Peter Schilling is my favourite one-hit wonder of all time. Thanks, Mike.

This isn't very scientific, but is it that the sound waves from the blast travel so fast (while the speed of sound is relatively slow compared to light and others, it's still pretty fast-like 750mph or something close to there) that our ears and brain are only able to process one sound?

Another one-hit song that is firmly embedded in my hindbrain is Scott B. Sympathy (Drinking With The Poet) -- or how about School of Fish (Three Strange Days)?

Has anyone else taken heart in the fact that Jon Leiber's replacement in the Yankee rotation is likely going to be Donovon Osborne? Hee hee.

Sounds right to me Dr.Zarco. We probably here the first bunch of sound waves as one sound. Our ears probably cant distinguish them seperately.

For some reason, my earlier post didn't post.

The series of waves are the sound. One wave does not a sound make.

"That's a positive sign,'' he said. "The group that, to us, represents the highest revenue to our club is the season ticket holders. And about 800 of them opted to renew early to get the jersey.''

Well that's fuzzy login. I guess he's never heard of the old business theory stating, if you offer something free, people won't turn it down.

The uniforms are horrible! Any idea what type of petition/protest could be done to change this?

I'll explain a bit further. The "sound" you hear is created by a pressure wave in the medium through which the sound is heard (air, unless you're underwater or something) impinging the eardrum. The wave (remember, the wave is the series of ripples, not just the ripples themselves) creates a vibration in the eardrum, which we hear as sound. The higher the amplitude of the wave, the louder the sound we hear, and the pitch of the sound is determined by the frequency of the wave.

By the way, the Primer season preview for the Blue Jays is up.

It pains me to say this about a baseball legend (Ron is an amazing analyst who did some very original work in the past) but I thought the preview was a bit weak, without thorough analysis.

Has anyone else taken heart in the fact that Jon Leiber's replacement in the Yankee rotation is likely going to be Donovon Osborne? Hee hee.

I just don't get the playa-hatin' being heaped on Osborne. He's not Tom Glavine, but he's not Charlie Puleo, either.

As much as I liked the Leiber signing last year -- good, low/no-risk gamble -- he and Osborne are essentially the same guy, except Osborne is a lefty, something the Yankees currently sorely lack.

Their career ERA+ is similar; the main difference is Leiber's (quite frankly, flukey) 20-win season. Their #1 comps at baseball-reference.com should be familiar to Jay fans: John Cerutti (Osborne) and Erik Hanson (Leiber).

Either is a decent fourth or fifth starter.

Craig B,

WRT Primer's Blue Jays piece, it was almost unreadable in parts.

Let's face it.
Every logo and every uniform the Jays have ever worn have been atrocious.

The Primer article was disappointing. I found the use of ZR, rather than UZR or defensive Win Shares or some other current defensive metric, unusual. For instance, the author lists the BJ left fielders' as having the highest ZR in the league last year. All of the current defensive metrics have them as below average.

I hate the grey, although the logo is not too bad. The numbering on the back of the jerseys is OK.

I wonder if all the wall padding at SkyDome will be grey to match .

Soon, we will be hearing Murray Eldon saying "Ladies and Gentlemen, your Toronto Grey Jays"! Sounds like an oldtimers team.

Bring back the uniforms of 1989-1996, those were my favorite.

I like the new logo. I just hate most of the color choices for the uniform. I just got a new logo T-shirt for my birthday and its black! There are far too many teams with black unis, the Jays could have gone no darker than navy blue.

As for leaving out the maple leaf, I don't like it but I think they want the brand to have a wider appeal. Marketing must have loved it when 50 Cent wore a blue jays hat on SNL.

By the way, the Primer season preview for the Blue Jays is up.

Is the preview good?

Seems a little optimistic to me. I'd bet against it.

http://bluejayscheerclub.com
I for one did not like the new logo at first. However, I warmed to it rapidly.

1) It looks good on the hat.

2) It's simple. (Let's face it, the T-bird logo was like a bunch of ideas that smashed into each other on the highway.)

3) It has some spark and life and movement to it, and looks a little predatory.

