An interesting choice, if he is indeed the choice.  Under him in his 3 full seasons the Jays were 8 games below their pythagoran record year one, 1 over year 2, and 4 under year 3.  A very inefficent set of teams. 

His pens were very good, but was that due to his management or the advantage of having Roy Halladay go ever 5th day, eatting innings like mad?  The roation was helped by getting good years out of Josh Towers, Chacin, and Litsch which is a good thing. The Frank Thomas & Hillenbrand messes were negatives.  A lot of that might be on the GM for getting those guys in the first place though.

In the end it'll be interesting if he is the choice.  Lots of match making in the pen, someone who has experience but not a lot, and is in his 50's so not too old or too young for the job - ie: won't have players close to him in age but also won't be collecting a pension.

Gibbons had a generally good reputation as a manager.  His problem might have been more in team construction than in the managing.  But as AA has said in general about managers, he hopefully learned a lot over the last ten years and now will be a  better second time manager.

In case you are interested Coach interviewed Gibbons back in 2003.

 Here is the link to the "Gibbons fired, Gaston hired" thread.  There is more surprise in the hiring of Gaston than the firing of Gibbons but some, including our own Magpie, thought Gibbons was not at fault.  Keith Law is quoted in there as saying the firing was a desperate move by a desperate GM (that was in the Law, Ricciardi batling days).

I seem to remember that Gibbons seemed lost when it came to the running game. He was out-managed on the base paths.

I'm not sure what this means but if I did it would be something like number 10 on the list of what I'd care about.

I don't recall being pissed off by Gibbons so I guess that's a positive.

I don't believe single tickets go on sale until Feb. Flex Packs & Season tickets are on sale now though.

But, that being said, you can always ask for a Jays gift card for Christmas and use it to buy tickets when they go on sale.

I'm guessing Hargrove wasn't interested in the end.  He left his last team mid-season and that is a big red flag. 

The manager's job is to ...
A) put the best hitters on the field as often as possible
B) keep the rotation & pen in order to minimize injury risk
C) get all players onside with 'this is a winning environment and we will win'
D) provide upper managements views to the players and the players to upper management. 

Gibby seems a good choice for most of that, although C might be challenging based on Lilly & Hilly.  Nice thing is if things start to fall apart you always have Cito III in the wings.

From my view, the largest impact the manager has on the game is a) bullpen managment, and b) platoon arrangments and defensive alignments.  By all accounts, Gibbons is skilled at a), and seemingly receptive to b).  C) would probably be aggressive on basepaths and frequency of giving up freebie outs.  He's alleviated some of my concerns on that front already.

I'm on board.

I wonder if people aren't under-estimating the importance of the manager and GM getting along really well (perhaps even to the point of the manager being someone "the GM can control", as someone put it).  If a GM builds his team for contact and speed, and a manager is intent on playing for the long-ball, you're not likely to have a successful team.  Similarly, if the GM signs a lot of multi-inning relievers to allow a smaller pen and more position platoons (an idea I'd like to see), but the manager insists on pitching guys for two or three batters at a time to maximize righty-lefty split advantages, that pen's going to get burned out fast.  Of course, all the other factors need to be taken into account; you don't just want an unqualified puppet managing the team.  But I'd suggest that the most important factor really is whether the GM and manager are (and can remain) on the same page.  Otherwise, you may end up with a manager who says "Alright, if you insist on putting Kevin Millar on my roster, I'm going to play him.  Every day.  Including against right-handers.  Sometimes batting clean-up."

That being said, I was surprised when I heard his name mentioned this morning.  All I really remember of his time in Toronto was the fights, so I can't really say what I thought of him as a manager.  I'll trust AA's judgement on this one.  I guess I prefer him to Riggleman, Wakamatsu, or even Tracy, and it would have been tough to hire a rookie manager like Wallach or Alomar for a high-priced veteran team like this has become.  What seemed like a relatively simple decision a week ago bcame a lot trickier after what has happened since.

One last note: though he may have been ticked about being passed over again for manager, I wonder if Butterfield would have been willing to stay if he had known he'd be working with Gibbons again?  As some have pointed out, Gibbons may have been a bit weak in player development, so the coaching staff could be especially important.  I wonder if Mottola finally gets promoted?

I wonder if people aren't under-estimating the importance of the manager and GM getting along really well (perhaps even to the point of the manager being someone "the GM can control", as someone put it). 

I completely agree.  I think the GM and the manager being on the same page with the style in which they want the game to be played to be very important.  The message needs to be the same from the boss and the boss's boss, and so on.  The absolute last thing that this team needs is a Moneyball (the film) style GM-manager experience.

