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What’s new since November 28th? B.J. Ryan is confirmed, at a total of $8M in 2006 ($6M signing bonus + $2M salary). Reed Johnson was reportedly re-signed for $1.425M – but even though it was the ever-reliable Jeff Blair that conveyed this, it’s odd that it has not been confirmed anywhere else. A.J. Burnett is on board, and it looks like his contract will call for $7M in 2006 and $12M each of the 4 seasons thereafter. And my initial estimate of $1M for Orlando Hudson in his first year of arbitration eligibility looks absolutely laughable.

So here’s where we’re at. Bold is used to indicate guaranteed contracts, though we don’t yet have 100% confirmation on Johnson and Burnett.
SP	Roy Halladay	$12,750,000 
SP	A.J. Burnett	$7,000,000 
SP	Gustavo Chacin	$350,000 
SP	Josh Towers	$2,300,000 
SP	Ted Lilly	$4,000,000 
		
Closer	B.J. Ryan	$8,000,000 
Setup	Justin Speier	$2,250,000 
LOOGY	Scott Schoen.	$2,750,000 
Mid	Miguel Batista	$4,750,000
Mid	Jason Frasor	$350,000 
Mid	Vinnie Chulk	$350,000 
Long	Scott Downs	$800,000 
		
C	Gregg Zaun	$1,000,000 
1B	S. Hillenbrand	$5,500,000 
2B	Orlando Hudson	$3,000,000 
SS	Russ Adams	$350,000 
3B	Corey Koskie	$6,250,000 
LF	Frankie Cat	$2,700,000 
CF	Vernon Wells	$4,300,000 
RF	Alexis Rios	$350,000 
DH	Eric Hinske	$4,325,000 
		
OF	Reed Johnson	$1,425,000 
OF	Gabe Gross	$330,000 
Inf	John McDonald	$500,000 
C	Gil Quiroz	$330,000 
		
     	Grand total:	$76,010,000 
Notes:

As before, what I’m trying to do here is project the team the Jays would field if the season started today. This isn’t necessarily the 25 players I would choose or the roles I would have them in, and it most assuredly isn’t the roster that will head north from Dunedin in April.

The arbitration-eligibles are Hillenbrand, Hudson, Lilly, Downs, McDonald, and Pete Walker (not included above).

For 2007 there are 7 players under contract for a total of $55M – Halladay, Burnett, Ryan, Koskie, Hinske, Wells, and Towers.

The State of the Budget, December 7 | 43 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
Terran - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 08:06 AM EST (#134941) #
For what it's worth, JP told The Fan that he and upper management had been going over a scenario where they could clear about 12mil from the budget to get hitters. One rumor that's been spawned since by RSN is that the Jays are thinking about trading Koskie on the Dodgers while also trying to sign Nomar...
John Northey - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 11:16 AM EST (#134973) #
Koskie is just over $6 million, Nomar? Not sure what he'd get. He made over $8 million last year, but only got into 62 games after playing in just 81 the year before. He is 32 next season. Koskie will be 33. Odds are the contracts will be similar if Nomar is healthy. Nomar lifetime is 320/367/544 (283/320/452 in 2005) vs Koskie at 277/369/455 (249/337/398 in 2005). Could be an upgrade depending on health in both cases. Nomar split time between third and short last season after playing nothing but short before that (well, 1 game at second and a couple of DHing assignments too if you want to be picky).

If the Jays do this they gain fielding flexibility (SS/3B) and could easily trade Adams or Hill still. It also frees up payroll space for 2007/2008. It seems JP is after flexibility so this rumour could make sense. He doesn't fear injury plagued players it seems too. Hmmm.... the Dodgers do have an injury plagued player in J.D. Drew (signed a 5 year $55 million contract last winter...hmmm...sounds familiar somehow that takes him up to age 33 - due to get $44 million over next 4 years) and is entering his age 30 season in 2006. He hit 286/412/520 in 2005 and lifetime is 287/393/514. Always in the NL but give him some DH time and maybe he could stay healthy. See if we can dump some other contracts too (Hinske) and it might be worth it.
binnister - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 11:23 AM EST (#134974) #
What the $12M comment means to me is that J.P. probably has trades lined up that frees up that amount of cash (probably getting similar salaries back).

