217) #

"If I had a cold heart I would do this, but once you start being disloyal to players, it sets a bad tone."

If we learned anything this offseason it is that the Jays are more concerned with winning than loyalty. If the Jays were more concerned with loyalty then Glaus would be with another organization and the Jays would still have Hudson (who came up throught the organization) and Koskie (who signed for less money to here). I personally would like to Molina here. Zaun is liked by a lot of people I guess, but I wasn't too happy when he basically said Toronto is goin to end up like Montreal last year.

VBF - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 12:40 PM EST (#140219) #

When did he say that?

eeleye - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 01:08 PM EST (#140221) #

I think the biggest whole for us isn't even back-up catcher, its back-up 2b/ss. Is John McDonald going to get all of the at-bats Aaron Hill and Russ Adams don't? Do we have any minor leaguers we could bring up?

RonnyBrams - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 01:57 PM EST (#140222) #

i agree eeleye. i don't think there is anybody within the system...and i have no idea what macdonald can do, but i'd feel much more comfortable if cintron was thrown in that arizona deal. or if we had signed aurilla or something. adams hasn't proved he can hit a lefty at any level. and although i think hill and adams should improve on last year, they are still two of our biggest question marks (adams especially) and we have no depth in the middle infieild.

Brent S - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 02:47 PM EST (#140224) #

Hot off the presses:

According to the New York Daily News, Mike Piazza told the Mets' equipment manager that he was very close to signing a deal with an American league team. The Yankees are reportedly out of the running, so I'm guessing that leaves the Jays as the recipient of his services.

What is the credibility index on an equipment manager?

MatO - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 03:03 PM EST (#140225) #

The only viable options within the system are Sergio Santos and Ryan Roberts. In the case of a major injury at 2B or SS then the one who's playing the best at AAA would get the call. Hopefully one of them is playing well but it's no sure thing.

eeleye - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 03:06 PM EST (#140226) #

I don't think Piazza is about to sign with Jays. He won't get most time at DH, thats for Hillenbrand. And most sources said how Riccardi hadn't spoken to his agent for awhile. If its not New York, that leaves the Orioles, but they already have TWO good catchers. Why a third? Furthermore, don't underestimate the Orioles this year. I like to assume all teams will be challenging, so look out for Texas too. Maybe Piazza surprises people and signs with the LA Angels.

Brent S - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 03:11 PM EST (#140227) #

Ah, I just read the Star article at the top of the page. The Piazza situation just got more interesting.

VGeras - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 04:13 PM EST (#140234) #

Casey Janssen will be in a fan chat at the insidethedome.com message board this evening - pretty neat

huckamaniac - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 04:37 PM EST (#140237) #

VBF, I believe Zaun said that this past season. I think it was sometime after a game against the Yankees at the Rogers Centre (which the Jays lost but I'm not certain). I tried to find an article which included the quote but I've given up after looking for 45 minutes. I vividly remember someone calling into the Fan and asking Wilner about what Zaun said. Wilner said the situations in Toronto and Montreal were completly different and that Zaun was wrong. Wilner said he couldn't see the Jays ending up like the Expos. Sorry I couldn't find the link.

VBF - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 04:59 PM EST (#140238) #

That's cool, his comment totally caught me off guard though. And the fact that it was after the payroll increase too. I'm not totally happy with apathetic fans, much less apathetic players. Though it would be fair to say that any apathy about a Toronto baseball team from anyone, is almost dead.

Pistol - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 05:08 PM EST (#140240) #

A's sign Frank Thomas. No terms disclosed.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/5278852

Wedding Singer - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 06:07 PM EST (#140243) #

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2305916

I don't know how to post links properly (Sorry!), but ESPN is reporting that Thomas has signed for a base salary of $500K, with the ability to earn $1.4M in bonuses based on not being on the DL with a left foot injury at different points of the year, and an additional $1.2M in bonuses based on plate appearances.

This seems like a low-risk, high-reward signing for Oakland. Its probably a good bet that a healthy Thomas is going to be productive, and to pay a healthy and productive Thomas just $3.1M is an unbelievably good deal in my opinion! If he isn't healthy, Oakland isn't on the hook for much at all.

I wish we could have pulled off something similar - but our roster is already overloaded. Well done Billy Beane! Assuming Thomas is healthy, Jay Payton and Nick Swisher will likely split time in left field, with Payton also spelling Kotsay and Bradley on occasion.

Glevin - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 06:41 PM EST (#140244) #

"I don't know how to post links properly (Sorry!), but ESPN is reporting that Thomas has signed for a base salary of $500K, with the ability to earn $1.4M in bonuses based on not being on the DL with a left foot injury at different points of the year, and an additional $1.2M in bonuses based on plate appearances."

If this is true, this is a great move for Oakland. Thomas is still a dominant hitter when healthy and even 200 ABs or so from him could make the difference between the making the playoffs or not. This is the type of move that seems simple, but so few GMs are capable of doing.

