In the 1980's, Bill James challenged the notion that players were coming to the majors at a younger age, with less minor league experience than their predecessors. His study showed that this sentiment -- often held by retired players decrying the state of the present day's game -- was a pile of malarky.

I'd be surprised if a study today revealed that things have changed any and that players are coming into the major leagues at a quicker rate, as Tosca alleges. Some might counter with the notion that some young players are not only not rushed to the majors, but are actually held back, to slow down the start date on their service time (to stave off arbitration and free agency).

The only reason that average time in the minors might be decreasing is due to the growing number of players who get their minor league training on college ball fields. But I doubt that players, on average, are reaching the majors at a younger age than they have in the past.

Consider the Blue Jays' young players.

Hinske, Hudson and Phelps were all 24 in their rookie seasons (in fact, Hinske turned 25 before the season was over). Werth was 23.

While not technically rookies in 2002, Wells was 23 and Woodward was 26.

None of the aforementioned were rushed to the majors and it's not clear that at age 24, Werth will be in the majors in 2003, at least not to start the season.

It is true that Tosca is tasked with forging a team out of a number of fairly inexperienced players, all arriving at the same time. But they are certainly not exceedingly young nor have they reached the majors any sooner than they might have in any other time in the game's history.

It may be, however, that more players are coming to the majors with less minor league service time, since a large number of players play college baseball for two, three, or four years instead of going pro out of high school.

Of course, this is counterbalanced by the large number of international (mostly Latin) players who sign at 16 and play seven, eight, or nine years in the minors.

It may be, however, that more players are coming to the majors with less minor league service time, since a large number of players play college baseball for two, three, or four years instead of going pro out of high school.

Er, yeah, I said that.

But specifically, with regard to the Jays, none of Wells, Phelps, or Werth went to college.

Hudson and Woodward went to junior college. They hit the minors at ages 20 and 19, respectively.

Hinske went to college and reached the minors at age 20, turning 21 in his first minor league season.

Certainly Hinske has required and benefited from training at the major league level. Are any of the others receiving training that they should have otherwise already received?

I respect Tosca but am still curious about the genesis of his statement "Players are coming into the major leagues at a quicker rate, and you have to continue to teach." This sounds like a mere repetition of the old chestnut that's been said for half a century.

I concur that the young Jays do require instruction at the MLB level, but has this ever been otherwise?

Chuck... whoops, I didn't even see that! Heh. Mornings.

You're right. It hasn't ever been otherwise.

Just for the sake of neatening up the discussion, let me point out that saying that 'Players are coming into the major leagues at a quicker rate' is not the same as saying 'Players are reaching the major leagues at a younger age'. The first statement could just be referring to increasing turnover (something that may actually be true when it comes to the Jays) and not a shortening of development time.

I admit to not having been entirely sure what Tosca meant given his strange choice of wording, but I made the leap to the 'younger age' interpretation based on his subsequent remark about having to continue to teach.

If, in fact, turnover is the issue that Tosca was referring to, why would acquiring another organization's players necessarily entail coaching? Is there a presumption that players from other organizations have been poorly coached? Or is there a need to learn Tosca's way of doing things regardless of who you are, how old you are and where you have come from?

Matthew, if we go with your alternate interpretation of 'a quicker rate', then Tosca's next remark seems like a non-seqitur.

Now that Agegate has added years to a number of Latin players, I'm going to argue that players on the whole are much older now than in the golden age that ended 2002.