What does this mean? Looking at the list, it most likely means that we've seen the last of Bastista (big surprise ;/), Lilly (maybe, though I'd like to keep him), and probably one of Koskie or Hillenbrand.
JohnL - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 11:30 AM EST (#134977) #
It sounds like Burnett's 2006 salary (for book-keeping purposes) will be significantly lower than $7M.

Blair reported in todays' Globe:
"Burnett agreed to take $6-million of the $7-million he'll be paid this year as a signing bonus."

For accounting, I think(?) signing bonuses are pro-rated over the term of the contract which would make his total "cost" next year $2.2M rather than $7M.

That approach doesn't work for everyone. My expenses are in "real" dollars, instead of "accounting" dollars. But then, I don't have to worry about expenses with 7 figures.
Matthew E - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 11:33 AM EST (#134978) #
I read Griffin's column and Baker's blog today. The Star seems to be taking credit for the Blue Jays finally deciding to stop being silly and start spending money like a real baseball team.

I think Mike Myers said it best when he said:

Not.
Jonny German - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 11:37 AM EST (#134980) #
For accounting, I think(?) signing bonuses are pro-rated over the term of the contract which would make his total "cost" next year $2.2M rather than $7M.

Yes, I've seen other indications that this may be the case but don't have a definitive answer on it yet. I'm working on it.

Pistol - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 12:28 PM EST (#134990) #
I believe there's two issues with the signing bonus - the cash expense versus the accounting expense.

The signing bonus is paid at the time the player signs the contract (unless otherwise noted).

So in the case of BJ Ryan he got a $6 million signing bonus and salaries of $2, $9, $10, $10 and $10. From a cash perspective Ryan is getting $8, $9, $10, $10 and $10 over the five years (and is what I would use for the payroll amount above).

From an accounting perspective the bonus is apparently spread over the life of the contract. Still using Ryan’s contract the expense on the books for the 5 years is $3.2, $10.2, $11.2, $11.2, $11.2.

What I think the Jays are trying to do is to move expenses from the current year into the future. It’s possible they’re doing this for (at least) a couple reasons. One is that with the purchase and renovations to the RC there are a lot more expenses on the books that won’t necessarily be there in the future (although I would think those type of expenses would be capitalized). The other part of that is that I imagine that the team will be getting additional revenues from the RC over time and will have more taxable net income in the future as a result.

The other possibility along a similar line is that they’re worried that the extra revenues from the RC will cause them to have to kick in money to baseball’s revenue sharing and they’re trying to reduce that.

So long story short, I think the signing bonus is being done simply as a tax planning (or revenue sharing prevention) move.
Andrew K - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 12:35 PM EST (#134992) #
I don't know about revenue sharing, but I recall that for the purposes of luxury tax a multi-year deal is deemed to be split evenly across every year, including the signing bonus.
Ski - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 12:47 PM EST (#134994) #
I read somewhere that the signing bonus is such that they can write it off completely as far as payroll is concerned. Thus, AJ's salary is only really 1 Mil $ in 2006, leaving the Jays considerable room to still get another bat or two........which was the point of the back-logged contract
Matthew E - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 01:30 PM EST (#135000) #
Another theory I've heard is that the Jays are moving expenses into the future because the owners are going to shut the game down once the CBA expires and the Jays won't have to pay any of those bills at all.
Grimlock - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 01:36 PM EST (#135002) #
I read Griffin's column and Baker's blog today. The Star seems to be taking credit for the Blue Jays finally deciding to stop being silly and start spending money like a real baseball team.