Goins + Jimenez added to the 40 man. McCoy, McDade, and Cory Wade DFA'd.

What is the process on the DFA'd players? They go through waivers and if they survive they're all now eligible to be taken in the Rule 5 Draft? Do they have the opiton of electing Free Agency or reporting to AAA?

"From the media this morning, it looks like Bobby Cox and Hargrove both turned them down, and they ended up farther down the list than they'd hoped."

Bobby Cox is 71 years old and recently retired from a team he managed for 20 years. And where did you read Hargrove turned them down? I highly highly doubt he ever would of.

The Jays were 30-26 on may 30 (a pace that would have led to 88 wins) and then they went on a 5-15 run which cost Gibby his job. of those 15 loses, NINE were by one run.

By my calculations, they were 31 - 26 after the win on May 30.  They played 17 games prior to Gibbons losing his job on June 20.  Their record over those 17 games in one-run games was 2 - 8.  If you assumed a .500 record over those one-run games, the Jays would have been 38 - 36 after Gibby's 74 games in 2008.  So may have avoided the axe, who knows.

The Jays rotation in May 2008 was Halladay, Litsch, McGowan, Marcum, Burnett.  McGowan lasted a couple of more starts after Gibby.  But the other four had strong seasons.

I did not see that coming. 

I was hoping for someone hispanic.  I guess he is familiar to the organization and they know what they are getting. 

Meh....

Fangraphs has an update on some prospects in Instructs. On Osuna....

If American, his age (turns 18 in February) would put him in this year’s prep draft class and, while I haven’t seen every top arm, he would likely be the top-ranked high school pitcher in the country.

I thought the same thing when I saw McDade's name. Which brings me back to my question: anyone?

What is the process on the DFA'd players? They go through waivers and if they survive they're all now eligible to be taken in the Rule 5 Draft? Do they have the opiton of electing Free Agency or reporting to AAA?

Also, would a Mike McCoy be the exact same as Mike McDade? Knowing that one has options and the other is out of them.

Adding Jimenez was a no-brainer.  Dropping McCoy was too. 

There was one spot for McDade, Goins or Wade.  From a positional perspective Goins as an infielder is more valuable.  From a rule 5 perspective a utility infielder or a reliever are more likely to be picked.  McDade has value but most teams have lots of choice at DH and 1B.  It is tough for a kid to break in at those positions.

All of this is another way of saying that McDade might be a better prospect than Goins but Goins is more likely to be taken in the rule 5 draft.

Really disappointing to see the Jays drop McDade from the 40 man roster.  The guy just turned 23 last May.  Switch hitter, good fielder, has shown good power (54 HR's in 1,413 AB's the last 3 seasons), started to draw some walks last year, getting the OBP up to .360 for the season.  I think he's going to have a good career.  Almost certainly for somebody else now.  In my book, he's always been underrated as a prospect, due to people not making proper allowance for his age compared to the level he was playing at.

Gibbons??  He's the best they could come up with?  Yikes.

The Jays are banking on another spike in attendance to help offset some of the salary they've taken on and it's believed MLB's new national TV deal with Fox and TBS will begin providing teams with up to an additional $40 million in annual revenue, beginning in 2014.

Neither factored in to ownership's willingness to sign off on the payroll increase, according to Beeston, adding it's not the first time Rogers has given him the green light on a big deal.

"We've had opportunities in the past, we've gone to them and said this is what we wanted to do, we would have gone over our budget, but it didn't happen because the deal didn't go through, and so nobody knows about it," he said.

"The fact of the matter is we're getting the benefit of the dollars (Rogers) gave us when we actually started putting money into the minor leagues," he explained. "(Adeiny) Hechavarria was a big signing. We could have got (Aroldis) Chapman. I mean people forget about the money we were given to carry out the philosophy that Alex had which was to build the minor leagues."

With holes still to fill in the rotation and middle infield before the season begins, the question now is whether the Blue Jays plan to keep spending.

Maybe a little, but if they do, it likely won't be through signing a free agent to a long-term deal.

"I don't think that's the intention to expand (payroll) too much more, we've gone up the way we are," said Beeston, quickly adding, "but if it was going to make the team a better team, the answer to that is yes."

I think it's worth remembering that we often, as fans, make judgements without all the information. It's possible he's lying but there's no reason to assume he is, when he says this sort of spending could have happened before if the right opportunity (in their judgement) arose, or that they did in fact approve such a spike but proposed deals feel through and the fans never knew.

What we see is not always the whole story.

Source.

