Batter's Box Interactive Magazine Batter's Box Interactive Magazine Batter's Box Interactive Magazine
Lenny Bruce is not afraid. Eye of a hurricane, listen to yourself churn -
world serves its own needs, don't misserve your own needs. Feed it up a knock,
speed, grunt no, strength no. Ladder structure clatter with fear of height,
down height. Wire in a fire, represent the seven games in a government for
hire and a combat site. Left her, wasn't coming in a hurry with the furies
breathing down your neck. Team by team reporters baffled, trump, tethered
crop. Look at that low plane! Fine then. Uh oh, overflow, population,
common group, but it'll do. Save yourself, serve yourself. World serves its
own needs, listen to your heart bleed. Tell me with the rapture and the
reverent in the right - right. You vitriolic, patriotic, slam, fight, bright
light, feeling pretty psyched.


The comeback falls short. Jays lose 6-5. The Jays now trail Tampa by 2.5 games with 7 games remaining. With a 9:15 curfew the game was close to ending in a tie which would have been quite the oddity.

Recaps:

* Jays' late rally falls short - Gagliano

Perhaps the Devil Rays are just using their home turf to exact some revenge on the rookie. They selected Bush with their fourth-round pick in the 2001 draft, though Bush declined to sign and returned to Wake Forest University. A year later, he signed with the Blue Jays after being taken in the (second) round.

* Blue Jays blown off course - Baker

(The game) only finished 39 minutes before the imposed curfew because of a leadoff walk issued in the ninth by Jays closer Miguel Batista to Midre Cummings. Batista threw away an ensuing bunt by Rocco Baldelli at first base for an error that moved the runners up and allowed Blum to atone for his fielding miscue with a one-out, game-clinching sacrifice fly.

Jays get out with a loss - Rutsey

David Bush, who two-hit the Rays over six innings in his previous start, came up with a lacklustre effort and was lifted by Gibbons after Bush gave up five runs in 3 2/3 innings.

"I didn't think he had much," Gibbons said of Bush. "He had trouble locating his fastball and trouble with lefties. It wasn't his night."


* Rays Win With Time to Spare - AP

Dewon Brazelton took a two-hitter into the eighth inning for Tampa Bay and Cummings hit his first major league homer in four years.


Notes:

* Jeanne throws a curve - Gagliano

The team wants to focus on Roy Halladay and his right shoulder. The reigning American League Cy Young Award winner pitched four innings against the Yankees on Tuesday after missing two months with fatigue in his pitching arm. The team doesn't want to do anything to disrupt his schedule, so Halladay and Ted Lilly will stay on schedule, while Chacin will wait until Wednesday to pitch his second big league game.

* Blue Jay Watch - Rutsey

In Friday's 4-2 loss, Jays right fielder Alex Rios made a perfect throw to third to catch the speedy Carl Crawford attempting to advance from second on a fly out.

It was the 11th outfield assist by Rios, which is tops on the team and tops among all rookies. Heading into last night's game against Tampa, Rios was in a six-way tie for second place in the league, one back of the 12 recorded by Detroit's Bobby Higginson.



* Elliot on Baseball - Elliot

The baseball hotbed of Venezuela has produced 159 major leaguers (as a point of reference Canada has produced 221). Luis Aparicio, Wilson Alvarez, Omar Daal and the redoubtable Willie Canate are all from Maracaibo.

Quiroz is the 15th Maracaibo resident to make the majors and Chacin is the 16th from the city of 1.2 million.


* Today Game: Cancelled, and will not be made up.
Sunday Roundup - That's great, it starts with an earthquake, birds and snakes, an aeroplane | 69 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
Named For Hank - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 09:05 AM EDT (#30932) #
It's almost the end of the season as we know it, and I feel fine.
_Frank - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 09:15 AM EDT (#30933) #
Well a comment came from Urooj about getting rid of everything from the Gord Ash era. Well lets get rid of the following, Roy Halladay, Vinnie Chulk, Brandon League, Bob File, Gustavo Chacin and in the future Dustin Mcgowan, Francisco Rosario. Also Guillermo Quiroz, Kevin Cash, Orlando Hudson, Alex Rios, Vernon Wells, Reed Johnson, Gabe Gross and possibly a host of others, just for the record.
Pistol - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 09:29 AM EDT (#30934) #
Kudos to Aaron for correctly identifying REM's 'End of the World As We Know It'.
_Mike Wilner - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 10:26 AM EDT (#30935) #
Just a friendly reminder, well - OK, a shameless plug - that even though there's no ballgame today, you can still listen to TBJTW this evening. Brian Butterfield will be on to discuss Russ Adams' and Eric Crozier's defense, and Crozier himself gets the "meet-the-new-guy" treatment.

