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Disclaimer/Confession: I finished writing this about 45 seconds before Pujols hit the homer Sunday. I'm glad I can post it, unedited, now, and with no sense of irony or further fear of jinxing involved.

The Houston Astros, in their 44th season of existence, are headed to the franchise's first World Series. The best man of the World Series dropped to one knee tonight and offered up a promise ring -- one with a (baseball) diamond attached, of course.

Now maybe Toronto fans, spoiled by multiple World Series within their team's first two decades of existence, can't appreciate the magnitude of that statement ...

... but even as a transplanted Texan, I admit the concept of "Houston Astros, World Series participant" boggles the mind a little bit. Down in these parts, there are plenty of good college baseball programs. For instance, that little school in Austin has been pretty good, even once upon a time featuring a star pitcher now donning the Astro rainbow, Rocketing the Longhorns to the College World Series title back in 1983 -- and there have been plenty of Fall Classics played out on October's Lone Star high school football fields from the panhandle down to the Gulf Coast.

But big league baseball? In Texas? That has been about heartbreaking Houston losses to the Mets and Braves. About the Rangers, who have played thirty-four World Series-free seasons themselves, never getting past the Yankees. It was about having the singlemost iconographic figure in the history of both Texas big league franchises -- that'd be Nolan Ryan -- win a World Series ring (with a New York team, no less) before he was old enough to shave, then never even getting back to the big stage over the ensuing twenty-four years of his career.

It was about Pudge getting a ring in Florida, Jimmy Wynn going to the Series with the Dodgers, Joe Morgan going to the Reds and winning MVP awards and World Series rings, Billy Martin escaping Arlington, landing in the Bronx, getting in more trouble than not, but winning titles along the way.

Now, maybe it's about the guys who have stayed ... about Biggio and Bagwell and Berkman and let's hope the "Killer B's" references don't get too tired too fast. Maybe the ghosts of Cesar Cedeno and Bob Watson and Enos Cabell and Joe Niekro and Joe Sambito and so many others who haunt the Astrodome can take a long cool drink of orange juice and champagne at Minute Maid Park this year.

The best man of the World Series dropped to one knee tonight and offered up a promise ring -- one with a (baseball) diamond attached, of course. And the Houston Astros happily accepted it, but at the same time winked at the suitor and drawled, "Y'all do know I'm looking for a different kind of ring, right?"

The Perennial Bridesmaid Gets Engaged | 21 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
Magpie - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 01:27 AM EDT (#130351) #
Jose Cruz! Dickie Thon! Larry Dierker! Not to mention Harry Walker's crew from Ball Four
westcoast dude - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 01:27 AM EDT (#130352) #
Good one, Mick. This has all the ingredients to be a great 7 game World Series: pitching, pitching, and pitching.
My head says White Sox but my heart says Houston.
Skills - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 09:09 AM EDT (#130354) #
Dunno where to post this, but is anyone else unnerved by the arrival of Mazzone in Baltimore? In the past few years I've always dismissed the Orioles because of their flakey pitching, but now that they have the miracle worker, I'm not so sure I can do that anymore.
SK in NJ - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 09:45 AM EDT (#130359) #
I'm scared to death of Mazzone going to Baltimore. Let's hope his success with pitchers in Atlanta was due to Turner Field and the National League. It's scary to think what he might be able to do with Bedard and Cabrera (the latter especially).

Congrats to the Astros. A part of me didn't want to see Chris Carpenter in the World Series, so I'm happy. I'm rooting for the Astros to win it all...which only means the White Sox will win. I had MLB Extra Innings, and the White Sox announcers alone make me hate that franchise.
Skills - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 09:49 AM EDT (#130361) #
Carpenter was the reason I wanted the Cardinals to make it to the WS. Though he never panned out for us, I think we made the right move in dropping him at the time because there would've been a 1-2 year wait for him to recover from injury. Plus, he was on my fantasy team and I he was a steal in the 6th round. Boo ya.
Pistol - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 10:39 AM EDT (#130365) #
is anyone else unnerved by the arrival of Mazzone in Baltimore?

No. I think bad coaches can hurt a team, but good coaches can only do so much.

What I find interesting is that if someone like Mazzone is so valuable to a team as people make him out to be, why is he only able to command a relatively minimal salary (probably at best $1 million)? If he can turn a good pitcher into a great pitcher, or pick up someone off the scrap heap and make them an average pitcher isn't that worth at least several million to a team? Then why will he make much, much less than that?

Skills - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 11:36 AM EDT (#130371) #
That is a really good question Pistol. Perhaps I have too much respect for him, but I would have expected some degree of bidding war, especially with the Yankees involved. Maybe his friendship with Perlozzo in Baltimore prevented this from happening. Either way, I would have paid Mazzone a few million just to come help me out with the legal memo I have to write this weekend.
Wildrose - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 12:01 PM EDT (#130376) #
I must admit a tinge of sadness followed last nights game, as its probably the last we'll ever see of Larry Walker.