(as an aside, i don't know where Cormack gets the claim that there are "holes still to fill" - reports suggest that AA said to McCowan this evening that he insisted on Bonafacio, which doesn't sound like the passion you put out for a bench guy - it sounds like he's the projected 2B...and the rotation doesn't have holes, it just needs depth beyond the front 5 or 6 guys)

I regret this but I must definitely disgree with someone who's opinion I respect.

...and the rotation doesn't have holes, it just needs depth beyond the front 5 or 6 guys

If there was a choice, J.A. Happ would be our 6th Starter (Bullpen) because the new Pitching acqusition was a #1, a #2 or a #3 Starter and not a #4 / #5 Starter like Happ.   And I like Happ and think he'll be a good Pitcher.   As things are I just hope we get someone better than Happ as well as someone else to be our 7th Starter (Bullpen), because I never want to go through something like last year ever again.  A pitcher like Jenkins should be #9 or #10 on the depth list, but that might be to much to hope for.

 "holes still to fill"

Edwin should 1B/DH, with either someone better at 1B or someone who can play 1B and DH, but be better than Adam Lind.  That's a hole to fill, but I believe A.A. will keep Lind.

The problem with Lind, as I see it, is that he absolutely can not play against any LHP (pick any metric, and he's absolutely abysmal at it), which means at best he is a platoon worthy 1B/DH against RHP (and it's not like for his career he's destroyed RHP either, again, pick your metric and he's probably at best serviceable against RHP).  And he's a poor baserunner, and only adequate defender. 

The plus is, I suppose, that he's at least on the "more playing time" side of a platoon.  As weird as it seems, with the current roster would support a Davis/Lind platoon at DH (or put Davis in LF and have Melky DH for those days).  You could also commit to pinch hitting Lind with Davis any time a LOOGY comes in to get Lind later in the game.

Another problem of course is if Davis is DHing then you lose the benefit of having Davis off the bench, and you can't put him into the field or you lose the DH.

Lind is a bad bench player because the only thing he maybe does better than anyone else who could play his role on the roster is hit RHP.  Considering he is between below-average and useless at all other aspects of the game (defence, running, hitting LHP), you've got a problem.  I'd want my bench players to have assets that my starters don't have (Davis has speed, Izturis has positional flexibility)...and Lind's value seems pretty marginal at best.  Buck is a similar issue - his strengths are the same as JPA's strengths.  I assume that's why AA wanted to keep Mathis instead of Buck - with Mathis he adds defensive value over JPA.

Cooper hasn't shown any platoon split in the minors and just looking at his swing and approach that makes sense.  He would give you more flexibility in that you don't have to carry someone to specifically platoon with Lind.  I'm not saying that Cooper is all that great but I think he's a better stop-gap than Lind until they come up with someone better. (plus I like watching his at bats).

AA did confirm on McCown last night that they received more than $8M from the Marlins in the deal (including the $4.5M to even out the Mathis/Buck part).  I don't understand the Mathis/Buck part of the deal for the Marlins if they're throwing in cash unless they like that Mathis is signed for an extra year at low $.

Maybe he's angling for a job? Not every team will deal with his transport truck and family of dogs.

Re: rule 5 draft:

I believe that Ontario as a whole bans pit bulls, not just the city of Toronto.

Johnson appeared on Miami radio and said that his wife was at first upset about going to Toronto but felt better after talking to Frank Thomas' wife who told her that she and the kids would love the place.

There was a bill in Parliament to rescind the pitbull ban which died when Parliament was prorogued.

Are we sure Izturis was signed?  I see something on twitter from Rosenthal that it came about from a fake Cesar Izturis tweet.

At the very least, we needed depth, and he's cheap, and as I recall, a plus with the glove if nothing else. 

The nice thing with the depth is that we have 3 capable players for 2 MI spots, so we won't have to be utilizing the Mike McCoys of the world at the first day-to-day injury.

Before all the craziness went down I was hoping for Nick Swisher, but assuming it was going to take way too much money.

Now, I'm assuming the chances of that are even lower (although I am not really complaining), but he would be an absolutely perfect complement to this team.

I agree with those hoping, and suggesting, that Izturis isn’t needed on a major league roster. The versatility of Bonifacio has already been pointed out, but he should allow the Jays to need less infield cover than they have previously. Between Reyes, Maicer and Bonifacio, they can cover SS and 2B if someone is injured, regardless of who originally started the game at what position. This also holds true if Bonifacio makes the occasional outfield start, as he can move to the infield and Davis (or whomever) can come off the bench to play outfield.

