Good stuff? Well, I don't know if anyone else had noticed, but the Jays hitters had completely collapsed these past few weeks. I mean, everybody was hitting like Dave Berg. Cat and Koskie were the only guys even around league average for the month of September. So it's good to see a few balls leave the yard.
Four starters hit double figures in wins? That's OK, doesn't happen all the time. Can Gus or Josh get one more and break the tie?
The people who would have had to pay the million were probably having heart attacks too. :-)
If Cat had gotten a base hit in the 8th, Adams was probably on orders from the bench to stop at second on the play.
We actually have two. "OK Blue Jays" and "We fought the A's" which is sung to the tune of "I fought the law".
We fought the A's and the Jays won
We fought the A's and the, Jays won
We beat the White Sox in Comiskey
We beat the In-di-ans too
We....
I can't remember the rest. A friend of mine has it on tape.
(Sung to the tune of 'Sloop John B')
I'm standing on the third base bag
Just waiting for a home run tag
The strikes and spares and misses all keep on keeping me from reaching end zone
I want to go home
Please let me go home
And all that's from memory!
Ooh! Will he be part of the Jonny Gomes trade?
- It was another ass kissing fest from the callers:)
Geez, even GWB saw his insane approval rating fall at some point.
Boy, this should go over well. I put the over/under on vicious comebacks at 5.5.
The only reason I can see for the statement that they're going to pursue more of these type of hitters is because that's what out there and there's no point acknowledging to the fans that you can't get what you need-tell them you need something you can get instead.
A rare chance to toot my own horn for getting something right:
_Tyler - Monday, November 29 2004 @ 12:01 PM EST (#11881) Just to make myself clear, your argument depends on people showing up at the stadium. I don't think Delgado pushes the needle either way to much on that, absent a winner.
Toronto's average attendance in 2002: 20,220
Toronto's average attendance in 2003: 22,215
Toronto's average attendance in 2004: 23,457
Toronto's average attendance in 2005: 24,696
Attendance data per ESPN.com. Don't get a big hitter to sell tickets, get a big hitter because he'll win you games. If JP thinks that this team needs more Shea Hillenbrands to win more games, get more Shea Hillenbrands. Just win games. Then you'll sell tickets.
By the way, the Jays ticket sales people probably deserve some credit for this year. It cannot have been easy to sell tickets with the Season From Hell in the background.
Allow me to mention Miguel Tejada, Vladimir Guerrero, Manny Ramirez, Jim Edmonds and Gary Sheffield as big-money sluggers who haven't backfired on the teams that acquired them. If you're looking for low-risk, low-return investments, buy Canada Savings Bonds. If you're looking to build a championship team, take a freaking risk now and again.
And P.S. -- the Phillies are in the playoff hunt right to the last weekend, Thome and Billy Wagner notwithstanding.
He has mentioned the Jays could use a couple of more solid bats. I get the feeling if he had to decide between a 13 million dollar slugger or 2 solid hitters at 6.5 mil each, he would choose the 2nd option.
If this off-season's work consists of the second option, the Jays will finish third at best and that infamous B+ will be downgraded in a hurry.
AVG HR RBI
Shea Hillenbrand .291 18 82
League Average 3B .268 10 40
League Average 1B .278 14 50NFH, not sure where you're getting the league average numbers for 3B and 1B, and I'm quite sure the numbers you presented are not the best comparative metrics.
At BP's site, sorting 1B by EQA, and setting 200 outs as the threshold, Hillenbrand ranks 23rd. It is true that he's been the best hitter on the team, however (a) with a sub-800 OPS that's not saying much and (b) being a 1B/DH, he should be.
Hillenbrand and his ilk get you to .500, not beyond. Adding more players who hit like him would help, if they did so at less demanding positions. Adding more players like him who are at best the norm at their position won't be a huge help.
