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Congratulations to Team Canada, which qualified for the Athens Olympics next summer. Our home and native land took part in 1988 when baseball was a demonstration sport in Seoul, but this will be our first chance at a medal. I hope their major league teams allow some of our key players to participate next summer. In the Sun this morning, Bob Elliott has a game report; pitcher Mike Johnson was backed by four home runs to an 11-1 win over Mexico. Twins prospect Justin Morneau of B.C. had five of Canada's 17 homers in the tournament.

There has been considerable recent discussion of international baseball in our Big Games? They're All Big Games thread, including the news from Jabonoso that MLB is planning the first World Cup of baseball in 2005. I'd also like to thank our Panamanian correspondent Evair Montenegro for live reports on the key games from the qualifying tournament.

The reaction in the U.S. to the American team's failure to advance is interesting -- "baseball's homeland does not regard Olympic baseball as much of a priority, or any priority at all," says Mike Bauman on MLB.com, which hasn't bothered to post a report about Canada and Cuba earning Olympic berths. For them, the tournament seems to have ended with Mexico's upset victory on Friday.
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robertdudek - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 10:28 AM EST (#86229) #
Coach beat me to this posting, so I've moved my comment here:

Surprise, surprise. With the elimination of the mighty Americans, the door opened a crack and Canada took advantage. They destroyed the Mexicans 11-1, who had edged out the U.S. in the quarterfinals.

The utter injustice of selecting only 2 nations from the Americas to participate makes the Olympic baseball tournament a sham. It would be like the World Cup (of soccer) including only 6 European nations (presently about 17 make it). After Cuba and Japan, Canada must now be considered a favourite for a medal with Australia, Taiwan and Korea the only other likely candidates.

This does not bode well for baseball's continuing status as an Olympic sport. A proper tournament would have 3 qualifying zones: the Americas (6 nations), Asia-Pacific (4 nations) and Europe+rest of world (2 nations). If that is too many, then we can have 4 from the Americas, 2 from Asia and 1 from Europe/rest of the world. The final spot would be decided by a playoff of 4 teams: the 5th and 6th place teams from the Americas, the 3rd place team from Asia and the 2nd place team from the Europe/World group. That would make the Olympics an 8-nation tournament.

Note also that "Pierre" LaForest homered for Canada. Blue Jays' minor league free-agent signee Josue Matos pitched for Puerto Rico in their loss to Cuba.
_Mick - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 10:49 AM EST (#86230) #
Actually, I think it bodes extremely well for baseball's future as an Olympic sport. If the USA waltzed to the Gold every four years, who would care? Which brings me to ...

For [MLB.com], the tournament seems to have ended with Mexico's upset victory on Friday.

Dah! If the USA isn't participating, it doesn't exist. Haven't you ever been to the great melting pot?
_Jabonoso - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 11:00 AM EST (#86231) #
Robert, the asian qualifyers are Japan and Taiwan, Korea's been eliminated. Four places for Asia are too many, two is just fine, they had Continental China as the fourth and looked awful. The one eliminated in the first round could win the extra berth in the second round. Four for our continent is all right providing a better way to eliminate the other four candidates.
Winning a medal is not a given but close, Taiwan and Australia are on the road to it. Cuba and Japan should win the other two medals.
i really hope that team Canada takes to Athens many of the awesome young pitchers: Loewen, Perkins, Francis and if available ( by whatever rules in practice then ) Harden. Authorities should push teams to know in advance they are planning with this guys on board and avoid getting answers as " he has too many innings already, sorry"
Felicitaciones!
robertdudek - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 11:29 AM EST (#86232) #
Jabanoso,

My zone would be Asia-Pacific and therefore would include Australia.
robertdudek - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 11:32 AM EST (#86233) #
I don't think the US would win a string of gold - you'd figure they'd lose a game or two to Japan, Cuba or one of the other strong clubs every so often. The very best players will likely never play in the Olympics which makes the tournament much more evenly matched.

It doesn't bode well because of the lack of good teams from the Americas that won't participate.
Craig B - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 12:51 PM EST (#86234) #
I haven't been around for a day or two. So this is my first chance to say

WHOOOOOOOO-HOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ATHENS, HERE WE COME!

This was a terrific tournament for our boys and a huge feather in the cap of Baseball Canada, who deserve all congratulations for putting together a fine team despite all attempts to stop them (in holding Adam Loewen off the team, Peter Angelos and Beatagan have mortared other brick in the wall of my disgust for the Orioles). This team will be a serious medal threat against a weak field in Athens, and with Cuba very likely to be in the opposite pool, we could easily see this team in the gold-medal match.

It was unfortunate that both semifinals were one-sided contests decided by the ten-run rule.