CaramonLS - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 06:52 PM EST (#140245) #

Sounds like a very good deal for Oakland.

Especially, even though he was injured last year, still was able to produce.

Andrew - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 08:55 PM EST (#140249) #

That's a pretty fantastic deal for Oakland. Pity Toronto couldn't pull off something like that. I'd take him for twice those incentives.

I seem to remember an earlier thread on this board where we were talking about what kind of contract to give Thomas. It was pretty similar to the one that he got from the A's, getting paid per hundred ABs, except I think we were considering paying him a million per 100 ABs instead of $200,000, and still thought it would be a good signing. Wow.

Geoff - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 09:03 PM EST (#140250) #

I wonder if Piazza will take a similar deal.

Or Sammy Sosa. I'd have to think Ricciardi would take an incentive-laden risk on either guy if they would accept a low base salary.

melondough - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 09:14 PM EST (#140251) #

For those of you so worried about who could back up at MI if a desperate situation arises...why not the Cat?

Ron - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 11:20 PM EST (#140253) #

Great signing by the A's. Low cost high reward type deal. If Thomas gets injured again or stinks it up, it's not going to cost the A's much. I just have a hunch his contract will turn out to be one of the best bargains this off-season.

Beane does it again. At this point I would pick the A's as the favorite in the AL West. Who knows what the A's would have done last season if Crosby and Harden stayed healthy all season.

TamRa - Wednesday, January 25 2006 @ 11:25 PM EST (#140254) #

What's the betting line that Thomas outperforms shea this season?

melondough - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 12:14 AM EST (#140256) #

With all the Blue Jay releif pitching depth (the usual 9 and now Tallet, Weber and Baldwin), I can't help but think something may be up.

I wonder who would fetch the most in return. Obviously Ryan and McGowan would be excluded but I would also assume Schoeneweis is also untradable, though they do have 3 lefties in the pen - a luxury most other teams could only dream of. I think Speir and his $1.9 million contract (not to mention his 2.57 era and 0.95 whip last season) could fetch us Michales.

Recall that it is reported that Philedelphia is willing to deal Michaels for Rhodes (in the stalled Crisp 3-way) who had similar numbers to Speir last season but costs twice as much. I recognize that this would give us a glut of players in the OF so likely there would have to be an OF traded soon after (I suppose R.Johnson or heaven forbid the Cat who can also play 2B if needed).

Anyway, I guess I am bored with nothing going on. Seems like it would make little sense to trade Speir and that this would cause more problems then it would good. Frasor or Walker however....

melondough - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 12:34 AM EST (#140257) #

Further to my last note, Michael's recently agreed to a $1.5 million salary in order to avoid arbitration. From a little bit of the reading I have done, some classify him as extremely underrated and more than decent in LF. I also think that if we can get a good player AND disturb the Red Sox/Indians deal, then all the better!

ayjackson - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 01:08 AM EST (#140258) #

if we assume for a minute that piazza is indeed close to signing with us (which i'm not buying), what would it mean?

surely, he would be brought in as part of a DH platoon, and Shea would be on the block. perhaps the piazza signing is pending trade negotiations.

if that were the case Shea, Lilly and Cat for Austin Kearns (whom is being shopped by new Reds mgt) would be sweet. Which would also mean McGowan would compete for the fifth rotation spot - which is nice. [that's a lot of salary for the reds, though]

ahh, just speculation....i revert to my old stance of enough changes for one year; let's play ball

zaptom - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 01:30 AM EST (#140259) #

Sean McAdam writes about the recent transformation of the Blue Jays and the Mets on ESPN.com

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?id=2304452

Nothing noteworthy here. But gosh dang, it sure looks good having Burnett in a Jays uniform on the cover of the baseball page. I guess I'm just a sucker for the attention.

melondough - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 08:13 AM EST (#140260) #

Cbs.Sportsline.ca contributor Larry Dobrow must really be a Yankee fan and a guy who obviously does not think things through before he writes them down on paper.

http://www.sportsline.com/mlb/story/9185622

In his contribution of "Winners, Losers, and Royals: You don't want to be a Royal" he places the Jays as the first "Loser" team from this winter and slants EVERY Jays off season move with a negative vibe. He ends his Blue Jays analysis with "this ends badly". The Yankees of course are celebrated as a scoring machine (I agree) but no mention of their aging stars nor their suspect starting rotation. There are other strange rankings like LAD in the "Royal" category or some that are not even mentioned like Milwaukee who I think should be in the winner category.

Readings like these really irk me, not only due to the intensity of which he berades the Jays, but more so because obviously he does not know enough about how to judge player talent to be given this job.

I really hope the Jays prove him wrong or it will be a long summer.

Jim - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 09:11 AM EST (#140261) #

There is certainly a scenario where things end badly for the Jays with these moves.