By the way, you guys are a fine resource to catch up on what goes on in a ballgame (or four) when one is otherwise occupied. Too bad the High Holidays only cost me one Jays win.
_Braby - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 10:53 AM EDT (#30936) #
on the Fan?
_Braby - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 10:55 AM EDT (#30937) #
Does anyone know who will pitch on October 1st? Do you think there's anyway they'll Skip Tower's start to get Halladay, Chacin and Lilly all starts in the weekend finele.
_Mike Wilner - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:00 AM EDT (#30938) #
Yes, on the Fan at 7:05 Eastern, and on some stations along the network.
Pistol - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:45 AM EDT (#30939) #
It looks like Halladay, Lilly, Chacin, Towers, Bush, Halladay, Lilly for the final 7 games.
_Peter - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:51 AM EDT (#30940) #
Anyone got an update on the status of Preston Patton. Is it still possible the Jays will sign him? Haven't heard anything since the early summer reports that any signing would be delayed due to his foot injury.
_Ryan - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 03:13 PM EDT (#30941) #
Shouldn't that be Great Big Sea's "It's The End of the World As We Know It?"
_Ryan Lind - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 03:32 PM EDT (#30942) #
No, but it could be.
Joe - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 04:14 PM EDT (#30943) #
http://me.woot.net
After listening to GBS's version, the REM version sounds lethargic; as much as I prefer GBS's version, REM came up with it first.
Joe - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 04:16 PM EDT (#30944) #
http://me.woot.net
Canadian readers will be more familiar with End of the World from GBS's album "Play".
_Jobu - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 05:22 PM EDT (#30945) #
I guess there is a slight plus to the hockey lockout, the Fan should give alot more time to MLB playoffs.
_CaramonLS - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 05:28 PM EDT (#30946) #
Jobu - I want my Flames!!!

Coming off game 7 of a Stanley cup final after not making the playoffs for 7 years... I was soooo pumped (and hoping) the season would start.
_Jobu - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 05:40 PM EDT (#30947) #
Here's something to cheer you up:

Two years ago after becoming frustrated with the Leafs, I set out to choose a new favourite team using a completly objective view. I selected the Tampa Bay Lightning. And then at the start of last years season my friends and I entered into a pool where we each took a team we chose to win the Stanley Cup. We bet with our standard betting currency: Hamburger Combos. The pot was TEN hamburger combos, and when it came down to my pick and I proudly stated "The Lightning" I drew a few eye rolls and snickers. Even when I took out my lucky Tampa Bay Lightning Lighter (I dont smoke)to show them the trouble they were in they did not heed my warning. And now? Let's just say I'm such a pleasure delayer that I still have 2 combos due to me this fine offseason :)
Mike Green - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 05:44 PM EDT (#30948) #
Herewith your playoff race update in 30 seconds: The Cubs and Kerry Wood lost 3-2 to the Mets and Al Leiter. The Stros outlasted the Brew Crew 11-7. The Dodgers and Giants are tied at 3s in the 5th inning with Barry Bonds and Jayson Werth both having gone yard. Jeff Weaver's pitching for the Dodgers; Brett Tomko for the Giants. The Bosox were most unkind to Kevin Brown on his return from the broken left hand, demolishing the Bombers 11-4. The Rangers were shut out by Seattle 9-0 and the As and Angels play tonight on the Sunday night radio broadcast.
_Rob - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 06:06 PM EDT (#30949) #
NL West:
LA, SF -1.5, SD -4.5

NL Wildcard:
SF/CHC tied, HOU -1.5, SD -3

AL West:
OAK, ANA -2, TEX -2.5

Minnesota, New York, Boston, Atlanta, and St. Louis have wrapped up the other playoff spots -- not mathematically, but close enough. Standings are from ESPN, last updated at 5:56 ET.