I haven't yet seen a home jersey in action on a player, so I'll reserve judgement on those. The batting practice jerseys we've seen in the Spring Training highlights have looked fine to me, though I can't say that I'm in love with the font for the numbers on the back. I'm big on the split letters that we've had forever, probably just because we've had them forever.

While I prefer having some kind of vivid, bright colour in the logo and team colours, I think that the new colour scheme goes well and is quite classy.

Personally, I think a lot of the resistance to the new look is just good old resistance to change. People don't like it when things are different. I understand that -- I almost had a fit when Kodak changed the base on Tri-X. But now that I've tried the new version of the film, I'm quite happy with it.

Besides, the new jersey and logo will not erase the history of the team or of the old logos or jerseys. They will live on forever in photographs and videos of the old teams.

On a related note, while cleaning out a closet at my parents' house, I found a Blue Jays mesh-backed hat that I purchased at a game in 1985, when I was ten years old. I never really wore it because I was disappointed in the shape of it -- it wasn't broken in, and I suppose that I wasn't willing to put the effort into breaking it in. So I have an absolutely mint, unbroken-in 1985 Jays hat.

I've been tempted to break it in and wear it, but is that wrong? I don't really have a collector's mentality, but this seems like something awfully special.

http://bluejayscheerclub.com
coliver, my wife found an '89 dark blue Sunday jersey at Value Village for $5 a couple of months ago. The stitching was coming undone around the neck, but I fixed that in about 30 seconds.

Break it in. You'll be the mack and what better way to celebrate something special. I used to have an old Orioles hat that I loved. I traded for it with a kid for a new UNLV hat or whoever was popular at that time. Eventually I wore it out, the white front panel got oil on it, the strap broke but it was good times while it lasted.

http://economics.about.com
Bring back the uniforms of 1989-1996

I couldn't disagree more.

The Jays are getting absolutely killed in the 18-35 demographic. You go to a game, and it's nothing but grandparents and grandkids. It's great that they're attending, but the Jays need to attract from all age groups if they're ever going to be more than an afterthought in the Toronto market.

The reason why people in that age bracket no longer attend is because the Jays are considered an expired fad, like pogs and Creepy Crawlers. To them, the Jays are something they used to follow in Grade 4 while they sang along to New Kids on the Block songs.

The further the Jays can distance themselves from this era, the easier time they'll have winning back old fans. While the new unis aren't spectacular, they're a step in the right direction.

Cheers,

Mike

Charlie Puleo was orginally with the Jays, signed as an undrafted free agent out of Seton Hall U by the rec of Rick Cerone the catcher and Puleo's buddy.

Mike: we can agree to disagree, but when the Yankees were struggling in the late 60's I guess you would have changed their colors and logo to appeal to the hippie demographic .

Named For Hank: Cool, although I never really warmed up to the weekend tops of the mid 90s. I did purchased two Jimy Kelly game issued tops (1988 and 1989) last summer. Guess they will be my link to the good ol'days.

Here's an article about Syracuse pitching coach Brad Arnsberg, from the Sun-Sentinel of Fort Lauderdale, Florida.

Mike: we can agree to disagree, but when the Yankees were struggling in the late 60's I guess you would have changed their colors and logo to appeal to the hippie demographic .

Well, the Jays don't have quite the tradition of the Yankees.

Plus, the hippie demographic did see lots of new colors in those uniforms, even if it wasn't really there.

What would be so wrong if the team developed a classic style uniform as opposed to selling out to some edgy hip design, put together through market analysis? Look at what merchandise sells the best - classic uniforms. It's not just a popularity thing with the Yankees, and Red Sox. The Cards, O's, Giants, etc., sell a tonne of stuff. Compare that to the sales of the team that closest resembles the new stylings of the Jays, the Rays.

And besides, wouldn't it be nice to cater to real baseball fans who respect the history of game to make a classic style uniform, instead of making us ill each time we see the new uniform?

http://economics.about.com
Mike: we can agree to disagree, but when the Yankees were struggling in the late 60's I guess you would have changed their colors and logo to appeal to the hippie demographic.

A 35 year run of success is not a "fad". The Jays don't have that longevity of tradition to fall back on, so it's a pretty lousy comparison.

How else are the Jays supposed to replace the fad and the "been there, done there" stigma that permeates through the GTA?