Burnett needs arm surgery, Overbay slugs .400, Ryan blows saves left and right, Adams and Hill don't develop, Glaus flops...

I don't think it will happen, but if it does there is no mulligan after 2006, most of the 'flexibility' is gone.

Frank Markotich - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 09:48 AM EST (#140263) #

While Jim's worst-case scenario can't be ruled out, the alternative is to keep finishing third and hope to catch lightning in a bottle one year.

Flexibility is nice, but what do you do with that money? Spend it on middle-of-the-pack players? What good is that? The money was actually spent on good players. If it doesn't work out, it doesn't work out.

Jim - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 10:01 AM EST (#140264) #

I'm not against the moves, and that is a 1 in 500 shot. It's just a point of view that isn't 100 percent unreasonable.

huckamaniac - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 10:02 AM EST (#140265) #

From Buster Olney: "A Molina-Blue Jays merger for 2006 seems inevitable."
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=olney_buster

For whatever reason you don't need the insider to view his blog right now.

einsof - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 12:22 PM EST (#140267) #

Today's New York Post-http://www.nypost.com/sports/yankees/62304.htm

Cashman canvassed team executives this week after Piazza's agent, Dan Lozano, offered his client to the Yanks for $2 million. Apparently, Cashman received negative feedback from his internal straw poll.

If Piazza's agent offered his client's services for $2 million then would the Jays get the same offer?? I was suprised that the offer was made public.

Mike Green - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 01:23 PM EST (#140270) #

Bruce Markusen's recent Cooperstown Confidential at Primer has a fascinating history of the split-fingered fastball, in the wake of Bruce Sutter's election to the Hall of Fame.

CaramonLS - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 05:43 PM EST (#140273) #

Is Molina really going to make that much of a difference? He can hit lefties, but Zaun is better than him vs. RH Batters.

Is the extra 4 million worth Molina hitting LHP slightly more than Phillips and providing worse defense?

What we really need is a Left handed hitting OF who can play decent defense on the corner (No, NOT Hinske).

Cristian - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 05:59 PM EST (#140274) #

What we really need is a Left handed hitting OF who can play decent defense on the corner (No, NOT Hinske).

Catalonotto is still on the team, right? By the way, it shocks me to no end how few people think Hinske can be an adequate outfielder.

CaramonLS - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 06:18 PM EST (#140275) #

You think he can play adaquate OF defense? Seriously?

sweat - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 06:28 PM EST (#140276) #

The point is no one knows. Thats why they are going to try him out there. Who does it hurt to try Hinske in the OF? Seriously?

CaramonLS - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 06:39 PM EST (#140277) #

The Pitchers who will have to watch Doubles fly over his head.

Glevin - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 07:44 PM EST (#140278) #

"There is certainly a scenario where things end badly for the Jays with these moves.

Burnett needs arm surgery, Overbay slugs .400, Ryan blows saves left and right, Adams and Hill don't develop, Glaus flops... "

The Jays just need one or two things to go wrong to kill the whole thing and they don't need to go nearly as badly as you portray them. Things need to go right for the Jays more than they have to hope they don't go badly.

Flex - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 08:44 PM EST (#140279) #

A meteor could hit Lake Ontario and a tsunami could come in and wipe out Toronto too. I don't see the point of detailing all the things that could go wrong.

HollywoodHartman - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 09:24 PM EST (#140280) #

But what if bad things happen to.... OTHER TEAMS too?!

BOS:

What if Schills ankle can't hold together?
What if Beckett gets injured (again)?
What if Matt Clement, Mota, Lowell, and Loretta DON'T rebound?
What if Wake can't pitch without his personal catcher
What if.... etc... etc...

NYY:

What if their aging rotation all breaks down?
What if A-Rod and Jeter both get injured in a freak gasoline right accident?

Bal:

What if they're right where they're expected to be?

So you see, every team could have something go wrong.

greenfrog - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 09:31 PM EST (#140281) #

The Jays were actually close to being competitive for a lot of last year. Halladay's injury put an end to that (though we weren't playoff-bound even with a healthy Halladay). On paper this year's team is quite a bit better.

I am worried about the high salaries and injury risk though. I guess my concern is that JP is spending in part to compensate for an mediocre farm system and less-than-stellar trades. In general, I like this year's off-season acquisitions (although I think missing out on Giles may come back to haunt us). The problem--potentially--is how leveraged the team is.

Paul - Thursday, January 26 2006 @ 11:51 PM EST (#140286) #

We don't need Piazza nor Molina. Hold on to the money, wait it out till mid season, and that's when we tinker around (LF situation, RF with Rios, McGowan replacing Lilly in the rotation) etc.
Btw someone said three for one deal for Kearns. Who is your dealer? I want some of the stuff you're smoking my friend. Seriously. Why is there so much hype surrounding this guy if he's failed to show any signs of being a stud?

Jays should keep the team as is, platoon of Cat/Johnson in LF and Rios for the time being in RF with Hinske keeping the bench warm for Troy Glaus. Makes us all happy, doens't it?