The one scenario that would be problematic would be if Reyes (or another middle infielder) needed to be rested for a few days because of his hamstring and then another infielder went down with an injury or had to leave the game. In that case, the Jays would be a bit stretched, although a temporary solution to last them until the end of the game could be to move Bautista or EE to third, have Lawrie switch to 2B and have the remaining middle infielder play SS. That would be okay for a few innings and, given that the team’s affiliate is now Buffalo, they would be able to get a replacement, such as Cesar, ready for the next game if both middle infielders were still unable to play.

Veteran guys like Izturis are usually released at the end of spring training if the they don't catch on with the big club out of courtesy.  That way they can possibly catch on with another major league team.  I have a feeling he makes the team out of spring training.

Cooper should have one more option year.  He used up 2011 and 2012.

How about this solution to the Buehrle pitbull mess: set up an embassy somewhere in the Toronto area, giving Buehrle diplomatic immunity to house whatever animals he likes on his property.

Rogers could create its own country and have Buehrle live in their embassy.

I still think he's going to retire after perhaps one year with the Jays if he's not in a situation he finds comfortable.

I would think that he'd find $18M per year the most comfortable of all situations. I think he'll adjust.

I'm aware of that and I don't believe there are many players who would ever walk away from that, but it speaks to how much I believe Buehrle is (a) insane; (b) a maverick; or (c) stubborn ... that he would want to live his life by his own rules and not care how much he stands to lose.

He did talk once of retiring after 2013 when his kids would start school. Check this quote, “Once Braden starts school, I’ll be done 100 percent,” he said. “Once that happens, you can bet anything and everything I’ll be done.” Thus stating that he does not want to pitch beyond 2013. This was before he was offered a great and heavily backloaded truck full of cash by some fishy people.

Mind you, it's in a blurb sandwiched between stories about how the Padres wouldn't trade Mike Adams in 2011 and Andy Pettitte wouldn't be coming out of retirement that year (which was accurate). So you can't believe everything you read, but I'm still writing to watch out for Buehrle here. Hope he performs admirably, worried that he's not committed to fulfilling the contract here. Man's been lied to. How to ingratiate ourselves to him to make this all right?

Saw through that pretty easily, didn't you? I'd thought of laying it on thicker and stating that he pitched admirably here before.

He did talk once of retiring after 2013 when his kids would start school.

Buehrle may be a different type of animal altogether and be the type who can walk away before he is pushed out, but I'd have to see it to believe it.

When players talk about retiring it carries almost no weight with me. How likely is Buehrle to walk out in the midst of a lucrative contract when so many others at the end of their careers look to just stick around for $1M with anyone who'd have them? Players talk about walking away all the time but very few do it with anything left in the tank. Gary Sheffield talked retirement from the time he was in his 20s and then only retired at 41 when no one wanted him any more.

And then you have guys who have retired but can't seem to stay retired.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Izturis the elder make the team. The team may think it can ease the wear on Reyes' hammies by letting him DH a bit, especially at home.

I agree with this being a strong possibility. It would be one thing if Reyes just had a single year left on his contract, in which case you wouldn't worry too much about babying him. But the organization has to coax five more years out of him. Caddies will be at the ready.

That's the pessimism I like to hear. While it is nice for Buehrle's agent to say that his client is going to be professional about things, that's not the ringing endorsement of his own commitment that is going to make me relax about the guy. Ideally, I want to see him give three solid years to the team. Honestly, I can't bring myself to expect he's going to do it. Show me a quote from Buehrle where he says himself that he's looking forward to being a part of a winning club with Toronto for the next three years and I won't doubt his commitment with a single word. It's not much to ask of the guy, but as of today I wonder if that quote is on its way.

I trust him to be a guy of his word; he strikes me as a guy of good integrity. If only I was more pessimistic about his character, I wouldn't accept the rumbles he's made about the importance of home and family to his life as absolute truth for him. And unless his home and family are going to set up near Toronto (and he may warm to the idea, but I'm not taking the chances as better than 50-50) then he's going to pack up and leave one way or another.

But if he makes a statement of clear commitment to playing in Toronto for this year and the next two, then hurray! No way Mark is going to lie to us. That's for Floridians.

I call it a boundary because I couldn't find a word more appropriate.   Numbers like 80s, 90s, 100s, 110s, 120s (and so on) are natural "boundary" numbers, while 85s, 95s, 105s, 115s, 125s (and so on) are not, being "artificial".  I believe A.A. got an increase in his "Budget" to cover naturally occuring salary increases, plus 10 - 15% for normal signings.   With the massive intake in salary, I don't know where the "boundary" is because I don't know when the "new Budget" level was.  He still has the ability to sign a $15.0 MM / year player as I can't find anyone saying A.A. has limits, now.