Cheers,

Mike

What would be so wrong if the team developed a classic style uniform as opposed to selling out to some edgy hip design, put together through market analysis?

You took the words right out of my mouth, Acker.
Moffatt - if you want to talks 'trendy with the youth-set', nothing is trendier than 'throwback' right now. I think the psuedo-futuristic look is about the biggest blunder possible when marketing to kids/teens.

I honestly do not recall using the word "fad". Also, I think comparing the success achieved by Beeston/Gillick regime to pogs, Creepy Crawlers, and New Kids on The Block to be a bit insulting.

The Cards, O's, Giants, etc., sell a tonne of stuff. Compare that to the sales of the team that closest resembles the new stylings of the Jays, the Rays.

Isn't that like comparing apples and oranges? You're basing the popularity of the team and merchandise of team's more than a century old versus that of one created in the '90s simply based on their jerseys. Just because you create a 'classic' jersey doesn't mean you can create the tradition and national popularity behind it.

And besides, wouldn't it be nice to cater to real baseball fans who respect the history of game to make a classic style uniform, instead of making us ill each time we see the new uniform?

While it's a nice thought, the fact is, like Mike M. said, doing such a thing would definitely hinder the drive to put new butts in the seats at Skydome. That would seem like a basic point of business; don't try to completely alienate your old fans, but also strive to bring in new ones. And besides, that's what classic retro days are for. While it's nice to live in memories or glory days past, I for one am much happier seeing this team more forward and try to create some new glory days.

Give the uniforms some time, I'm sure they'll grow on you. If not, you can always throw on your old jersey and think about the better times. If people truly hate them as much as you think they will, they will be changed.

Creating some tradition as far as uniforms would be a very good thing for the Jays, lets stick with something for awhile, the right something, rather than jump around. One of the great things about the Yankees is that everyone knows the Yankee logo & pinstripes. I can live with the current uniform, if only I could find some hats and stuff with the new logo in southern Alberta. Has anyone seen anything in Calgary yet? Just another reason to be pissed @ JP for moving the farm team to Pulaski from Medicine Hat. Try explain economics & geography to a six year old when telling him we can no longer go watch "The Jays" at The Hat.

http://bluejayscheerclub.com
Jim -- I was actually a little surprised that they didn't try to make a more "classic" looking jersey, more along the lines of the All-Star batting practice jerseys last year (which I really liked...what did you think of them? If jerseys weren't so damn expensive or if I was richer I'd have a closet filled with them, especially an All-Star Vernon Wells jersey).

That said, I think the J logo is a good stab at making a simple, traditional letter-logo, like the Boston B, the New York intertwined NYY, etc. And I really do think that the stylized "JAYS" and J logo look much better when you see the embroidered real thing -- it looks a little dead on the letterhead etc without the snap of the silver thread.

Two things I wanted to address about the jerseys:

1) Jays vs. Blue Jays. It's not just the D-Rays who've gone to just RAYS on their jerseys...I can think of a Sox team that hasn't mentioned their sock colour on their jerseys for a while.

2) Ugly, "modern" logos that find themselves dated quickly: the Yankees still put that godawful top hat and baseball bat logo on all kinds of merchandise. Ick! When was it created? During their slide?

"Just because you create a 'classic' jersey doesn't mean you can create the tradition and national popularity behind it."

(how on earth to you italicize a quote??)

Nor do gimmicky ideas aimed at the marginal fan. Ideas like these uniforms, in game hosts, andin game entertainment that deals with everything but baseball are just examples of how to distract to marginal baseball fan from the game they are at to make it more enjoyable for them. So basically the Jays marketing idea is to make people enjoy their time at the game, but make them like it for reasons other than the game they are at, and the sport.

Nice way to build a fan base

http://economics.about.com
I honestly do not recall using the word "fad". Also, I think comparing the success achieved by Beeston/Gillick regime to pogs, Creepy Crawlers, and New Kids on The Block to be a bit insulting.

I'm talking about perception, not reality. It doesn't matter whether that perception is fair or unfair or even "insulting". It exists, and it's a real problem for the Jays.

Moffatt - if you want to talks 'trendy with the youth-set', nothing is trendier than 'throwback' right now. I think the psuedo-futuristic look is about the biggest blunder possible when marketing to kids/teens.