Is Roy Halladay pitching in the WC thing coming up? Hopefully he isin't.

Vinnie Chulk...

PeterG - Friday, January 27 2006 @ 09:38 AM EST (#140292) #

I don't think signing Piazza will make less money available but more. If he is signed, I believe Shea is moved with Piazza and Zaun becoming part of the DH rotation. This also might allow them to keep Q as another catcher.

Pistol - Friday, January 27 2006 @ 04:09 PM EST (#140303) #

To those that subscribe the Prospectus PECOTA mean projections are available. The full cards will be available in a week or so.

I was just flipping through and noticed that the top two comparables to Sergio Santos were Troy Glaus and Matt Williams (of course Wes Helms was third).

VBF - Friday, January 27 2006 @ 04:57 PM EST (#140304) #

Now before I get swatted with several virtual newspapers, I'll point out that this latest rumour has a BBRRS of warm diarrhea. I have chosen to withhold the name of the reporter.

Marty Y*** thinks that Larry Walker could be a Jay by Spring Training.

MatO - Friday, January 27 2006 @ 05:10 PM EST (#140305) #

Rotoworld (SF Chronicle) is reporting that fireballing RP Jairo Garcia of the A's is really Santiago Casilla and is nearly 3 years older. He'll now be 26 this year.

Paul D - Friday, January 27 2006 @ 05:31 PM EST (#140306) #

Speaking of Pecota, in Nate Silver's chat today, he says that the Jays bullpen beyond Ryan is "awful"

Mike Green - Friday, January 27 2006 @ 05:42 PM EST (#140307) #

Awful? The Jays' bullpen? I know that Jason Frasor is not Duane Ward, but awful is not a reasonable description for him in the set-up role, nor for Vinny Chulk in middle relief nor Scott Schoeneweis as a LOOGY.

Scott Proctor is awful. Vinny Chulk is what you want to see out of your middle relief. League average pitching. If he does a bang-up job with inherited runners, as he did last year, he's one of the best of his type.

Blue in SK - Friday, January 27 2006 @ 05:49 PM EST (#140308) #

Blair's latest is up.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20051101.wblai/BNStory/Sports/

Nothing to report, except for a little blurb that JP has been talking to Shapiro of the Tribe this off-season. JP has/had his eye on Sizemore and/or Crisp. Sizemore is untouchable and given that the asking price for Crisp is Marte plus others, there was no deal to be made.

Thomas - Friday, January 27 2006 @ 06:20 PM EST (#140311) #

Speaking of Pecota, in Nate Silver's chat today, he says that the Jays bullpen beyond Ryan is "awful"

If Speier, Frasor, Schoeneweis and Chulk are awful, I'd hate to see what he thinks of many other AL bullpens. Either BP's problems with Ricciardi's moves are colouring their analysis of the team as a whole or they are simply being lazy. Awful is incredibly poor word choice.

Paul D - Friday, January 27 2006 @ 06:26 PM EST (#140312) #

I think Blair's great, but I think the chances of JP deciding that he wants to trade Halladay to Cleveland this off season are between slim and none.

King Ryan - Friday, January 27 2006 @ 06:45 PM EST (#140313) #

Seriously, you'd think that a guy who works for BPro would look at BPro's stats. Here are the Jays relievers in PRAA in 2004/2005:

Speier: 8/10
Frasor: 7/10
Chulk: 2/2
Schoenweis: -9/6

Sschoenweis has the only below average number on there, and that was in 2004 when he was used as a starter, so it basically doesn't even matter.

rtcaino - Friday, January 27 2006 @ 08:16 PM EST (#140315) #

""Marty York is one of Canada's most popular sports columnists with a track record for breaking big stories.""

Sounds like something only Marty's mother could write.

Smithers - Friday, January 27 2006 @ 08:29 PM EST (#140317) #

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/5282852

Looks like the Crisp thing with Cleveland isn't going to happen for the Jays - sounds like he's going to Boston for Marte and Mota... sounds like a comedy act!

rtcaino - Saturday, January 28 2006 @ 12:03 AM EST (#140324) #

The Score is reporting Kelly Shoppach being sent to Indians as well. The Sox are tossing prospects around like dollar bills in a Nelly video.

huckamaniac - Saturday, January 28 2006 @ 11:30 AM EST (#140328) #

""Marty York is one of Canada's most popular sports columnists with a track record for breaking big stories.""

This should probably read: "Marty York is well known for thrusting his finger into Canadian living rooms while on Sportsnet. He has a track record of breaking big stories, however this mainly a statistical artifact because if you make enough stuff up, one or two are bound to be right."