League Average 1B: .270/.342/.450 League Average 3B: .266/.329/.423 Shea Hillenbrand: .291/.343/.449
Yes, before someone points it out, that means Hillenbrand is an average first baseman. And "average" might or might not win championships, I'm not sure.
More Shea Hillenbrand types would improve this offense -- everyone here would take .290/.350/.450 from Alex Rios in a heartbeat, right? Hillenbrand is not the problem with this offense. Rios, Orlando Hudson (and at the moment, Russ Adams) are. Hinske is another below average hitter for his position, but is still the third or fourth best hitter on the team.
It's like the people who want to trade Wells for a Big Scary Bat. Why replace Wells when you could replace Rios? Or Hinske?
And while I'm here...
Toronto with RISP: .266/.338/.434, 0.41 RBI per AB
AL Average, RISP: .273/.348/.430, 0.39 RBI per AB
Best fielding play I've seen all year. The little flip-throw was so perfect that Peralta almost drops it, because he isn't expecting Belliard to hit him right in the glove.
First off, while Hudson may be below league average as a hitter, as a total package (offense + defense), I'd be willing to suggest he is further above the norm at his position than is Hillenbrand at his. Hudson, while obviously the poorer hitter of the two, is still the one who pushes you further above .500.
Secondly, I believe that it is what Hillenbrand represents more than the player himself that is the issue. Yes, Hillenbrand, at his best, figures to be about a league average 1B, and would only that the Jays had league average players at any of a number of positions this season.
But, if the team insists on developing young players (and I don't dispute the merits of that), they figure to get below-average performance from those players while they develop. The performances of the lowly paid, below-average Rios, Hill, Adams, Quiroz, Gross, etc. need to be offset by above-average performances by the higher paid players.
If those higher paid players are no better than league average, then the offense is going to struggle. Ignoring the logistics of who the Jays can acquire and who is readily available, the team needs to ideally target players at a much higher level than the Hillenbrands and Catalanottos of the world, now that the money is available.
Is a league-average 1B worth $4M to a team that spends only $50M and is content with .500? Absolutely. Is this still true for a team that spends $80M and is targetting 90 wins while concurrently developing players? I'm not so sure.
Schadenfreude is one of the ugliest emotions known to man. Except when it's at the minor sufferings of professional sports teams, in which case it's terrific. I'm not sure why I feel that way - maybe it's due to the inherent zero-sum nature of any sporting contest.
Not this time. Julio Franco, World Series MVP. This has to happen.
I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Delgado in a Mets uniform next season. The one thing he had in Toronto that he didn't get in Miami was a no-trade clause.
Aaron, I think you may be misinterpreting what these people are trying to say. I don't think anyone is suggesting that the Jays' problem is having Shea Hillenbrand. What I think they mean is that the Jays' problem is that their best hitter is Shea Hillenbrand.
There is nothing wrong with having a guy like Shea on the team, but on a contender, guys like him would be playing a "supporting role" instead of being in the #4 spot. Is that fair?
In Dave Bidini's book Baseballissimo there's a Chill Scene where he describes listening to the final innings of the 1993 Series while on tour with the Rheos, driving through (and stopping in) the Rocky Mountains. One of the best parts of the entire book.
He's the poster boy for the frustration I think I see people having with JP. That's why I think he gets slagged around here as much as he does.
As for the question of Manny's non-pecuniary extras, I'm reading Simmons new book and he talks about how there was a TV show in Boston documenting the Manny negotiations in 2001. After the money was done, Moorad approached the Sox to tell them that there was something else. I quote:
December 11: Moorad awakens to a morning phone call from Manny, who has a surprise annoucement: He's ready to accept Boston's offer, but only if they agree to hire (Cleveland clubhouse attendant) Frankie Mancini as well. There's comedy, there's high comedy, there's transcedent comedy, and then there's the moment when Moorad relays this request to his associates by phone and explains, "Frankie Mancini...he sets up the pitching machine for him...[realizes how ridiculous this is, starts giggling hysterically]...are you kidding me??? That's why he's Manny."