Oakland @ Anaheim should be a good one tonight; and there are Fordin-like game previews from Urban (A's) and Miller (Angels). Being Sunday Night Baseball, it's carried on Sportsnet, so I plan to have this game somewhat fill the large void that two Blue Jays off-days in four days has created in my life.
_Grimlock - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 07:35 PM EDT (#30950) #
Jobu, so when are you going to become frustrated with the Blue Jays and abandon them like you did the Leafs? The idea of abandoning a team, no matter how crappy, is completely foreign to me Grimlock. Especially since the team has been a borderline contender and worth watching/supporting for the past five or six years (the longest such stretch in me Grimlock's lifetime.)
_CaramonLS - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 07:46 PM EDT (#30951) #
In fairness Grim, he said he got frusterated with them, not abandoned them because they were crappy.

Question: Was the last time the Leafs developed a decent player from a prospect.

Answer: Tomas Kaberle. Before that, Felix Potvin. (Antropov, Stajan, Ponakorski do NOT count since they have proven very very little over their "careers")

Yeah I would get frusterated with this team.
_Rob - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 07:51 PM EDT (#30952) #
Must...resist...urge...to join...Leafs-bashing.
_Smack - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 08:00 PM EDT (#30953) #
Drafting players is not the only way to improve a team. The leafs have been great at aquiring younger talent through trades. McCabe, Tucker, Berard, Berg. All came here through trades. Because of NHL regulations, players don't become unrestriced free agents until about their 30th birthday. So people complaining about the leafs inability to aquire young talent just don't know enough. With their perennial playoff contender status, they are not in a position to draft a sure-fire prospect, and there is a huge drop-off in talent from rounds 1,2 to rounds 3 and on. Now if only the lockout could last long enough to get the teachers pension fund out of there.
Pistol - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 08:09 PM EDT (#30954) #
I was just looking at Bush's last few starts. In his last 4 he has 22.3 innings, and just 6 Ks. In his other 66 innings he had 47 Ks.

Looks like he may be tiring down the stretch.
_Rob - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 08:25 PM EDT (#30955) #
Wow. I just saw the Oakland Athletics execute a sacrifice bunt in the first inning. Stranger things rarely happen.

Kotsay doubles.
McLemore bunts him over to third.
Chavez hits a sac fly, scoring Kotsay.
Joe Morgan is shocked, but adds that you have to manufacture runs to win. He says " manufacture runs" 13 times between the sac fly and the commercial after Durazo's subsequent strikeout.
_Loveshack - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 08:48 PM EDT (#30956) #
Question: Was the last time the Leafs developed a decent player from a prospect.

Answer: Tomas Kaberle. Before that, Felix Potvin. (Antropov, Stajan, Ponakorski do NOT count since they have proven very very little over their "careers")


I have to take issue with this. Not that the Leafs are a great team when it comes to drafting and developing players (because they're not), but you can't just completely ignore Danil Markov, Fred Modin, Sergei Berezin, Yannick Perrault, Kenny Jonsson, Alyn McCauley and Mike Johnson. Plus a few others that I can understand not making the cut (ie Yannik Tremblay & Dmitri Mironov).
_Rob - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 09:02 PM EDT (#30957) #
Jose Guillen news:

ESPN is reporting his locker has been cleaned out in the clubhouse. Announcement forthcoming in the fourth. No link at the moment, Dan Shulman just told me.
_Jobu - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 09:12 PM EDT (#30958) #
Perhaps I must clairfy, I did not expect to start such controversy. Firstly, I would never, ever abandon the Jays. They are the apple to the Leafs orange. Second, I did not completly abandon the team, I demoted them to my second favourite team. Thridly, my abandonment had alot more to do with the money loving yankee like organization that runs the leafs. I dont want to start a rant here, but my dislike of the organization is on many level and they no longer deserve my dollar even though I enjoy the players on the team.
_DGriebeling - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 09:15 PM EDT (#30959) #
Rotoworld posted this re: Jose Guillen, FYI