Wildrose - Saturday, January 28 2006 @ 12:19 PM EST (#140331) #

While scrolling through the provisional rosters for the World Baseball Classic, I note Shea Hillenbrand is eligible for the Netherlands.

eeleye - Saturday, January 28 2006 @ 01:29 PM EST (#140332) #

What do you guys think of the new 2006 schedule?

http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/schedule/index.jsp?c_id=tor&m=4&y=2006

It starts off pretty hard. Is it just me or is the schedule this year harder than last year? A more difficult finish and start perhaps?

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/teams/tor/schedule?v=cal&m=04&y=2005

Named For Hank - Saturday, January 28 2006 @ 08:26 PM EST (#140340) #

I note Shea Hillenbrand is eligible for the Netherlands.

As soon as I heard about that I started wondering what kind of baseball bet I could put together where I'd win a Shea Hillenbrand Netherlands jersey.

VBF - Saturday, January 28 2006 @ 10:28 PM EST (#140345) #

Not sure if anyone heard it, but Wilner has been on the last few hours or so taking care of Saturday Night at 590. He spoke to Mike Ganter, Paul Spoljaric (Souljaric) and Dr. Prison Fence (who apparantly likes furniture). Nothing much at all to report, other than the fact that Shea Hillenbrand is an avid SPAM eater, apart from living in a trailer for half the year.

Cristian - Sunday, January 29 2006 @ 01:18 AM EST (#140348) #

Nothing much at all to report, other than the fact that Shea Hillenbrand is an avid SPAM eater, apart from living in a trailer for half the year.

Spam and a trailer? I see why he needs 7 million a year.

HollywoodHartman - Sunday, January 29 2006 @ 05:45 PM EST (#140350) #

Piazza signed a 1 year $2M deal with an $8M mutual option with the Padres.

Glevin - Sunday, January 29 2006 @ 06:06 PM EST (#140351) #

"Piazza signed a 1 year $2M deal with an $8M mutual option with the Padres."

A good signing. The strange thing is that this is Piazza's 4th team and 4th pitcher's park. LA, Shea, Florida, and now S.D. As good as his numbers have been, you have to wonder how good they'd be had he played even part of his career in decent hitter's parks. The availability of so many decent to good DH types makes the decision to keep arbitration-eligable Hillenbrand seem strange.

Mick Doherty - Sunday, January 29 2006 @ 07:06 PM EST (#140352) #

According to the story, the Pads are saying Piazza can catch "as much as he wants to."

That's GOTTA honk off Doug Mirabelli.

Named For Hank - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 12:14 AM EST (#140353) #

The availability of so many decent to good DH types makes the decision to keep arbitration-eligable Hillenbrand seem strange.

Considering that Hillenbrand is not just the DH but also injury insurance at the corner infield positions, that has to make some kind of difference. The team needed him in a big way last year when Koskie got hurt -- I'd hate to see Glaus go down for any period of time, but if he did and the Jays had, say, Piazza instead of Hillenbrand, we'd probably be seeing Johnny Mac in the lineup every day to cover Hill's move to third.

I like Johnny Mac. But I don't want to see his bat in the lineup all that much this year.

R Romero Vaughan - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 04:37 AM EST (#140354) #

I'm afraid that using Hillenbrand's defensive value as a justification for his $5m - $6.7m salary isn't going to wash given we had a superior defensive player earning less money who we are now paying to play in Milwaukee this year.

There are times where I wonder if some people ever see anything negative in a given sitution if it is a JP decision.

The ONLY 'value' FA crop this year was for DH/1B types and yet we have failed to take advantage of this despite the potential coming into the off-season.

The decision to keep hold of Hillenbrand and Batista at the deadline last year still baffles me.

Chuck - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 07:40 AM EST (#140355) #

That's GOTTA honk off Doug Mirabelli.

Who is Doug Mirabelli to be honked off? If he gets 200 AB, that'd be the second most of his career. In the worst year of Piazza's career, he still bested Mirabelli's career numbers.

There are times where I wonder if some people ever see anything negative in a given sitution if it is a JP decision.

Not sure how long you've been around here, but Ricciardi does not get a free pass just because he is generally well-respected. In fact, a couple of years ago he criticized the site as being too negative (he may have felt he deserved a free pass but he wasn't getting it).

Jim - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 08:21 AM EST (#140356) #

I'm certainly not a huge Shea Hillenbrand fan, but if you ask me who's going to have a better 2006 season at the plate, I have little doubt that Hillenbrand is a better bet then Piazza at this point with the bat.

If I'm going out and spending 2MM on a spare part at this point I might think about Hildago or someone else that can contribute in the outfield.

Pistol - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 08:21 AM EST (#140357) #

Hillenbrand doesn't get injured either. And $5 million for one year isn't a big deal ($6.7 million would be pushing it).

You can't say that about Koskie, Rondell White, Piazza, F Thomas, Durazo or many other players, most of who don't have any defensive value. There's a reason they signed lesser contracts.

melondough - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 09:13 AM EST (#140358) #

I am curious to know who JP could sign for cheap ($2MM) because certian guys out there intrigue me like Hidalgo(OF), Takatsu(RP), & Mecir(RP). However, the problem with signing anyone other than a catcher (like Piazza or Molina) is that we would need to reduce our 25 man roster by one. Since we would need to keep two cathers, there is no one left to drop, so a trade would be necessary.