Me Grimlock thinks that all Blue Jays fans should thank Richard Griffin and Geoff Baker, for without their "constructive criticisms," none of these signings would be possible. If only JP, Paul Godfrey, and Ted Rogers had listened to their wisdom from Day One, then maybe there'd be two or three new World Championship banners hanging from the rafters. Thank you Toronto Star. Man, me Grimlock hate those guys. Isn't it great when the local media takes credit for moves they like? It reminds me of Steve Simmons taking credit for the Leafs' 16 game unbeaten streak.

Ducey - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 02:06 PM EST (#135013) #
"though we don’t yet have 100% confirmation on Johnson"

The official site confirmed it today.
joemayo - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 02:14 PM EST (#135016) #
alright man, i've held my tongue long enough. what's with the Me Grimlock crap??
Brent S - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 02:17 PM EST (#135017) #
Grimlock has become somewhat of a staple around these parts. Personally, I rather enjoy his shtick. But that's just me.
Ken Kosowan - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 02:29 PM EST (#135019) #
Grimlock has been a great part of the Battersbox over the years. At some points, some individuals have stated that his "shtick" was inappropriate in the past, much to my disappointment.

He, Grimlock, makes me laugh when he posts...

Keep it up, you, Grimlock.
Named For Hank - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 02:31 PM EST (#135020) #
joemayo -- Grimlock was a transformer, a dinobot. He spoke in a deep grumbling voice and instead of saying "I" he said "Me Grimlock". Usually "Me Grimlock SMAAAASH SMAAAAASH!"
Bid - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 02:41 PM EST (#135023) #
Well, thanx for nothing, nfh. Here on the night's Plutonian shore, we revere Grimlock as trickster Loki's brother, the Shtickster.

Sean - TBG - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 02:50 PM EST (#135024) #
More fun with Grimlock:

www.melovegrimlock.fsnet.co.uk/Main.html

Even in the UK they love how Grimlock talks.

Over to baseball, is there a chance the Jays could go after Nomar as a RF/SS/3B kind of guy? He could spot Koskie or Adams against lefties... although I don't know what kind of SS he is these days.
joemayo - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 02:52 PM EST (#135026) #
joemayo -- Grimlock was a transformer, a dinobot. He spoke in a deep grumbling voice and instead of saying "I" he said "Me Grimlock". Usually "Me Grimlock SMAAAASH SMAAAAASH!"

i've been an avid reader/casual poster on this site for a few years now and after reading his posts start off with Me Grimlock for all that time it started getting to me a little bit. but only b/c i had no idea what he was talking about. thanks for the explanation NFH, now that i know it's a transformers reference i can enjoy Grimlock's posts on a whole new level!

Chuck - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 03:47 PM EST (#135036) #
is there a chance the Jays could go after Nomar as a RF/SS/3B kind of guy?

Put me in the camp that says not to waste time with Nomar.

He's a huge injury risk, and figures to be one for the balance of his career. There's no room for him in the infield what with him likely being a huge defensive liability at SS and entirely unnecessary at 3B what with Koskie, Hill, Hillenbrand and Hinske all currently on the roster. And do we need two ex-infielders plodding around in the outfield corners?

I think that whoever signs Garciaparra will be paying a premium for a once famous person. If the Jays go after an outfielder, let it be a real outfielder. If they are after a 1B/DH type, let it be someone with, say, Frank Thomas' upside rather than the 350/450 hitter I fear Garciappara has become.

Twilight - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 03:58 PM EST (#135041) #
Thomas? Upside? It's kinda hard to say that a guy with 40+ HR seasons and .350 averages as having upside.

But I agree. I'd be ecstatic to have Big Hurt in a Jays uniform. If he stays healthy he is going to be huge.
Chuck - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 04:13 PM EST (#135046) #
Er, upside as in a 900+ OPS for 400 AB, not upside as in a return to his peak seasons.
Jonny German - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 04:19 PM EST (#135048) #
If he stays healthy he is going to be huge.