Angels suspended outfielder Jose Guillen for the rest of the season and the playoffs for inappropriate conduct following his removal from Saturday's game.
Guillen became animated after he was replaced by a pinch-runner Saturday, and things must have got very heated in the clubhouse after the game. The Angels are trying to suspend him without pay, so there's a good chance we'll see a grievance here. It also seems likely that the Angels will seek to trade him this winter. Guillen is in the middle of a two-year, $6 million contract with an option for 2006. Despite his attitude problems, the Angels will get decent value should they move him. With Guillen out, the team will probably use a platoon of Jeff DaVanon and Adam Riggs in left field for the rest of the season.
_DGriebeling - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 09:21 PM EDT (#30960) #
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=545&e=17&u=/ap/bbn_expos_orioles
COMN for a Yahoo article about O's possibly moving to the National League... sorry if someone posted something about this before, I didn't see anything similar...
_6-4-3 - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 09:21 PM EDT (#30961) #
That's Jose "I don't know how many ... times me and Vladdy (Guerrero) have gotten hit and I don't see any ... retaliation. I'm giving everything I've got, I'm playing hurt, I'm playing in pain, and I'm not getting any help from ... nobody." Guillen, in case you've forgotten.

Anaheim shouldn't be that worried. I'm sure Chone "Kruk's MVP" Figgins can step it up.
_Grimlock - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 10:05 PM EDT (#30962) #
Re: Jose Guillen. Anaheim's not making the playoffs anyway.

Me Grimlock feels strongly that there are no "second-favorites" in sports. Demoting a team, any team, to such status, is like relieving Cito Gaston of managing duties, but then offering him a roving hitting instructor job in the minors.

Yeah, they are a "money-loving Yankee like organization." But what's not to like about that? If the Jays operated more like the Yankees, we wouldn't be bemoaning the Season From Hell.
_Tassle - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 10:05 PM EDT (#30963) #
Wow, I wouldn't mind J.P. picking up Guillen, maybe straight up for Frank Catalanatto. He's cheap, he's productive and he either fills an outfield spot or a 1B/DH spot. And let's face it, at this point in time he's probably a better hitter than the Cat with less of an injury history.
_Rob - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 10:37 PM EDT (#30964) #
Tassle, I don't know about that. I would much rather have Cat over Guillen.

Career numbers:
Guillen: .274/.322/.443
Catalanotto: .296/.358/.457
Now, I realize you said "at this point in time", and Guillen has been smacking the ball in his peak now, at age 28. Cat has never played more than 133 games in a season -- although some of that may be thanks to Johnny Oates and Mike Lamb/Ricky Ledee -- and is out for the year.

But, come on. The Angels suspended this productive player when they need him most. He must be a real malcontent...
Maybe I'm in the minority, though. A question to all Bauxites:

Jose Guillen makes $3M next year, and has a $4M option for 2006.
Frank Catalanotto will make $2.7M both years, guaranteed.

Who would you rather see in the 2005 lineup, Cat or Guillen?
_6-4-3 - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 10:47 PM EDT (#30965) #
Cat. I was just looking up the numbers when you so kindly did it for me.

First and foremost, you'd be trading a guy that, like you said, "the Angels suspended when they needed him the most". That says a lot, as does his rant about his teammates not protecting him. Anaheim still has a chance of making the playoffs, and they dropped him. On the other side, the Cat is happy in Toronto, doesn't complain about the turf / weather / losing, etc, and is probably a good influence on other players.

Second, while Guillen would be a decent replacement option for Delgado, I doubt that he'd play first. He hasn't in his career. I find it hard to believe that the guy who blew up when he was replaced by a pinch runner would appreciate moving to first, especially since he's still in his peak years.

Third, the Jays don't need him. You can say that he'd be a good bat to partially replace Carlos, or that he'd surely be better than a Johnson / Gross platoon in left. But the Jays don't need him for next year, because winning isn't in the plan. If a team that's fighting for the playoffs in cruicial series against Oakland can say "we don't need your attitude", why can't the Jays say the same thing?