Here is a list from SI of the 60 free agents remaining as of last Tuesday: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2005/baseball/mlb/12/14/free.agent.list/

Chuck - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 09:29 AM EST (#140359) #

if you ask me who's going to have a better 2006 season at the plate, I have little doubt that Hillenbrand is a better bet then Piazza at this point with the bat.

I guess it also depends on how you describe better. To Pistol's point, Hillenbrand is a sure bet to stay healthier than Piazza, and deserves credit for that. But outhit him?

Since Hillenbrand's second season, he has been incredibly consistent. He sure looks all the world like the 780-800 OPS type hitter he was last season. Absent any decline, and paying little heed to his proclamations that he has eaten so much spinach and so markedly reinvented the art of hitting that he's been transmogrified into a power hitter, that would sure seem where he's headed in 2006.

Piazza, in the worst year of his career, and far below his career 936 OPS, put up a 778 OPS in a pitcher's park. (I haven't checked, but I'm sure that his EqA would have been higher than Hillenbrand's in 2005.) Piazza will be 37, and 2005 may well have been an indication that he's about to go over the cliff, but I don't think it's a given. If I had to bet, I'd pick Piazza to outhit Hillenbrand in 2006 (using park-adjusted metrics).

Jim - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 09:46 AM EST (#140360) #

I don't know about his EQA, but Hillenbrand had a higher OPS+ then Piazza last year.

So if Hillenbrand is 31 and Piazza is 36 and Hillenbrand is coming off a better season I like the 31 year old better. Throw in the fact that he'll actually end up with a few hundred more plate appearances and I like him even better for 2006.

Jim - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 09:49 AM EST (#140361) #

Check that, Piazza will be 37 and has caught 1530 games in the majors. I'm going to bet against that every time.

Named For Hank - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 10:10 AM EST (#140362) #

I'm afraid that using Hillenbrand's defensive value as a justification for his $5m - $6.7m salary isn't going to wash given we had a superior defensive player earning less money who we are now paying to play in Milwaukee this year.

I was responding to the idea that dropping Hillenbrand and signing Piazza was a no-brainer and had no downside. But your suggestion that Koskie be held onto as 1B/3B injury insurance as well as DH doesn't really seem to make a lot of sense either, since Koskie's games played have dropped consistently every year for the last four or five years.

There are times where I wonder if some people ever see anything negative in a given sitution if it is a JP decision.

The person making the decision has nothing at all to do with it. Criticism that says "this is a no-brainer" when, in fact, there are significant drawbacks to the allegedly no-brainer plan will always draw criticism in return. People often confuse this with "defending J.P." when instead it is just attacking a silly idea.

Newton - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 10:14 AM EST (#140363) #

I'd take Piazza over Hillenbrand as a pure DH in 2006 without equivocation.

As for Hillenbrand's value as a defensive backup we still have Hinske for that role.

I'm still a huge Durazo backer and wouldn't mind seeing the Jays take a risk on a guy like Hidalgo.

melondough - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 10:32 AM EST (#140364) #

Again though I like them too, I don't see the point of hoping for guys like Durazo or Hidalgo. We would first need to make room for them and the Jays can't deal one of the two catchers or one of the 5 starters or one of the 7 relievers without having to replace them on the 25 man roster. That would mean we would have to deal one of:

Cat, Rios, R.Johnson, Wells, Hillenbrand, Overbay, Glaus, Adams, Hill, McDonald (Who we need to keep for insurance), Hinske (who is untradable).

Who would you suppose they trade? I assume if you want Durazo(DH/1B) they would need to deal Hillenbrand(DH) or Overbay(1B) away first. If you want Hidalgo they would need to first find a taker for Hinske or deal one of Cat, Johnson, or Rios away. Neither of these moves would improve the Jays.

The only thing you may be thinking is that the Jays may want to go with a six man bullpen and use the extra spot to sign one of these guys. However, I believe most teams would want a minimum 7 in the pen and I would not want to drop any one of Ryan, Speier, Schoenweis, Frasor, Chulk, Walker, or Downs anyhow. And if I didn't like one of them I would rather replace one of them with McGowan or Baldwin then go to a 6 man pen.

Mike D - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:03 AM EST (#140365) #

I'd take Piazza over Hillenbrand as a pure DH in 2006 without equivocation.

And you'd be remarkably rash to not at least equivocate. Piazza is much older, much less durable and he does not want to DH. And from Piazza's perspective, the beauty of free agency is that he doesn't have to, provided there's a team there willing to hand him a decker and some shin pads. And, indeed, there is.