He's still productive and I wish he'd keep playing. I guess his neck pain is so serious that it takes hours of stretching to prepare for a game. He certainly sounded like a guy who's done.

My question. Is he a hall of famer?

Mike Green - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 12:47 PM EDT (#130380) #

How timely a question, Wildrose. Hall Watch will be resuming after the World Series, and I'll make Larry Walker the first subject.

But, I won't keep you in suspense about my opinion. Here are his age 38 comparables according to BBRef. Chuck Klein is the best comparable really, and Walker was a little better both at the plate and in the field. Klein's in the HOF. Walker was noticeably better than Dwight Evans with the bat, and about as good in the field. Evans is out, but should, in my opinion, be in. So, yes, Larry Walker, Hall of Famer.

Mick Doherty - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 12:53 PM EDT (#130381) #
Also, Larry Walker, Hall of Namer ... just last week, in fact. Probably the best Walker ever to play in the majors (sorry Harry, Dixie). He'd probably be the best guy to hit third, fourth AND leadoff for that team.
John Northey - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 01:10 PM EDT (#130384) #
Walker always seemed boarderline to me for the HOF. Very good, but without Coors probably a 300 hitter with 20-30 HR per year. I'd love it if he makes it though.

Meanwhile I'm still hoping he plays for Canada in the World Cup (or whatever it is called) in the spring. That way he could retire with something other than a K as his last AB maybe.
Jabes - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 01:47 PM EDT (#130387) #
You should have called this thread, "The Other Roy". As in which Roy would you rather have; Roy Oswalt, Roy Halladay, or Roy Horn?
Jordan - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 01:51 PM EDT (#130389) #
Mike, do I recall correctly that Klein, like Walker, played many of his best years in a hitter's haven? I think it was the Baker Bowl where Klein put up his truly amazing seasons. My sense has been that both Klein and Walker were excellent players, but mightn'tve been considered HOF material in different ballaprks. But I'm open to learning otherwise.

More old Astros loving this moment: Glenn Davis, Bob Knepper, and the marvelous Charlie Kerfeld. I think I'll go open a can of Colt 45.
VBF - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 02:10 PM EDT (#130391) #
He's still productive and I wish he'd keep playing. I guess his neck pain is so serious that it takes hours of stretching to prepare for a game. He certainly sounded like a guy who's done.

If Marty York is right (which he most likely isn't) we should see about 162 games of him next year. I don't think it was brought up here, but that's his latest concoction. BBRRS= vapoured poo.

Mick Doherty - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 02:14 PM EDT (#130392) #
Jabes, you've inspired the latest poll. But I stuck to baseball players (including fictional ones) as I don't think there's a "Sons of Roy Horn" site out there.
VBF - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 02:37 PM EDT (#130393) #
Ignore that last post, Larry Walker has played his last game.
Mick Doherty - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 03:00 PM EDT (#130396) #
Thanks, VBF, the Walker retirement now has its own thread.
Mike Green - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 03:22 PM EDT (#130398) #

It's true, Jordan, that Klein did put up his numbers in the Baker Bowl, which was a hitter's park but not as extreme as Coors (park factors of about 110 instead of 125).

The thing is, before the park adjustment, Walker's offensive numbers, combined with his defensive skills, would have him as a no-doubt HoFer. He slides in between Johnny Mize and Stan Musial in OPS. If you make the adjustment, he sits at #75. The players ahead of him on this career OPS+ list who are not in the HoF, either had much shorter careers (Donlin, O'Doul, Joyce..), had major defensive issues (Mitchell, Howard) or had significant off-field issues (Pete Browning, Dick Allen). The players immediately behind him on the list are either in the Hall despite much less impressive careers (such as Bill Terry), had short careers or should be there (Reggie Smith).

Jabes - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 03:44 PM EDT (#130400) #
Oh crap, Leo Mazzone is going to the O's.
Keith Talent - Thursday, October 20 2005 @ 10:05 PM EDT (#130427) #
Anybody notice the difference between the Astros in the 9th inning last night compared to Monday night?

Monday night they were jumping up and down, hollering and carrying on from the dugout.

Last night they were very subdued: Lesson learned, I guess. Respect the baseball gods.
CeeBee - Saturday, October 22 2005 @ 08:09 AM EDT (#130466) #
Back to Chuck Klein, Baker bowl was 279 to right, with a 60' wall and Klein was a left handed pull hitter. I have not been able to find his road/home splits but I bet he put up a good percent of his numbers at home. No doubt he was a great hitter, but so was Larry Walker and though Walker probably doesn't have much of a chance to get into the hall, theres more than a few guys already in there who were no better or perhaps not even as good as Larry. Too bad it's pretty much come down to longevity and a few sacred milestones like 3000 hits or 300 wins. :(
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