I have a feeling that Guillen in Toronto would be akin to Mondesi in Anaheim. It's unfair, probably, and he might turn things around, but the Jays really shouldn't spend the money to find out, when they have nothing to gain.
_Jobu - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:01 PM EDT (#30966) #
Well clearly the jays can not spend money like the leafs since they cant raise ticket prices to rediculous levels to keep the teachers union happy and every suit in town. Plus canceling the sick kids skate really soured me. As such they shall remain in second place. I don't find a thing wrong with having multiple favourite teams. How many people here like the Jays and ONLY the jays? I would think the vast majority has a second favourite team, probably the expos.
_6-4-3 - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:04 PM EDT (#30967) #
I don't really mind the "second favourite team" thing, either. I've followed the Mariners since Ichiro joined the team. A Mariners World Series win in 2001 wouldn't be as sweet as a Jays World Series win in 2008, that's for sure. But they're still fun to follow, I try to see them when they come to Toronto, etc. So long as the second team isn't a direct rival (IE: cheering for Toronto / Ottawa in hockey, or Toronto and New York in baseball), then what's the problem?
_greenfrog - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:06 PM EDT (#30968) #
Great race in the AL West (especially after Anaheim beat Oakland tonight):

1. Oakland
2. Anaheim 1 GB
3. Texas 2 GB
_Braby - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:12 PM EDT (#30969) #
I like the Jays and just the Jays.
_Rob - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:19 PM EDT (#30970) #
Well clearly the jays can not spend money like the leafs since they cant raise ticket prices to rediculous levels to keep the teachers union happy

They would do that even if the Ontario Teachers’ Pension Plan didn't "own" MLSE. The Leafs are evil, no need to bash teachers any more than they already have been in this province.

Nothing against Jobu himself, of course, but with a teacher in the family, I really got tired of elementary teachers being "a huge problem" in Ontario. I do understand that it sucks when a company owns a team, but they are trying to make money. Rogers annoys me sometimes, but I understand he/the company wants to turn a profit.

Plus canceling the sick kids skate really soured me.

No kidding. If they didn't have the money to put it on, why give Bryan "Hip Check" McCabe a raise?

I can get with the multiple favourite teams thing. I like the Jays, Cards, and A's -- although the Jays are far above the rest, it's not even close.
_Matthew E - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:19 PM EDT (#30971) #
How many people here like the Jays and ONLY the jays? I would think the vast majority has a second favourite team, probably the expos.

Me. I have other teams that I sort of like (Expos, Twins, sometimes others), but I don't put any effort into following them; it's just a sort of passive affection.
Pistol - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:24 PM EDT (#30972) #
Oakland has 4 against Seattle and 3 against Anaheim
Anaheim has 4 against at Texas and 3 at Oakland
Texas has 4 against Anaheim and 3 at Seattle

Given that Oakland has a 1 game lead, has all home games, and Anaheim and Texas have 4 games against each other I would think the A's are the favorite.
Pistol - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:29 PM EDT (#30973) #
How many people here like the Jays and ONLY the jays? I would think the vast majority has a second favourite team, probably the expos.

I find that because of my hatred for the Yankees I pull for the A's and the Red Sox, but I wouldn't say I have that much of a passion for them. It's not like I visit Athletic Nation or SOSH or anything like that.

I like to pull for SF too because of the Bonds backlash, but that's even less than Boston and Oakland.
_Keith Talent - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:30 PM EDT (#30974) #
I've always had a soft spot for the Mets because they are such the antithesis of the Yankees. The Mets are oh-so-human. I just fell in love with that 1999 team under Bobby Valentine that battled the Braves in the Division Series. I used to be a bit of a Mariners fan back when they had Harold Reynolds, Alvin Davis, Edgar, Mark Langston playing for them - because they were so damn unappreciated. These days I like watching the Angels on TV; I really hope they make it to the playoffs, they're so much more interesting than the A's. I think their lineup is better too, even without Guillen (he's a snake, trust me, you don't want him anywhere near your team).
Pistol - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:31 PM EDT (#30975) #
Continuing my random posts........