This reminds me of the outrage at the salary dump of Corey Koskie, because "we should keep him around for depth." Even if we ignore the 25-man roster, the fact is that human beings generally do not like to be "kept around for depth."

Newton, I'm not conflating your viewpoint (which is reasonable on the surface) with the Koskie point; I'm just saying that there is a human element that is too often overlooked in these discussions.

Newton - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:05 AM EST (#140366) #

Rios should be in AAA.

1 of Hillenbrand/Hinske should be traded.

That gives us 2 roster spots without dealing with the pen.

Newton - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:10 AM EST (#140367) #

Mike D: I tried to make careful use of the term "pure DH" in my comment. If Piazza were willing to DH exclusively he could pop 25 HR with a very solid OBP. It is, alas, largely a hypothetical.

Hillenbrand is a true competitor and a great guy to have on the club, I just don't like the idea of spending 5.0 mill a year on him (I can't see him winning his arb...) when he is essentially a mediocrity and Hinske already fills the same defensive needs.

Jim - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:25 AM EST (#140370) #

Why would you want 12 pitchers in April when you need the 'fifth' starter only 3 times:

4 Halladay
5 Burnett
6 Lilly
7 Chacin
8 Fifth
9 Halladay

11 Burnett
12 Lilly
13 Chacin
14 Halladay
15 Fifth
16 Burnett

18 Lilly
19 Chacin

21 Halladay
22 Burnett
23 Lilly

25 Chacin
26 Halladay
27 Burnett
28 Lilly
29 Fifth
30 Chacin

Then starting May 1 you get into the 5 man rotation beginning with Halladay again.

Mike D - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:26 AM EST (#140372) #

I'm going to pre-empt Magpie and note that there is just no love for Josh Towers.

melondough - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:26 AM EST (#140373) #

I don't see how this would make the Jays better. I think Hillenbrand is better than Durazo while both Rios and Hinkse have more upside than Hidalgo and his past two years of .220 avg.

Can Rios be sent down without having to clear waivers? If so, then I would hope the Jays consider dealing for Craig Wilson or pushing hard for free agent L.Walker or Sosa. Then again, can their fragile defense afford such a move?

There really does not seem to be any good free agent OF's otherwise (J.Gonzalez, Hammonds, G.Williams, Hocking, Higginson, Surhoff are the only others).

sweat - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:30 AM EST (#140374) #

Hidalgo would be worthwhile, provided he is signed on the cheap. He has a good chance of being awful, but he might be the good hidalgo that shows every couple of years.

eeleye - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:31 AM EST (#140375) #

Why couldn't we have kept Koskie for an outfield position? I think he still can hit well: last year he got off to a slow start and never picked up. The year before he hit 25 homeruns. He is good defensively, not slow, and has played right field for 25 games earlier in his career. Apparently at one point he said he would be willing, then changed his mind. This would solve the OF problem and only cost us the $4 million we are NOT paying him the next two years. Then I would demote Hinske to AAA, and keep Rios on the roster who will hit 18 homeruns and .270 average this year for sure. Hillenbrand is a solid DH and we should keep him there. Therefore, all bargains aside, we would have the best possible team we could put on the field.

Jim - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:32 AM EST (#140376) #

Use Towers instead of Lilly or Chacin, doesn't change the point that you have 7 relievers in April with a 11 man staff.

eeleye - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:34 AM EST (#140377) #

But you do have to wonder, will Frank Thomas, who if he hits for the whole year will make about half of Hillenbrand, will his numbers be HALF that of Hillenbrand. I predict for Thomas 400 AB, 23 hr, .250 average.

ayjackson - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:39 AM EST (#140378) #

this is a fractured thread - everybody's talking about something different....so i'm going to talk about Larry Walker...

Is he a free agent, or would we have to acquire his rights to sign him at some point during the year?

eeleye - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:46 AM EST (#140380) #

I believe he is a free agent. And some very very low on the food chain paper (the Metro, lol) said Walker might be on the Jays this year. He said he is aching with his shoulder and he is too old now, but it is a fit: fans would love him, he could play right field, and as a hitter, the last two years, though injured a few times, in about 600 AB roughly posted something like .900 OPS (or more) which is great.

VBF - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 12:50 PM EST (#140385) #

Why couldn't we have kept Koskie for an outfield position?

As mentioned in one of Blair's updates, Ricciardi proposed this to him and he declined the offer. He didn't want to play the outfield.

Re: Larry Walker

The only reason I give the Metro article some credibility (despite a liquified and rather smelly BBRRS) is that Blair did in fact mention it as a possibility in another one of his blogs. York said it could happen as soon as two weeks form now, though Blair said he could be a July addition.

I think it would be based on how high/low the club is on Rios at that stage in the offseason.

VBF - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 12:51 PM EST (#140386) #

I meant to say season.

Named For Hank - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 09:02 PM EST (#140409) #

Then I would demote Hinske to AAA

Is this even possible?