Incidentally, Baseball America has a terrific report on the game and the tournament. The sports section of the Globe & Mail today has a terrific picture of Stubby Clapp making a diving tag on a Mexican runner at second base... check it out! The pic alone is worth the 75 cents, and Jeff Blair has a terrific column on MLB's GM meetings in the same section.
_Cristian - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 12:57 PM EST (#86235) #
Does anyone else think that the U.S. not making it to the Olympics might factor into Roger Clemens unretiring?
_Dr B - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 03:23 PM EST (#86236) #
It does seem a sham that their are only two North American baseball teams at the Olympics given that baseball is essentially a North American sport; (but if it is a North American sport isn't that a reason *not* to have baseball in the Olympics anyway?)

These decisions are always political. Consider The World Cup (soccer). North America has something like three entries to the World Cup and there are only two half-decent soccer teams in North America. FIFA wants to make sure it gets the massive advertising revenues it gets if it makes sure that the US gets in to the World Cup.

You'd think the Olympics would want the US baseball team for the same reason. But clearly MLB doesn't care and the advertisers similarly won't care. What I really hate is the crocodile tears of Bud Selig. If the MLB wanted US baseball at the Olympics, they would be and they know it. Perhaps MLB don't want their stars to be drug tested...:-)
_Spicol - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 03:53 PM EST (#86237) #
(but if it is a North American sport isn't that a reason *not* to have baseball in the Olympics anyway?)

I tend to agree with what you're saying here but it could also be said that nearly every sport is in the same situation. Is Table Tennis really international? Does anyone care about Track and Field events like Europe does? Handball? Is bridge even a sport? Is curling?

Perhaps MLB don't want their stars to be drug tested...:-)

You jest, but I think you're on to something. That's likely part of the reasoning.
_Jays1fan1 - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 04:27 PM EST (#86238) #
Perhaps MLB don't want their stars to be drug tested...:-)

You jest, but I think you're on to something. That's likely part of the reasoning.


I know that a certain Canadian hockey player didn't make the Olympic team a few years ago for this very reason. You may remember it was a big deal that this player didn't make the team and there was a public outcry. My source was one of his team mates.
Pepper Moffatt - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 04:37 PM EST (#86239) #
http://economics.about.com
Is Table Tennis really international?

Yes, easily. When I lived in Maastricht, the Netherlands the local newspaper would carry table tennis tournament results, though they were always in like the very last page of the sports sections. I used to really love the sport and I ended up going to a tournament as a spectator. There were a few thousand of us there and competitors from all over the place, mainly Asian countries.

Mike
_Dr B - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 04:39 PM EST (#86240) #
I tend to agree with what you're saying here but it could also be said that nearly every sport is in the same situation. Is Table Tennis really international?

It's actually the #2 sport in the world (Thanks China!) and it is played in every country if not in a formal situation, but your point is well taken. Even if you (possibly) can make an argument for including Table-Tennis, you can pick a *lot* of sports that shouldn't be in the Olympics. I guess Baseball has as much right as other sports to be in the Olympics, but do we really need any more?

I know that a certain Canadian hockey player didn't make the Olympic team a few years ago for this very reason.

Whoah. I was indeed in jest. That's really sad, if it's true.
_Cristian - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 05:24 PM EST (#86241) #
I know that a certain Canadian hockey player didn't make the Olympic team a few years ago for this very reason. You may remember it was a big deal that this player didn't make the team and there was a public outcry. My source was one of his team mates.

That's why I didn't celebrate Canada's hockey gold until Theo Fleury passed his drug test. Really though, I don't remember anyone not making the team that probably should have--maybe Joe Thornton.
robertdudek - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 05:55 PM EST (#86242) #
I don't understand the idea that a sport has to be popular on every continent to be included in the Olympics. If that were the requirement, there would be no Winter Olympics and there might be only a dozen sports in the summer games.

Baseball is very popular on 3 continents and has professional leagues in every continent but Africa. As far as team sports go, it trails only soccer and basketball (and possibly volleyball and rugby) in global reach.

And it's not two teams from North America - It's two teams from THE AMERICAS. That includes the U.S., Canada, Mexico, Puerto Rico, Cuba, the Dominican Republic and Venezuela, all of whom have produced many major league caliber players. There's also Colombia and Panama that have produced some good ones.
_Jabonoso - Monday, November 10 2003 @ 06:03 PM EST (#86243) #
Drug testing and pro baseball are a big issue with the Olympic fed.
today in a mexican radio station one club owner was interviewed about the mexican team players selection and the very poor performances by many ( one should expect the same answer as usual: well the winter league is already on sched and so on ) but his answer was naively and plainly: many players are scared to death because of drug testing ( Mexico lost its bronce from the last Panams because a very seldom used pitcher refused to test again after a positive ). Of course after this big true, retorted saying: well, it is not that they are addicts, even caffeine is a big deal for those guys, any muscular tear is helped to heal with medicines that are banned for other athletes that aren't on the same day in, day out schedule...
_benum - Tuesday, November 11 2003 @ 04:52 AM EST (#86244) #
#119610 Posted 11/10/2003 04:27 PM by Jays1fan1:

...