The Jays are 38-40 at home (after that horrible start) and 26-50 on the road.
Pistol - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:33 PM EDT (#30976) #
You know, I knew Arizona was bad, but I didn't realize they already had *109* losses.

Or said another way, they're 18 games worse than the Season From Hell.
_Keith Talent - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:37 PM EDT (#30977) #
I HATE THE CUBS.

I need to add that. I hate their fans. I hate the pseudo-intellectuals who pretend to be baseball fans whenever the Cubs make the post-season; claiming they're interested in "history". I hate the WGN addicts who think Harry Caray was just swell, and who get moist when a little fan is taunted to "throw it back". I hate that damn cute rickety-shack ballpark they play in. I LOATHE SAMMY SOSA. He's a cheater: pure and simple. Corked bat. Steroids. Who knows what else? They guy's walking around the DR with tote bags filled with thousands of dollars, and losing them (what's he into?). And Cubs fan buy right into Sosa's "nice guy" routine and love his sprint to the outfield and that infernal bunny hop he does after a homerun (or near homeruns that cause him to be thrown out at second). Sosa's a massive baby and a cheat. And now they've added Nomar to that mess. And Moises Alou is the biggest grump I've ever seen on a baseball field.
_Jobu - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:37 PM EDT (#30978) #
Sorry Rob, didnt mean to bash the teacher's themselves, my mom is an elementary school teacher, just talking about all the "interests" involved in the Leafs to make it a big heartless corporation instead of just a rich guy with a passion for the team.

The expos are my other favourable baseball team, but i dont follow them with a passion like I do the Jays, just hope they do well.
_Keith Talent - Sunday, September 26 2004 @ 11:42 PM EDT (#30979) #
more with the Cubs: I failed to mention the ignoramus they have managing them. You know the one who gives "winning" World Series souveniers to Giant pitchers in the 6th inning. The one who turend the Giants dugout into a daycare centre in Game 7 (which I swear dulled the Giants and was enough to give the full-grown Angels dugout the edge). What kind of moron thinks a 3 year-old will get anything out of sitting in a Major League dugout anyway? They don't have the attention span for that! What they hell will they remember from that? Stupid, stupid, stupid. Swallow a toothpick stupid.
Mike D - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 12:33 AM EDT (#30980) #
Plus canceling the sick kids skate really soured me

The Leafs are evil

This was a predictable public-relations bungle by the Leafs, but it's a situation that was considerably spun and oversimplified by the media.

Ken Dryden was so frustrated with cost overruns and overcharging by service providers surrounding the Sick Kids skate that he announced that rather than the Leafs giving cents on the dollar to the hospital, they would take all the money that they would've spent on the skate and donate 100% of it directly to Sick Kids. It was a solution that was well-intentioned and probably would have been more useful to the hospital, although admittedly less community-oriented.

So of course, the Star screamed "Heartless Leafs Cancel Sick Kids Skate," and after the team reversed course and reinstated the skate, it was "Heartless Leafs Only Hold Sick Kids Skate After Public Pressure Overwhelming."

But nuance seldom matters to the bash-then-cackle style of Messrs. Cox et al.
_Rob - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 12:38 AM EDT (#30981) #
No need to apologize, Jobu. It was directed towards a certain former government, which I shouldn't have gotten into here. I don't like how the OTPP owns the Leafs (or any corporation/business owning a team), but I understand they have a duty to their shareholders to turn a profit.

it's a situation that was considerably spun and oversimplified by the media.

Sometimes I forget that the Leafs are just as slammed by the Star as the Jays are. If I were a Leafs fan, I would feel the same way as I do for every stupid column I read on ex-scouts or "Moneyball sucks." Thanks for reminding me that the Leafs don't have friends at 1 Yonge either, Mike.

But you have to think: is it better for the kids to have the team write a check or let them goof around on the ice with Sundin and Domi for an hour?

**

I would like to see the A's do well, just to shut up the "Yeah, but Beane doesn't have a ring" faction.