GregH - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 10:42 PM EST (#140410) #

Re: Larry Walker

On January 15th, I met Larry Walker at a Canadian Baseball Hall of Fame fundraising event.

In answer to questions from the audience, he stated that he has a herniated disc in his neck which he aggravated over the Christmas holidays and that he is going to retire.

I would love to see Walker as a Jay if he could be even 60% of the player he has been but, rumours aside, I think it highly unlikely.

Glevin - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 10:56 PM EST (#140412) #

"Considering that Hillenbrand is not just the DH but also injury insurance at the corner infield positions, that has to make some kind of difference. The team needed him in a big way last year when Koskie got hurt -- I'd hate to see Glaus go down for any period of time, but if he did and the Jays had, say, Piazza instead of Hillenbrand, we'd probably be seeing Johnny Mac in the lineup every day to cover Hill's move to third."

Why? Hinske can play 3B too so Hillenbrand's versatility is not particularly needed. If Glaus gets hurt, Hinske can move to 3B. Hillenbrand <i>might<i> be better than Piazza this year, but he will make either 5 million or 6.7 million. Frank Thomas signed a contract with a $500, 000 base, Piazza signed for 2 million, and I am sure guys like Lecroy and Durazo would be available for cheap. The Jays could have signed Lecroy to platoon with Hinske at DH and probably have been more productive for about 3 or 4 million dollars less. Heck, Rondell White signed for only 3.25 million and Reggie Sanders for only 5.

eeleye - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:08 PM EST (#140413) #

But what if the best case scenario happens. What if he has a career year? Hillenbrand hits 30 homeruns, .290 average, 100 RBI's, how good would that be?

Glevin - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:18 PM EST (#140414) #

"I don't see how this would make the Jays better. I think Hillenbrand is better than Durazo while both Rios and Hinkse have more upside than Hidalgo and his past two years of .220 avg."

The problem with Hillenbrand is that while he is a pretty good hitter, he has very little upside. His career OPS+ are 77/109/95/106/108. There is virtually no chance he'll be in the top half of DH's in the league this year. In fact, by OPS+ last year some players who might end playing DH...(the projected starting DH and some potential fillers)

Hafner-170
Ortiz-161
Gomes-139
Thomas-131
Delucci-128
Sweeney-127
Kotchman-124
White-122
Stairs-118
C. Pena-112
D. Young-111
Lopez-110
Hillenbrand-108
Juan Rivera-106
Swisher-100
Everett-94
Thome-83
Bernie-81

It just seems strange that if the Jays are going to go all out for it which they are, that they would settle on someone making a lot of money with little upside. If you are going to take risks, this would have been a good place to do it.

Cristian - Monday, January 30 2006 @ 11:29 PM EST (#140415) #

I don't see why people think that Walker would want to retire as a Blue Jay. He played his most productive seasons in Colorado which is much closer to his home town than Toronto.

binnister - Tuesday, January 31 2006 @ 04:31 PM EST (#140449) #

This just in...

17 days until BJ pitchers and catchers report....

The long winter of our discontent is almost over..

*grins*

melondough - Tuesday, January 31 2006 @ 07:12 PM EST (#140458) #

Speaking of which, has anybody heard when single seat tickets go on sale?

VBF - Tuesday, January 31 2006 @ 07:32 PM EST (#140459) #

It appears to be impossible to actually find a specific date, but I recall that it's the week of the 20th-24th.

VBF - Tuesday, January 31 2006 @ 07:33 PM EST (#140460) #

What am I saying? I meant to say 22nd to 28th.

melondough - Tuesday, January 31 2006 @ 07:45 PM EST (#140461) #

Much appreciated

King Ryan - Tuesday, January 31 2006 @ 07:52 PM EST (#140462) #

The long winter of our discontent is almost over..

Heh. Every year is the same story. We sit and wait for "pitchers and catchers." Then the day comes and we realize how meaningless it is and we start to count down the days until spring training begins. That's cool for about a week, but then we get bored of meaningless games where Simon Pond bats cleanup and we start counting down the days until opening day.

Opening Day is on April 4th. We still have a ways to go...

binnister - Tuesday, January 31 2006 @ 08:00 PM EST (#140463) #

Opening Day is on April 4th. We still have a ways to go...

Poo, I say.

Poo on you, sir!!!

(Alas, he speaks truth ;/)

eeleye - Tuesday, January 31 2006 @ 08:23 PM EST (#140464) #

That is a mere two months away. And look at it this way, before then we have both the olympics, and the world baseball classic, and spring training. Which I hate cause we always do well and it gets my hopes up and it jinxes us cause it means nothing...But still, time will fly.

VBF - Tuesday, January 31 2006 @ 08:26 PM EST (#140465) #

Add in that time, and the time making Opening Night plans and it's practically 20 minutes!

eeleye - Tuesday, January 31 2006 @ 10:02 PM EST (#140466) #

Heck - opening day is right now. Yipppeeeee!!!!!

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