Well, the new unis aren't perfect, but they're better. I agree, the Jays could have done better, but what they got wasn't bad. Before the new unis were introduced I was advocating a 70's inspired jersey, but updated for the times. I think this would have done a lot better than the current unis. The new home uniform is really quite nice. The road one not so much, but I don't see why it should make anyone be "violent ill".

Cheers,

Mike

Compare that to the sales of the team that closest resembles the new stylings of the Jays, the Rays.

Think about that statement for a second. Do you think the uniforms are the reason the Rays are unpopular? I'd say there's a much more obvious reason.

The reason that the Giants, Yankees, and Red Sox, and even the Orioles, have such popular classic designs is because the teams were actually around in the good old days, and have a fan base that's built up for decades.

They Blue Jays potantial fans need reasons to want to come to the games. The Yankees hardly have that problem. I mean, I love retro jerseys myself, simple ones that look straight out of the '20s, but how can you expect to recreate the '20s with a team that didn't even exist at the time?

Overall, i think I like the new look. I'm a little torn, but dark and flashy is more up my aisle style-wise.

I agree the Primer preview is a bit weak, unfortunately. Still better than what you'd get in most off-the-shelf magazines, but from Primer we could have had something better. Ron appears to have confused Trever and Justin Miller, to name one mistake, and he also talks about Gomez potentially not making the team. I hadn't heard anything about that, and I'd be suprised if that happened given his guaranteed contract.

I was a big fan of the 97-01 jerseys, and although I see maybe why we had to make some change from the original logo, I'm not sure why we had to then move on from the second logo and jersey set.

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam040325/nhl_tor1-sun.html
Did anyone see this article in the Toronto Sun today (COMN)? specifically the first two sentences:

They've fumbled the President's Trophy for first overall.

The Eastern Conference crown likely went south with the 7-2 loss Tuesday to the Tampa Bay Devil Rays.

Apparently, the Rays' dominance of Toronto even extends to our baseball team!!

Oops..make that 'our hockey team'

Ideas like these uniforms, in game hosts, andin game entertainment that deals with everything but baseball are just examples of how to distract to marginal baseball fan from the game they are at to make it more enjoyable for them.

But that approach is completely from the mould of the traditional, hardcore fan.

What the Jays are trying to do, and I think rightly so, is sell the package of the Jays as a whole. A good team only goes so far, it's a combination of all of the details that can cover up the faults of things like the Skydome and the food.

Marginal, or casual fans will never be interested in the game to the degree that a Bauxite is. That said, the Jays have to be able to keep their interest during: a) rough losing skids, and b) when they're doing things other than playing. By 'distracting' them, as you have said, you can cover up any deficiencies and hopefully hold onto their mtv-attention span long enough to convert them to more hardcore fans, especially in a city where the maple leaf is king (boo!). The other option is to rely strictly on the in-field game, and as we can see from the attendance, that just doesn't cut it.

And btw, to italicize, use < i > at the start of the tag, and < /i > at the end (just remove the spaces between the brackets); you can do bold by changing the i's to b's.

"The reason that the Giants, Yankees, and Red Sox, and even the Orioles, have such popular classic designs is because the teams were actually around in the good old days, and have a fan base that's built up for decades."

Explain the sales of Angels apperral after they switched 3 years ago? At that point, they had no world series victories, and a weak fan base being the doormat for the Dodgers is So Cal.

It is important to remember that retro jerseys are not necessarily the ones the team plays in.

I have recently seen a few Padres unis with the Swinging Friar and god awful Astros shirts. You can still buy classic Jays wear. I saw some lovely hats from the early days for 30 bucks.

Finally, haven't the Jays had 7 or so uniforms? So, how is it possible to have a classic uniform. Make up a pinstripe outfit for the 2005 season? We can go with the J logo but Texas already beat us to the T.

I just don't get the playa-hatin' being heaped on Osborne. He's not Tom Glavine, but he's not Charlie Puleo, either.

I don't hate Osborne, I love him for being the soft underbelly of the fire-breathing dragon. You're kidding yourself with your comps, Mick... Donovan has pitched 16 innings in the past 4 years. Not just 16 innings in the Majors, 16 innings period, and he wasn't exactly star quality when he was playing regularly. He's gonna get pasted and I'm gonna love every booming hit of it.