That's the upside.

koanhead - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 04:46 PM EST (#135060) #
Frank Thomas has been on my wish list since last spring. That'd be another free agent signing I could sink my teeth into. Oh yes, a new ballpark Frank for the Rogers Centre would be fine fine fine.
Mike Green - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 05:12 PM EST (#135069) #
Frank Thomas. Oh, yeah! In his last 2 injury-plagued seasons, he's had 345 at-bats, hit 30 homers, walked 80 times and struck out 88 times. At this stage of his career, the odds are that he's going to hit .250 but with enough power and plate discipline that he'd still be easily the best hitter on the club on a rate basis and very valuable.

The only issue with Frank is contract terms regarding plate appearances. Pistol's suggestion of $15,000 per PA with a $2 million minimum sounds reasonable; I might go somewhat higher.
Ski - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 05:23 PM EST (#135073) #
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2005/writers/tom_verducci/12/07/bluejays.hitters/index.html

I'd like Frank Thomas in a Jays uniform too, but Tom doesn't seem to think its too likely, although he gives no reference to his analysis....

Frank Thomas
So far Thomas is nowhere near the Jays' radar. He's not likely to appear any time soon, either.

Damn, thats a downer....nice to see Verducci giving the Jays some face time after that Tryout this spring...and hey! does a 13 game improvement over the 2004 season mean the Jays beat the dreaded SI Cover Curse?
Ducey - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 05:35 PM EST (#135074) #
I still think that the Thomas Durazo combo is the way to go at DH.

Thomas can hopefully make it to somewhere close to the all-star break before he blows up, Durazo can then take over from there. If both are on incentive laden contracts the Jays would be covered.

If both are healthy and performing in the second half, the Jays can move one to 1B and the Jays can pay for them with playoff revenue ;-p

Under this senario the Jays would not lose anyone. All they would need is an upgrade in RF. Any excess pitching plus Rios Hillenbrand or Hinske could could be traded for some toolsy hitting prospect(s) who could fill the gap in 2007
Ducey - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 05:37 PM EST (#135075) #
Ski,

I thought JP met with Frank and or his agent on Monday - if so that is on the radar...
Ski - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 05:49 PM EST (#135076) #
See, thats what I thought too, thats why i wondered why Verducci said that with no reference....Guess we'll wait and see what Frank wants to do
VBF - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 05:59 PM EST (#135078) #
Well, it could have been just going through the motions. If talking to a player means being on the radar, then I guess Paul Konerko was on our radar at some point, as was a whole slew (sp?) of players you'd be surprised at.

For all we know, the meeting(s) went like this:

Agent: Okay, we want 7 million guaranteed or 30,000 a plate appearance
JP: Okay...[walks away slowly]

I'm sure this is all common practice. Heck, it's his job. Not everyone he talks to is going to be on the radar.

Now would JP like Thomas? Probably yes, but if both sides aren't on the same page then yes, Thomas is off the radar.





BCMike - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 06:43 PM EST (#135083) #
I'd love Thomas or Garciaparra, both have upside which is based entirely on health.

Garciaparra is still only 32 and with a full season could easily put up an .850 OPS. DH'ing could help his health prospects.

Thomas with a full season could easily give you a .900+ OPS.

Both seem to be made of glass, but both have the potential to be by far the best hitters on the Blue Jays.

Who's more likely to stay healthy?

I'd put my money on Garciaparra, Thomas is 37 and 6'5 275lbs... besides, Nomar saves lives, surely karma will help him through a healthy season :)
Chuck - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 07:52 PM EST (#135091) #
I am guessing that Thomas is Oakland bound. I think he'll be cheaper than Garciaparra because of the latter's ability to play a position... or at least don a glove.

The Jays need a hitter, not necessarily anyone who can take the field, so the value in Garciaparra's glove would be money spent for nought.