I hate the Cubs, for all the reasons Keith mentioned above, plus Dusty's treatment of Prior.
_Rob - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 12:46 AM EDT (#30982) #
the Star screamed "Heartless Leafs Cancel Sick Kids Skate,"

That's probably an exaggeration, but we should really find out who writes the headlines there. They've got something against the Jays, and the Leafs, I'm sure.

(I don't get the Star, I only read it via the links provided in the Jays Roundup.)
Mike D - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 01:10 AM EDT (#30983) #
I've got to admit my error, although the tenor was similar in the Star; it was The Sun that ran the headline I remembered.
_Ben - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 01:13 AM EDT (#30984) #
Leafs rule, Jays rule(next year), and all Cincy teams expect for the Bengals rule. Yankees suck.
_Rob - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 01:20 AM EDT (#30985) #
Wow, Steve Simmons really likes one-sentence paragraphs.
_Jobu - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 01:29 AM EDT (#30986) #
yeah, what was up with that Dusty Baker's kid on the field thing? I don't remember much. Something about his kid being a bat boy and then going to pick up a bat in the box when a runner on third was charging home and getting yanked outta there by his collar...or something. Anyone remember?
_A - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 01:33 AM EDT (#30987) #
I don't like how the OTPP owns the Leafs

The OTPP, which I benefit from because my dad too happens to be an elementary school teacher, has some very interesting investments in its portfolio. They have a whole pile of stock locked away in Fairview -- a large developer who owns large chuncks of several shopping malls (including Eaton's Centre, Fairview Mall & Yorkdale). It's just curious that they teach young minds and then profit tremendously when those minds kick and scream until mommy, daddy or guardian finally give in and buy that hugely expensive toy...Rick Mercer did a skit on this about a year ago (absolutely hilarious) and included something about OTPP owning stock in a tobacco company -- no idea if this is true but he did go over the MLSE and Fairview investments so at least part of the story was based in fact. Anyone know whether the tobacco company part is true?

Though I am perturbed by the selection of investments the OTPP has made, I agree whole-heartedly with Rob re teachers getting shafted on the PR side of things because of the portrait painted by that former gov't now known as the Official Opposition.

Back when I was in high school I worked with the Campaign for Public Education (coalition of parents, students, teachers, support staff, organized labour & some of the more progressive trustees). With that hopefully demonstrating my support for teachers/support staff and quality public education generally, I submit that OSSTF, ETF & CUPE are doing their members a dis-service by not changing their game plans based on the government in power.

McGuinty called himself the Education Premier (among other things) during the election campaign and has yet to prove it. But by no means does labour find itself in the same hostile war that it was forced into during the Common Sense Revolution. However, the unions (especially CUPE 4400) continue to throw demands and threats into the public without realizing the reprocussions PR-wise. This will inevitably lead to little community support, which translates into a government feeling only minescule pressure to bargain seriously.

As a concequence to their current tactics (beyond the fact that they'll lose on most of their demands), teacher bashing occurs, making me feel it necessary to jump in the middle with a rant of my own.

If organized labour would just see its role more holistically and advocate all year 'round for things particularly important to parents and the wider community instead of just every other Fall when a contract comes up just throwing out a threat, this problem would, for the most part, be solved.

PS...Glad I'm writing this at 1:30 am or I'd feel bad for disrupting a lively thread. I swear it wasn't supposed to be this long when I started.
_Fozzy - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 01:36 AM EDT (#30988) #
http://www.otpp.com/web/website.nsf/web/majorinvestments
COMN for a list of what the OTPP is mostly invested in
_Rob - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 01:46 AM EDT (#30989) #
Rick Mercer did a skit on this about a year ago (absolutely hilarious) and included something about OTPP owning stock in a tobacco company

All true. Very funny, too:
"Wanna skip school? Go to the mall -- oh wait, they own a mall company. So you go outside the mall and smoke -- oh wait, they own a tobacco company! So you're screwed! They're always with you!"

Looking at Fozzy's list:
Pfizer Inc. -- well, I don't think Viagra applies to teenagers, but youneverknow.
_Jobu - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 01:46 AM EDT (#30990) #
I love some of the tangents Da Box can take at night like this. Really, I do. Sorry if that sounded sarcastic.