The Jays are getting absolutely killed in the 18-35 demographic.

You mean like the majority of Bauxites?

How else are the Jays supposed to replace the fad and the "been there, done there" stigma that permeates through the GTA?

Maybe they should bring in a clever management team and hope that a grass-roots movement catches fire...

http://economics.about.com
The Jays are getting absolutely killed in the 18-35 demographic.

You mean like the majority of Bauxites?

That's precisely what I mean! I think that's why we have such a sense of community, because there's not a whole lot of us left.

Cheers,

Mike

I can't imagine how ANY casual fan would be interested in any of the crap they throw at us. I'm not 100% against in-game entertainment, but the brains over in the marketing department sure don't seem to be giving us anything ENJOYABLE.

Marginal, or casual fans will never be interested in the game to the degree that a Bauxite is. That said, the Jays have to be able to keep their interest

Dead wrong, and this will only lead the jays into the popularity cylce that they're at the bottom of now. The idea should be to make people baseball fans, not just Jays fans. Multiple in game highlights from around the league, scoreboard updates that don't just let you know when a HR has been hit, more stats, and other baseball related items help make the fan more apart of the game, the sport, and the league. If you focus on increasing the fans for the game as opposed to creating fans for the Jays, you increase the liklihood that people will come to the Dome to see a ballgame, not just your team, and this helps when your team isn't winning.

Also, the marketing strategy they've adopted may actually marginaize true fans to the point that they don't feel welcome in the Dome or can't stomach sitting through the nonsense that's forced onto them

I think Jim Acker and I need to go have a beer and complain about the world - we're definitely on the same page here, pal!

Grand funk, i can't beleive that aren't more people with the same opinion here off all place's!

http://bluejayscheerclub.com
Also, the marketing strategy they've adopted may actually marginaize true fans to the point that they don't feel welcome in the Dome or can't stomach sitting through the nonsense that's forced onto them

Well, here's where the Cheer Club comes in. I feel it is my duty as a screamin' hardcore Blue Jays fan to make the 'Dome a more palatable place for baseball, where they won't need all that goofiness between innings because we, the fans, are keeping it loud and interesting.

And that's why I need your help.

Join the Blue Jays Cheer Club (click on my name). Come out, make noise. The Jays need us.

Also, the marketing strategy they've adopted may actually marginaize true fans to the point that they don't feel welcome in the Dome or can't stomach sitting through the nonsense that's forced onto them.

if this is the case would they really have been true fans?

if this is the case would they really have been true fans?

Trust me, it is. I go to about 20+ games per year.
Each and every time I'm sitting in the Dome, watching some dumbass trying to catch a pop-fly to win pizza, or watching some stupid delivery truck race on the screen, or some other 'entertainment' where they turn the volume to 11, I ponder writing a nasty letter and boycotting future games, simply because I feel like my head is going to explode, and the game is the second priority.
However, my acute laziness has prevented me from doing so thus far.

if this is the case would they really have been true fans?

When was the last time a true fan went to game to see break dancers on the dugout or talk to the ingame host?
...and I really hope you've figured out that this question is rhetorical.

Well, here's where the Cheer Club comes in.

I appreciate the invitation, but I really just want to go to a game, relax and be consumed by baseball. It's weird that I can feel more involved as a baseball fan watching a game at home that actually at a game.

Some additional articles:

From today's Sun
- Rutsey's piece on a maturing Hinske
- Rutsey's daily Jays roundup
- a rave review of Paul Godfrey, with some insights into the Delgado contract situation

Geoff Baker has his own Jays roundup.

Buck Martinez tops Alan Schwarz's list of best catching plays for espn.com.

And for some news on the minor league camp, Jack Bogaczyk of the Daily Mail has an update, focusing on Allay Cat outfielder David Smith. Bogaczyk also has information on Charleston's future with the Jays organization.

That's all for now...

If Griffin says it, it must be wrong - ergo there will be no question marks in the starting rotation.

Am I the only one who caught this? Scroll down to the "If you liked Moneyball..." box near the end of the article.

Congratulations Craig. Dare I say, is this a first for Batters Box?

