Batter's Box Interactive Magazine - Notes : A Star Is Born

We were discussing crappy "All-Stars" in yesterday's Notes thread, and I thought I'd take a shot at compiling a preliminary list of some really pathetic All-Stars from the last thirty-five years. Here they are:


Duane Josephson, 1968         Kurt Stillwell, 1988
Joe Azcue, 1968               Tim Laudner, 1988
Jerry Moses, 1970             Jack Armstrong, 1990
Richie Scheinblum, 1972       Neal Heaton, 1990
Ed Brinkman, 1973             Tom Pagnozzi, 1992
Dave Chalk, 1974-75           Scott Cooper, 1993-94
Steve Swisher, 1976           John Hudek, 1994
Wayne Gross, 1977             Ricky Bones, 1994
Dave Lemanczyk, 1979          Tyler Green, 1995
Jeff Newman, 1979             Jason Dickson, 1997
Ken Reitz, 1980               Ron Coomer, 1999
Glenn Wilson, 1985            Joe Girardi, 2000
Gerald Perry, 1988

Now those are some seriously mediocre players.

I thought the Expos' fan club showing up at the airport to welcome the Expos back from their 25-day road odyssey was a terrific gesture. I've never heard of the fans welcoming players back from a road trip before, certainly not where they didn't win a playoff series or clinch a pennant.

Last week's Rich Harden watch is on hold... Aaron Harang has solidified his grip on the fifth starter's slot in Oakland, temporarily of course, with a good start yesterday against the Giants (5.2 7 2 2 1 5, game score 51).

Melvin Mora's hand wasn't broken, and he's day-to-day. It looked for a while like storybook season was about to end.

There were four suspensions and two fines handed down by MLB as a result of the brawl during Sunday's Rays-Pirates game. (Best fine: Joe Kennedy was fined for coming onto the field while he was on the DL). You didn't hear about what happened? No wonder... it was a Tampa Bay-Pittsburgh game, even the players' mothers weren't watching.

Finally, a word on Jose Canseco : Moron.

OK, OK, I'm sure you all know I have more than one word on Jose. What has caught my eye more than anything else in this whole sordid saga of Jose's probation violation, is Canseco's newest business venture: apparently he is charging $625 an hour for fans to hang out with him at his house. Now as pathetic as it is to be juicing, as pathetic as it is to be juicing while on probation, as pathetic as it is to invent absurd claims about 85% of baseball players being steroid users, and as pathetic as it is to have Canseco's long rap sheet when life has given you everything, how much *more* pathetic is it to pay $625 an hour to just BE with a guy like Canseco? What sort of sad, twisted starf***ers would be lining up for a gig like this?

Anyway, soon his "fans" will get a chance to be with Jose for free, through the magic of Court TV.

Posted by Craig B on Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 07:23 AM EDT.

Notes : A Star Is Born | 17 comments | Create New Account

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_John N. - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 09:34 AM EDT (#13637) #

Good list. I'd add Mike Sharperson (LA, 1992).

Craig B - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 12:09 PM EDT (#13638) #

I don't know, John, I looked at Sharperson, but rejected him.

There are lots of guys like Sharperson, who weren't really stars, and who might not have even been regulars (Sharperson was never more than a platoon guy)... but who were nevertheless real good players with very useful skills. A lot of All-Star catchers are like this.

Sharperson wasn't a good defensive second baseman, but he carried a hell of a bat for a guy who could play second base, with terrific secondary skills. His adjusted OPS+ for the year he was an All-Star was 125, and he had years of 110 and 108 before that.

The guys above were never that good.

Craig B - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 12:10 PM EDT (#13639) #

Another example of a guy like Sharperson was Chris Cannizzaro, who wasn't really an All-Star but had some real good skills.

_Cristian - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 12:56 PM EDT (#13640) #

It would be interesting to see these guy's pre-allstar game numbers in the season in which they were chosen to play. As well, were they token picks from bad teams? I think Ron Coomer was and that's as far back as my memory goes.

_John N. - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 02:26 PM EDT (#13641) #

Craig,

Mea culpa. I assumed without doing any research that the other guys on the list were Sharperson-like, but, as you said, they weren't; Kurt Stillwell and Scott Cooper, to name two, never approached a 125 OPS+ in decent playing time. I think Sharperson sticks out in my memory because he didn't have a regular position and only got 317 AB that year, but you're right that he was clearly a better player than those other guys.

John

Craig B - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 04:41 PM EDT (#13642) #

A lot of these guys were guys with high batting averages for half a season, or had nine or ten wins at the All-Star Break, or guys who were actually good for half a season. But none of them were good players; I left off a lot of rookies who had good rookie years, becaue with a rookie you could legitimately make a mistake in thinking he was better than he really was.

Jack Armstrong, on this list, actually started that 1990 All-Star Game, he had a hot first half and had thirteen wins I think at the break. But he wasn't actually pitching all that well and of course was a lousy pitcher.

The worst player on that list is probably Tyler Green, who was absolutely a replacement-level player. I don't think there are any other guys on that list who were acutally replacement-level players for their entire careers. Even the worst players, the Ricky Boneses, Richie Scehinblums, Dave Lemanczyks, and Tom Pagnozzis, actually had some value.

_Donkit R.K. - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 05:28 PM EDT (#13643) #

I haven't been a real big baseball fan until last season, so I'm unfamiliar with most of these guys. The thing that caught my eye was Scott Cooper making two consecutive teams. Explain what the rationale behind that was. Did he actually have hot first halves (like Lidle's tendency to have hot second halves)?