Sparky has been intentionaly walked 114 times less than Barry Bonds this year.
_Rob - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 01:47 AM EDT (#30991) #
Great, now any Google search for "rick mercer viagra" will return this site. My apologies to the Cabal, which the OTPP has 240 shares in, I see.
_A - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 02:06 AM EDT (#30992) #
Happy to provide the entertainment, Jobu. As you can tell, that was some pent up rage -- its been stirring on the front burner since about the last week in August. (And it's not just me, key parent organizations that have been backing the unions heavily are now challenging them publicly to change their strategy).

I'm seriously done this rant...Now.

I don't think Viagra applies to teenagers, but youneverknow

There was an article on the front page of the Globe not too long ago that talked of recreational use of Viagra. The rep. from Toronto Men's Health Network who attests to the advantages of recreational use is under 24 so it wouldn't be *that* shocking if there's a small underground scene that includes some teens. Though if anyone had asked me about recreational use of Viagra for anyone before I read that article, I'd have had a good, hearty laugh.
_Jobu - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 02:31 AM EDT (#30993) #
Middle of a playoff race, arguably one of the better bats in the lineup benched. Methinks Anaheim sportstalk radio is keeping themselves nicely busy.
_dp - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 02:40 AM EDT (#30994) #
The "new" (like, 2 years ago) hipster drug cocktail (no pun intended) is viagra and E. A match made in heaven.
_Jobu - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 02:56 AM EDT (#30995) #
field of dreams just finished on Bravo. Man what an awesome movie.
_Rob - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 03:07 AM EDT (#30996) #
Man what an awesome movie.

I agree. Great movie. However, everytime Costner's daughter falls off the bleachers, I keep thinking it's really cruel. I don't know why...

**

Does it seem to anyone else like the Jays haven't played in weeks?

**
Sorry, Jobu, I'm finally giving into sleep and you're on your own until morning. Before I crash, I will tell you how much I am enjoying MVP, despite my 2-14 record. So thanks for the sales pitch - maybe you can get a job at EA and make sure Sparky's stats are all 100's for 2005. ;)
_CaramonLS - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 03:15 AM EDT (#30997) #
Loveshack the players you listed the leafs definately didn't develop... they shipped them off right before they actually did something meaningful in their NHL careers.

Berezin - I am not even going to comment on because no one even bothered to offer him a contract... good job developing this one way threat.

Modin, Johnson (ok MAYBE him), Mcaulay, Jonsson really did nothing in their careers with the laffs, they actually blossomed with their other teams (which makes you wonder about the internal structure of treating/developing young players.)

Tucker played a much bigger role in Tampa than he ever has in Toronto, just the media hypes that up a LOT.

Berard well I guess I'll hand that one to you for aquiring young talent, but you made a deal with "mad mike" which doesn't say much.
_Jobu - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 03:16 AM EDT (#30998) #
Yeah, think I'll call it a night too. Maybe I'll have that wonderful dream again where I go to the ballpark early and Sparky actually makes eye contact with me. Night all.
Pistol - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 08:44 AM EDT (#30999) #
yeah, what was up with that Dusty Baker's kid on the field thing? I don't remember much. Something about his kid being a bat boy and then going to pick up a bat in the box when a runner on third was charging home and getting yanked outta there by his collar...or something. Anyone remember?

That's pretty much it.
_Loveshack - Monday, September 27 2004 @ 12:39 PM EDT (#31000) #
Loveshack the players you listed the leafs definately didn't develop... they shipped them off right before they actually did something meaningful in their NHL careers.

The problem we run into here is the word "meaningful". What is the definition of meaningful? The Leafs made the conference finals with these guys playing major roles on the team. All of these players made their debut with Toronto and most played multiple seasons here. Berezin had a 37 goal season. But because the Leafs have money they were able to trade them for more "established" talent. Does that make them bad at developing players? Not exactly, it just means they dont have to. Anyway I could go on but this discussion is a day old now and this is a Jays site not a Leafs site so I'll just leave it at that.
Sunday Roundup - That's great, it starts with an earthquake, birds and snakes, an aeroplane | 69 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.