Thanks Thomas.     If the Demarlo Hale signing as Bench Coach is accurate, this is a big acquisition in ability and an big upgrade too.   As long as A.A. and J.G. are hiring the best people for Coaching openings, this could be amazing.   It will be very interesting following this.

MLB gets a percentage of all Postseason Games, but I don't know the exact number.   The Rogers Center (Skydome) can seat 50,000+ if necessary.   Average ticket price in 2012 was just under $25.00 per ticket.   Average Postseason ticket price will average $100.00 per ticket and huge amounts for Luxury Boxes.   So Teams could earn approximately $5.0 MM per game on tickets and possibly more on Boxes.   I believe MLB takes most of the World Series monies.   The monies taken throughout the Postseason compromise the Playoff Pool.  All Postseason Teams and all 2nd Place in Division teams get a piece of the pool.   When a Postseason Game with Tickets, Boxes, Refreshments, Souvenirs can earn a Team in excess of $10.0 MM per game, or $20.0 -$40.MM per series, it's easy to see how salaries get high.

Consider $50.0 MM in Postseason monies, plus $40.0 MM (in negotiation) in new MLB TV contracts, plus local Team TV contact ($25.0 MM - $125.0 MM), plus normal revenue streams ($50.0 MM - $125.0 MM) in determining Club Salary limits.  It's possible that $120.0 MM becomes the new $80.0 MM. 

As to why A.A. should go after a #1, or a #2, or a #3 Starter ( http://www.minorleague.com/2012/8/7/3226335/defining-1-2-3-4-5-starters ) rather than a #4/5 Starter, let's look at J.A. Happ ( http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/h/happja01.shtml ).  2009 was a good year for him, with 2010, just a little less so.   2011 was unfairly a lost year and 2012 was much of the same.   Until his last 4 starts, where it looked like he was figure it out, just a few months shy of his 30th Birthday.  I think we must do better.

I would like for a Front-line Starter (or at least a # 3) to be added so J.A. Happ can be in the Bullpen as our 6th Starter / Long Relief.   I would like to see A.A. acquire another Happ-type Starter to be our # 7 Starter / Long Relief.   I would like A.A. to pick up at least one MLB Starter type for AAA (if not called up by 1st June - Free Agent) as # 8 Starter.  At least Brett Cecil, Chad Jenkins and Deck McGuire can move further done the depth list.  While I don`t know how well A.A. will do here, it should be easier to sign people now.

Unfortunately the Bullpen is starting to bother me.  Casey Janssen and Steve Delabar are locks, as is Sergio Santos.  1) Santos should/could be ready for Spring Training.  Brad Lincoln should be a lock, but 2) he still has an option left (giving A.A. options).   Esmil Rogers has a power arm, was excellent in Cleveland, but 3) isn`t that called a small sample.   Jeremy Jeffress has a power arm, attitude, 4) "control issues" and out of options.   Oh, and they are all RHP.   As for the LHP, Brett Cecil is a lock, he`s also out of options.   Aaron Loup has been effective, but 5) he stiil has options.  6)  If A.A. gets another Starter, J.A. Happ is a lock for the Pen.  7) Darren Oliver is a lock, but has he made a decision?

I think the team still needs a quality Reliever, or very good luck.   Untill 6) and 7) decides, we won`t know what we have and what we need.  Or how much depth is needed.

I disagree on the needing more bullpen arms, especially since adding another good SP adds Happ to the bullpen anyways.

I am not as sure. 

1) Is Darren Oliver returning?  I haven't heard anything as yet.  I hope he's back, it's a void to fill if he isn't.    2) Sergio Santos' Surgery on his Shoulder was basically a cleanout - a very easy operation.   He should be ready to Start the season in the Bullpen.  There's early problems if he's not ready early.   3) Brad Lincoln and Aaron Loup are good enough to make this team.  There are options remaining, one for Lincoln and two for Loup.  This gives the Team choices.    4) Esmil Rogers found himself in Cleveland, he's figured it out.   With his power arm, I hope so.     5) Jeremy Jeffress has a power arm, attitude, "control issues" and out of options.  Most of the time the Pitching Staff turns them into effective pitchers.   Just most of the time, not always.    

I see Janssen, Delabar, Happ and Cecil in the Bullpen.   Santos will join them - sometime - making five.   Mike Aviles was a worthwhile acquisition, so A.A. values Esmil Rogers highly and that makes six.   Who's number seven?  Is it Oliver, Jeffress or do we have to dip into Lincoln or Loup?   I'm not saying the Relievers aren't good pitchers; it's just that I remember last year.