YIKES!!! Gay Day!! UGHH! I've got tickets to that game, but there's no f...... way I'll be going.

- The Jays are down 3-1 after two innings. (The game strated at 12:05 to allow Tampa to fly out to Japan later.)
- Hermansen (leading off) doubled and scored for the Jays in the top of the first.
- Justin Miller, needing another strong outing to stay in the rotation mix, gave up two long balls in the bottom of the first.
- Russ Adams, making the surprising start at short, made a throwing error to allow the third run in the second inning.

(By the way, one of the latest baseball prospect sites to catch my eye, Diamond-Futures, looks good (I'm not sure about the content yet though).)

Today's game can be heard for free at www.620wdae.com/listenlive.html

Norm, I'll buy your June 25th tickets from you. craig@battersbox.ca

Top 4th begins, still 3-1 Jays. Victor Zambrano forces Myers to ground 4-3.

http://bluejayscheerclub.com
Norm, that's also Delgado's birthday! Don't stay home.

5-1 Rays now. de los Santos gave up two runs, one not his fault, as Cat and Gomez messed up a cutoff to let the runner hit second - he scored on a single.

Hermansen just flied out to the warning track with two on. One out now.

Oop, double play. So mid five, 5-1 Tampa.

http://www.sportsline.com/mlb/story/7206052
Urbina has just signed for one and a option with the Tigers. COMN

With Rodney still hurting the move makes some sense, but jeez that will be an expensive 65 wins for the Tigers.

Congrats fellas on the ESPN link...

http://www.foxsports.com/content/view?contentId=2260288
Here's a link to Fox Sports that rates the Jays minor league talent as the best COMN

First time doing this so we'll see if the link works.

Gay Day!!

I think this is a really courageous move by Godfrey. If it gets us new fans and new sponsors, so much the better. More broadly, it continues to demonstrate that the Jays, among baseball teams and among Toronto sports franchises, are willing to think outside the box and work hard to earn fan loyalty and business.

If anyone is nervously holding tickets to that game, I strongly doubt that the promotion will be to the effect of "First 25,000 fans, like, totally become gay."

And there's NO WAY any in-game festivities could possibly be more uncomfortable than Dr. Evil Night. I still have Gord Ash nightmares, years after attending that debacle.

If anyone is nervously holding tickets to that game, I strongly doubt that the promotion will be to the effect of "First 25,000 fans, like, totally become gay."

Unless they're having fun.

I'll be there for the the French Tickler giveaway or is that went the Expos come to town?

I agree with Mike D. Except I kind of liked the Dr. Evil thing.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=neel/040325
RE: The ESPN link. In case you haven't seen it...

IF YOU LIKED MONEYBALL
Check out the statistical analysis of college hitters and pitchers available now from Craig B. at Batter's Box.

Congrats, Craig and Da Box.

I think this is a really courageous move by Godfrey.

I completely agree, though I find it strange that it isn't mentioned among the 'Special Events' in the pocket schedule the Jays are distributing. The event was mentioned on the web site months ago, yet no mention in the schedule like, say, the Spider-Man weekend is.

Also, considering the debate about the new unis that has gone on in this thread, maybe the Jays can solicit some Queer Eye for the Straight Guy type input on the new look.

I remember some talk last year in the Box about the Jays encouraging their players to become metrosexuals in order to appear more hip. I imagine this just follows those lines. Personally, I have no problem with a Gay Day at Skydome. However, I can't condone the metrosexual lifestyle--having sex with cities, that's just appalling.

Hey, a trade! Expos send Randy Choate to Arizona for John Patterson.

That Primer preview was bizarre - some very shallow analysis, and a glaring lack of familiarity with the team (Gomez probably won't make the team?) and some downright head-scratchers (LF will be a huge drop-off this year.. from Stewart and Cat to just Cat?)
I'd expect more from Primer.

And another trade -- actually two. Juan Cruz to the Braves and Mike Lamb to the Astros, who continue to collect ex-Yankees.

"First 25,000 fans, like, totally become gay."

Free Gay with every ticket.

On another note, Cheer Club Sign for June 25th:

COME OUT OF THE CLOSET ALREADY, CARL

If anyone has a picture of 50 cent wearing the Blue Jay cap, I would really appreciate a link to it,

Thanks