_Spicol - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 06:11 PM EDT (#13644) #

The worst player on that list is probably Tyler Green, who was absolutely a replacement-level player.

Well, he's the worst player in hindsight. At the time, he earned his spot. He had a 8-4 record with a 2.81 ERA at the break as a rookie in 1995. Since that was a shortened season, 8 wins was among the league leaders. It was his second half that killed him. But, he was pitching with a torn rotator cuff or labrum, one or the other, and really should have been having surgery instead of "sucking it up" to play in the AS Game. The decision obviously wrecked his career. In my mind, he had All-Star talent and legitimately deserved to be there.

Scott Cooper, on the other hand...oy vey. IIRC, he was indeed a first half hitter. It was an empty but high BA that got him the nod both times. But he didn't ever hit for power (he hit 9 HR in all of 1993) and wasn't anything special in the field. But that's not the truly ugly news in my mind. He was the only Red Sox rep in both 1993 and 1994. Cito dissed Mo Vaughn, Roger Clemens, Jeff Russell and Mike Greenwell, any of whom had more star power and in one of the years or both, had stronger cases to be there than Cooper.

Craig B - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 06:14 PM EDT (#13645) #

OK, I had a real long comment on Cooper prepared, then I realized it would work better as an item in tomorrow's "Notes" than here. Look for it tomorrow morning.

The answer is... I don't know why, but the AL manager being Cito Gaston seemed to have a lot to do with it.

_Gwyn - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 06:23 PM EDT (#13646) #

The converse question to the worst all-stars is another interesting one...

The best players never to be all stars.

I remember having this debate some while ago but Kirk Gibson is the only name I remember

On the Scott Cooper question - lets not forget those were some pretty lousy Red Sox teams. They were under .500 both years and the Rocket was not having his best times. Danny Darwin was probably their best pitcher in '93. Vaughan was of course far more deserving than Cooper of an All Star spot but he was stuck behind Fielder and Olerud, and in Cito's bad books.

There must have been something about Scott Cooper, I read somewhere that the reason the infamous Bagwell for Anderson trade happened was the Sox front office considered Cooper a better prospect than Bagwell.

Craig B - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 06:24 PM EDT (#13647) #

My memories are from later with regard to Green... in 1995 I was on strike after the '94 breakdown had put paid to the Expos' postseason berth.

Spicol is probably correct. After 1995, he was not a very good pitcher, but he may well have had tremendous talent before. It should be noted, though, that he took his sweet time in arriving: five years in the minors is not the typical profile of a true "star".

_Bill Sinkins - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 08:41 PM EDT (#13648) #

The master list at the top is certainly a testiment to overall mediocrity. What about the subset (or would it be a superset?) of recognized "star" players who get into the all-star game while having an unimpressive season? I'm reminded of the foofarah over the fan nomination of Reggie Jackson in 1983 and '84. He was injured in '83, and was voted in as an outfielder in '84 despite the fact that he had only played at DH all season (and was having a lousy year anyway). IIRC the "star" outfielder misplayed at least one easy hit. I hope I'm not the only middle-ager to remember that :)

Bill

_Jonny German - Saturday, June 21 2003 @ 11:35 PM EDT (#13649) #

All generalities are wrong. I should have kept that in mind before I helped touch off this discussion with I'd like to see a lineup of the "worst" All-Stars of all time, and I'll argue that every one of them was a star in some sense of the word. As discussed in the previous thread, I don't have a case for Cooper as any kind of star and can only plead insanity... Cito's. As noted above and in the previous thread, there were some reasonable Red Sox candidates that Cito passed over in both years.

I have no desire to go through the list above and find out if I'm way off base on any others as well, because that's not going to change my mind or anybody else's. I'm uninspired by the All-Star game, but I don't feel that it's purpose is to inspire established fans like myself. It's purpose is to inspire the casual and non-fans, and I think the current setup is fine for that purpose. My interest level in the game itself would increase only marginally if I believed it to be a true selection of the best players. Some of you will not share that sentiment, but all of us sabremetrically inclined fans will continue to enjoy baseball no matter who goes or does not go to the All-Star game.

In fact, I think I would enjoy baseball less if sabremetric thinking was dominant. What fun is it to agree and go along with what everybody else is saying?

Craig B - Sunday, June 22 2003 @ 12:00 AM EDT (#13650) #

Jonny,

I hope you didn't take this list as a attempt to hammer on the same point again. I was just tickled by how many truly uninspiring players have been named, that's all.

I do agree that I like swimming against the tide rather more than with it.

Craig B - Sunday, June 22 2003 @ 12:00 AM EDT (#13651) #

_Jonny German - Sunday, June 22 2003 @ 03:27 PM EDT (#13652) #

Not at all Craig, no worries.

Craig B - Thursday, June 26 2003 @ 01:33 PM EDT (#13653) #

AHA! Finally found the numbers I was looking for, re Tyler Green

The claim that Green "had All-Star talent and legitimately deserved to be there" [in the 1995 All-Star Game] isn't quite substantiated by what Green had done in his previous two years... almost all of which he spent at AAA Scranton. The numbers:

1993 : 30 G, 16 GS, 128.2 IP, 4.13 ERA, 55/102 BB/K
1994 : 27 G, 26 GS, 162 IP, 5.56 ERA, 77/95 BB/K

No way that that guy comes into the bigs with a (very) hot first half and is a legitimate All-Star, but that's just in my opinion.

Wish I had the 1995 splits, but I bet it was a hell of a first half.

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