Just bring in a big ol' DH. He can leave his glove at home. Rico Carty. Cliff Johnson. Otto Velez. Frank Thomas. Whoever. The sole job requirement should be "can hit". There are enough able glovemen on the team already.
R Billie - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 08:10 PM EST (#135098) #
All things considered, I like the Big Hurt best as a hitting talent. But at his size and age, I still have to believe Garciaparra is the better bet to put in more of a full season.

It all comes down to what the cost and commitment is I guess. If they're comparable then go for the talent in Thomas. The Jays could always clear salary and try to get both I suppose.
Lefty - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 08:52 PM EST (#135104) #
With the Mets out the catchers market now perhaps one of Hernandez or Molina - not being offered arbitration - could be had at decent price.

TamRa - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 09:45 PM EST (#135122) #
I know JP's not going to do this but there is one way to have a solid shot at Nomar - promise him SS.

Adams? Yeah, well, there are things to like about him but....nothing to get married to. he becomes a tradable asset (with Hill ready to step in when/if Nomar gets hurt.

And really, Nomar's bat plays best at SS, not in the high-offense positions others are thinking of moving him to.

Sign him to something for one yearwith incentives and a vesting option for next year bast on 550 PA and count yourself blessed, IMO.

Thomas, I could go either way simply because his health scares me...but folks who speak of his health are speaking well, who knows?
greenfrog - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 10:01 PM EST (#135125) #
A declining Nomar on turf...hmm. I supposed he could be a decent .280-.290 utility guy who could play some regular stints in the lineup. Sort of Mike Bordick-plus. But not much more than that, I don't think.
Grimlock - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 11:08 PM EST (#135144) #
Who's this joemayo character, anyway? Frankly, he sounds made up!

As for the rest of the thread, me Grimlock would LOVE to have the Big Hurt in the lineup, but acknowledge it's a longshot. A guy me Grimlock would have liked to see come back is Johnny O. Too bad he retired! Hmm... is David Wells now the last one left standing from those post-season rosters? Does he win the Hellfish bonanza?
BrockLanders - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 11:24 PM EST (#135153) #
I'm still waiting for Swoop, Slag, Snarl and Sludge to post about the jays. Grimlock the Pronoun Butcher would feel more comfortable here too. :)
BrockLanders - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 11:28 PM EST (#135157) #
Heres the URL for the heathens who can't imagine a dinosaur robot with poor enunciation skills:

http://tfarchive.com/cartoons/generationone/profiles/g1grimlock.php
mathesond - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 11:47 PM EST (#135180) #
For those that can't get enough on the Burnett signing, here's a great retort to an ESPN radio guy's comments.
6-4-3 - Wednesday, December 07 2005 @ 11:50 PM EST (#135185) #
Grimlock:

The Flying Hellfish currently have Mike Timlin, David Wells, Al Leiter, and Pat Borders in the hunt for the stolen paintings.

This year John Olerud, Roberto Alomar, Greg Myers, and Rickey Henderson had their keys turned.

I guess the question now is if Timlin can outlast Wells, although I'm almost certain that the Mariners will find a reason to sign Borders in 2010.
Cristian - Thursday, December 08 2005 @ 01:58 AM EST (#135345) #
Nice to see Grimlock take a few 'Wheelie slingshots to the nose' from joemayo.
Mike Green - Wednesday, December 21 2005 @ 10:35 AM EST (#137092) #
Jonny nailed the McDonald contract. If you add in Overbay and subtract Gross, you'll probably have to add a couple of million to the total. So, we're looking right now at a budget of $78 million. For 2007, the Jays have Halladay, Burnett, Ryan, Hinske, Wells, Koskie and Towers under contract with a payroll of $53.7 million, plus they'll have a whack of arb-eligibles. It looks to me like there's not much payroll flexibility left.
The State of the Budget, December 7 | 43 comments | Create New Account
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