I know that a certain Canadian hockey player didn't make the Olympic team a few years ago for this very reason. You may remember it was a big deal that this player didn't make the team and there was a public outcry. My source was one of his team mates.


You may as well spill it now Jays1fan1. If you open a can of worms, you have to make sure there is (night) soil for them to live in...
Pepper Moffatt - Tuesday, November 11 2003 @ 08:07 AM EST (#86245) #
http://economics.about.com
It was me! That's the real reason I was left off the Olympic Hockey Team. It isn't due to my glaring lack of talent!!

Speaking of being left off, I've heard all kinds of rumors about why Jeff Reese replaced Mike Vernon in the '92-'93 playoffs for Calgary against the Kings. I'd be curious what the real reason was.

Mike

P.S. I should be careful, because Mike Moffat (one t) was briefly the goalie for the Canadian National Team in the 1980's.
_Jays1fan1 - Tuesday, November 11 2003 @ 09:27 AM EST (#86246) #
I'd rather not post on a web site who this player was. I don't see how it could be good for me or this site. I'll only say that it wasn't a player that was left off this past Olympic team, it was a prior Olympics.

If you really need to know who this was you can email me at peterd@minit.ca
_pete_the_donkey - Tuesday, November 11 2003 @ 10:23 AM EST (#86247) #
I wish SOME network had the balls to show those qualifying games on TV...I think Sportsnet would probably get higher ratings than showing the same bloody episode of 'You Gotta See This' for the 800th time. Yes, I know the costs would put them at a loss, blah, blah blah...just wishful thinking on my part.
I would have been GLUED to the tube for the Mexico game.
_Jabonoso - Tuesday, November 11 2003 @ 12:15 PM EST (#86248) #
from the John Manuel article at BA it is important to note this:
COPABE ( PanAm Baseball Fed ) is a joke. It does not have a website, its tournaments are poorly run, etc, etc
Press coverage was also from poor to non existent.
I guess it is time for Canada's BB fed to participate and try to influence over an organization that is not working on its behalf and is run by some oportunists that are only worried about funds and
( their) salaries.
After this step, we may expect better run tournaments and better comercialization of such events and finally we getting there by internet, TV, radio whatever...
_Wildrose - Tuesday, November 11 2003 @ 02:11 PM EST (#86249) #
Simply a great achievement. I was crushed when our Men's basketball team did not qualify , but this helps me to get over the hurt. Given the primitive conditions, total lack of coverage, minimal financial consideration...great for the team.

I'm a little concerned however, with the Olympics going from August 13th-29th , just who will be available from this squad in Athens? Hopefully MLB executives can see the value of having their prospects compete in a high pressured environment and make our players available.
Coach - Tuesday, November 11 2003 @ 04:34 PM EST (#86250) #
Hey, we're not completely ignored in the States. Seth Stohs, a Minnesota blogger and big Justin Morneau fan, offered a look at Team Canada on www.sethspeaks.net today.
_SethSpeaks - Tuesday, November 11 2003 @ 06:26 PM EST (#86251) #
http://www.sethspeaks.net
Thanks for the mention. I live 6 miles from Canada, and I noticed that there is very little mention of the Olympic Qualifying tournament anywhere. The only reason it's even been mentioned in the States is because they didn't qualify. If they had qualified, it wouldn't have even been mentioned. I think it's unfortunate. There are some good players, players who deserve the recognition, on both the USA and Canada teams. So many play ball in affiliated leagues.
Anyway, I hope you enjoy it. It's nothing too deep, but at least gets their names out there. If you like it, please feel free to comment or ask questions or anything!
thanks!
_Jabonoso - Wednesday, November 12 2003 @ 05:22 PM EST (#86252) #
Today's mexico city press tell the story that the US fed called the mexican fed that there is a possiblity that: either both countries will go to Athens ( having a ten teams tournament they are negotiating ) or that there could be a classifying match up between the two if they "convince out an european or african country" sic and re-sic...
they most be thinking in Mexico because: finished in third place and eliminated them.
and they are thinking in themselves ( ahead of Puerto Rico ) because they are champs in reign ( or because they have the H bomb or whatever ).
Commercially wise it makes sense, fair play wise i want to #"%&=?¿ and other expletives.
Craig B - Wednesday, November 12 2003 @ 10:54 PM EST (#86253) #
Well as defending Olympic champions, the U.S. should really be going automatically anyway. But for fair play reasons, man... that's awful.
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